I'm a little surprised they gave it to her over Jenna Hutchins, but what do you guys think? Do you think the fact that she's a senior and Jenna's a junior played a role? Who do you think deserved it most and why?
agc5k wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vG7bn2DkeOYI'm a little surprised they gave it to her over Jenna Hutchins, but what do you guys think? Do you think the fact that she's a senior and Jenna's a junior played a role? Who do you think deserved it most and why?
i dont think being a senior played a role, katelyn won this sophomore, junior, and her senior year
i think its the fact that sydney ran more cross country in a national level and did good.
yes jenna ran at fl nationals but her results in the national xc events that she attends aren't that great compared to sydney, yea jenna has the xc record but sydney has competed with the country's best on the most competitive meet in the country and did quite impressive (although not winning) .. jenna only competed with herself on her course record, and did just fairly on nationals
also personally, i think running in nike nationals gives you more points than running xc anywhere else because the competition there is just far higher, and although there was no nxn this year, i think they still considered that part in this years gatorade xc poy
but i think jenna will win the track and field girls player of the year
I was not surprised at all...Jenna was very deserving as well, but Syd simply ran in more competitive races. I would have had her as the handsdown favorite.
Well deserved! If you haven't seen her race, watch ... https://xc-town-usa-meet-of-champions.runnerspace.com/eprofile.php?event_id=14147&do=videos&video_id=301201
runnerexpert wrote:
Jedsdead wrote:
I was not surprised at all...Jenna was very deserving as well, but Syd simply ran in more competitive races. I would have had her as the handsdown favorite.
Let see what happens to Jenna Hutchins when she has to deal with competition, maybe nerves get the best of her which is why we haven't seen her seeking out competition like Syd has and now she is going to leave HS early and train in Florida instead of taking on more competition...the clock doesn't lie, Hutchins has put up some great numbers but we won't really know how she deals with competition until fall of 2022, also there is a lot of miles on those legs and how many very high-quality HS runners have we seen fade into the sunset...this situation needs time to develop before we really know...my money is on syd 2 years from now
Jenna has said she only runs 40 mpw and only runs 5 days per week, but does lots of cross training and strength training. Not sure how Syd trains by comparison. But given Jenna's very short compact stride, I feel like she has far less room for improvement that Syd.
It is a one year award. There was no FL or NXN last year. I think Sydney ran two national meets while Jenna only ran one last year.
Bullet the Blue Sky wrote:
Well deserved! If you haven't seen her race, watch ...
https://xc-town-usa-meet-of-champions.runnerspace.com/eprofile.php?event_id=14147&do=videos&video_id=301201
Yep.... that race in those conditions says it all!!!!!
agc5k wrote:
runnerexpert wrote:
Let see what happens to Jenna Hutchins when she has to deal with competition, maybe nerves get the best of her which is why we haven't seen her seeking out competition like Syd has and now she is going to leave HS early and train in Florida instead of taking on more competition...the clock doesn't lie, Hutchins has put up some great numbers but we won't really know how she deals with competition until fall of 2022, also there is a lot of miles on those legs and how many very high-quality HS runners have we seen fade into the sunset...this situation needs time to develop before we really know...my money is on syd 2 years from now
Jenna has said she only runs 40 mpw and only runs 5 days per week, but does lots of cross training and strength training. Not sure how Syd trains by comparison. But given Jenna's very short compact stride, I feel like she has far less room for improvement that Syd.
Differences in stride aside, I think Hutchins' lower mileage and younger age probably give her more room for improvement, not less. Either way, I'm confident that Diljeet Taylor will figure out the best way to develop her. I don't like to bet against Taylor.
Honestly, Hutchins broke all-time National record, MileSplit end of season #1, Fastest Speed Rating, Undefeated, Raced in multiple states, course/venue records all races, State record, State Champion, Higher GPA per press release, Won RL national, others could have raced her but did not. The bottom the young lady got screwed over big time. Very sad in my opinion. Probably one of the best role model spokespersons for high school girls who is very humble.
Checking stats Hutchins also broke three national records during fall season. One in XC and two in track and still didn’t win Gatorade National award. Very puzzling to me and somebody was looking out for the other girl who won.
could have ranked them 1b and 1a, that's an option proven popular previously
Hutchins got cheated that’s the way I see it. My daughter is a SR high school runner and she said how is that even possible. We are fans of both runners but I just don’t see how can someone break Katelyn’s record with all the other accomplishments and not win it? It did seem the HS media sites were pushing more for Sydney but have no clue who votes for this award.
