A Training Idea That Looks Too Simple But In Reality It Completely Rules Despite What You May Feel About The Simplicity

You have made the crucial error of actually believing that the training Roger Bannister said he did was the actual training that he did.

On top of that, it was pretty evident from his Olympic performance that he lacked an aerobic base - the rounds of the 1500m killed his chances in the final. With a better strength aerobic base, the rounds would likely have not had this crippling effect.

Mileage is good. More mileage is better. Now how you want to do the workouts is up to you. 5-6 smaller less intense workouts might work for you. 1-3 might work for you. There are certainly pros and cons for each route. But the unarguable fact is that you need mileage. 50-60 miles a week is enough for developing kids, but past that, its not enough.

Evidence based wrote:

If you are happy with 2:05 800m and 4:10 1500m times at 38 years old then have fun and keep doing what you are doing.

You will plateau and will need to improve your aerobic base. Base building is key! I ran a 2:03 800m at 34y/o after training like you for a two years (previous pr was 2:12. Hit a plateau and ran about the same times for 4 years. Spent 4 months/year building a solid aerobic base (zero speedwork) following advice from a new coach. Two years later (at age 40) I ran 1:57.84 for the 800m and 3:58h for the 1500m.

Yes! Your routine worked for you but don\\\'t mislead others.

Sub 2:05 and sub 4:10 for me....waaaay under! :)

1:57 and 3:58 at 40 makes you famous. Hints.

Mislead???????????????? No sir. Reporting my experiences. That is what I am doing.

I never cease to be amazed at how 50-60mpw is so \\\"bad\\\" at letsrun. Many of the best middle distance runners in the world are much closer to 50 than 100. Letsrun folks will deny this. It just cannot be.

Even if Bannister was able to run 3:53 on a synthetic track he would be almost ten seconds back of today's top guys. I think that you are missing that this isn't ground breaking training you are advocating. Why do think today's El Gs and Morcelis don't train the way you are advocating or the the way Bannister trained. Simply because through decades of experience coaches and runners have found it not to be as effective.

kuntibollox wrote:

I never cease to be amazed at how 50-60mpw is so \"bad\" at letsrun. Many of the best middle distance runners in the world are much closer to 50 than 100. Letsrun folks will deny this. It just cannot be.

I never cease to be amazed at the endless stream of guys who have a few decent performances off decent low volume training and suddenly jump to the conclusion that they've stumbled across the holy grail of training theory, completely ignoring 30 years of world-record performances from something different. These people respond to any contrary claim with a persecution complex. "How can you attack me and my brilliant new training plan!"

You are just a poor misunderstood genius, I guess, just like "Powerrunning Richard" and Alex F. Better let Geb, Bekele and El G, Komen, etc. know that they got it all wrong. Maybe they can give back those world records

39 you misunderstand the basic premise here. oh well. nevermind. is a 4:04 guy going to train like a 3:30 guy.

myballsyourchin wrote:

39 you misunderstand the basic premise here. oh well. nevermind. is a 4:04 guy going to train like a 3:30 guy.

The principles of training to run your best are the same regardless of your final result. If the 4:04 guy wants to be his best (and maybe someday even become a 3:30 guy), then yes he should train like a 3:30 guy.

If he just wants to "do well" then there is not really anything to talk about. I thought all of this was based on the idea that we were trying to run our best, not just "well"

I have no problem with k's training plan as long as he's happy with it. but when he tells me "it rules" he should be a little less sensitive to contradiction.

39 wrote:

myballsyourchin wrote:

39 you misunderstand the basic premise here. oh well. nevermind. is a 4:04 guy going to train like a 3:30 guy.

The principles of training to run your best are the same regardless of your final result. If the 4:04 guy wants to be his best (and maybe someday even become a 3:30 guy), then yes he should train like a 3:30 guy.

If he just wants to "do well" then there is not really anything to talk about. I thought all of this was based on the idea that we were trying to run our best, not just "well"

I have no problem with k's training plan as long as he's happy with it. but when he tells me "it rules" he should be a little less sensitive to contradiction.

"It rules" for me. A slightly tongue in cheek term. A little less sensitive? That would be YOU hahahaha.

You are definitely a novice. 1:57 and 3:58 at the 800m and 1500m at 40y/o does not make you famous, maybe where you are from it does. Check out the best times in the world for the 40 year olds. Several years ago while visiting the United States, I saw the American Johnny Gray run under 1:51 for the 800m at 39 or 40 and just recently witnessed a 43 y/o 10k road runner split a 3:56 1500m while training, these guys are famous, not me or you!

Any 40 year old who run 1:57 and 3:58 is at the very top of North American distance running. Now someone go and find me a list that proves it.

M40 800 METER RUN

World Record: 1:50.69 Colm Rothery (IRL) 09/05/00

American Record: 1:52.42 Johnny Gray (CA) 6/24/2000

------------------ 1:52.5 Ken Popejoy (IL) 5/31/1991

All-American Standard: 2:06

1:54.4h TONY YOUNG (201*)

1:56.15 JOHN HINTON (295)

1:57.5h PETER HEGELBACH (263*)

1:59.42 ROD BROWN (179)

1:59.53 CHRISTOPHER POTTER (270)

1:59.8h KEVIN PAULK (405)

1:59.97 DAVID BAILEY (072)

2:00.62 JIM WATTS (270)

2:01.77 JON HOOGENSEN (090)

2:02.65 MIKE EGLE (442)

2:02.87 CHRIS SLABACH (344)

2:03.35 DAVID BYNOE (442)

2:03.4h DALE LONDOS (424)

2:05.14 VAUGHN KASTOR (492)

2:05.3h SCOTT LANDIS (285)

2:05.6h RUBEN ESPARZA (016*)

2:05.8h MARC NESBITT (372)

2:05.96 BRETT DARRINGTON (422*)

M40 1500 METER RUN

World Record: 3:46.7 David Moorcroft (GBR) 06/19/93

American Record: 3:50.85 John Hinton (NC) 04/05/03

All-American Standard: 4:24

3:50.15 JOHN HINTON (136)

3:51.58 TONY YOUNG (072)

4:01.87 PETER HEGELBACH (492)

4:06.99 DAVID BAILEY (170)

4:09.4h CONOR O'DRISCOLL (309*)

4:10.00 KEVIN PAULK (355*)

4:13.0h DALE LONDOS (333)

4:13.87 JOSEPH DUDMAN (355*)

4:14.97 MIKE EGLE (442)

4:17.72 KEN ERNST (404)

4:21.42 BRETT DARRINGTON (454)

4:21.70 LEN FERMAN (406)

4:22.18 DAN GONZALEZ (280)

4:22.60 IAN BROWN (377)

4:24.46 JEFF HONGO (378)

4:25.87 KIP JANVRIN (493)