Doesn’t make sense to me if the press release was correct. Hutchins even had higher GPA. At the end of the day it just really surprised me with not much credibility for Gatorade. Hate seeing this in high school sports for any kid if it’s that close.
These awards always emphasize national titles and head to head competition.
The NSAF meet seemed to be a national championship.
eric37 wrote:
Checking stats Hutchins also broke three national records during fall season. One in XC and two in track and still didn’t win Gatorade National award. Very puzzling to me and somebody was looking out for the other girl who won.
You realize the track records have no bearing on this? You could make a case for either of these two girls. Thorvaldson's two wins in major meets were as impressive as Hutchin's win. Not as fast, but tougher course and conditions.
The track records should get her the award for track and field, unless there is somebody else out there I have forgotten.
eric37 wrote:
Hutchins got cheated that’s the way I see it. My daughter is a SR high school runner and she said how is that even possible. We are fans of both runners but I just don’t see how can someone break Katelyn’s record with all the other accomplishments and not win it? It did seem the HS media sites were pushing more for Sydney but have no clue who votes for this award.
Give me a break! Hutchins did not get cheated at all!!!!! The obvious choice was Thorvaldsen. If she wanted to be the best she should have raced the best and raced Brown and Thorvaldsen at the National meet in Texas. Instead she chose a fast flat and supposedly short course with no Brown and Thorvaldsen to run a fast time that does not mean anything in CC. CC times are not like Track times, courses are all different. Hutchins may have a faster time in the books than Tuohy but there is no doubt at all that Tuohy’s performance was superior to Hutchins. That time on the course Hutchins ran was only speed rated a 167, Tuohy’s was a 176. Hutchins performance was not even close. Tuohy would have ran around a 15:30-15:35 on that course. Hutchins would have been over 25 seconds behind.
However, the point at hand and the facts are that Thorvaldsen ran two national meets on legit proven courses with better and legit competition and won big. Both of those national meets were speed rated at 168 which is higher than Hutchins one National caliber meet where she earned a 167 speed rating. Since she avoided Brown and Thorvaldsen, you can only go by their performances at the National meets and the speed ratings at those meets. Like other sports that go with strength of schedule if no head to head, same applies here. Thorvaldsen had a much more impressive resume!!!! And as FastTuohy said, track times are irrelevant for a Cross Country award. Gatorade got it right! Sorry.
Hutchins ran 24 seconds faster on the track 2 weeks later so if Tuohy could run 15:30 on that course, it would require a 15:06 on the track. Not saying she couldn't have done it, but that is really fast for a HS girl.
eric37 wrote:
Honestly, Hutchins broke all-time National record, MileSplit end of season #1, Fastest Speed Rating, Undefeated, Raced in multiple states, course/venue records all races, State record, State Champion, Higher GPA per press release, Won RL national, others could have raced her but did not. The bottom the young lady got screwed over big time. Very sad in my opinion. Probably one of the best role model spokespersons for high school girls who is very humble.
I truly don't discount your opinion on Hutchins...great runner and very deserving. But this was an XC award. Track results had nothing to do with it.
Straight up XC comparisons are very close...as I said, I felt Syd would get the XC award, but I was also following her season closer than Hutchins.
The real loss here is that we didn't get to see these two race each other during the XC season.
Either way though, both of these two are going to be studs going forward. I expect Thorvaldson to be a major force in College next year, barring injuries of course.
Pointer of points wrote:
Hutchins ran 24 seconds faster on the track 2 weeks later so if Tuohy could run 15:30 on that course, it would require a 15:06 on the track. Not saying she couldn't have done it, but that is really fast for a HS girl.
This is a silly discussion but I will weigh in where I should not. Your statement assumes Hutchins had her peak performance on both days, which is not a certainty. It also neglects the fact the she had a pacer, and then pacing lights on the track while on the XC course she had neither. However, I do think it is very doubtful Tuohy could have run 15:06 (~4:50/mile pace) since she was not that at that pace for even her first mile in the 5,000 m race she ran, and for that matter she never ran 9:40 for 2 miles. Using the speed rating to justify "Tuohy could have run XXXX" is think is way beyond it's usefulness. I think the reality is when Hutchins ran there were some pretty good runners in the field who ran fast which dragged down her speed rating, in a meet toward the end of the season, while Tuohy's run was very early in the season and the field was less strong. As I recall Bill said, on the easy course it is harder to get a high speed rating.