During my yearly physical my doc told me I should quit serious endurance training for marathons by the time I reach my mid 40s. He recommends this for anyone that is a serious endurance athlete. He said numerous studies, consistently demonstrate that the type of training that I do is a significant risk factor for two of the main types of heart disease and rhythm related heart issues. I should mix up my exercise and race only short stuff, like 1 mile to 5k.
He gave me some stuff to read and pointed me to this podcast for some basic info.
https://peterattiamd.com/jamesokeefe/
Anyone here been told the same thing by their doctor? Or read any of the research?
I am currently 37 years old and run 70-90 miles per week (was hoping to increase that to over 100) and have goals of breaking 70 in half and 2:25 in the marathon. I still have a ways to go to get there but those are my high end goals.
My doctor told me to give up training for and running marathons by my mid 40s.
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You mad, bro?
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Not mad. I was caught by surprise with his recommendation and it was not something I wanted to hear. Training and running for marathons is a huge part of my life and something I really love doing, so would be hard thing to give up. Obviously, I need to give serious consideration to what he said and what the evidence says.
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You should give up marathon by your mid 40s because the physical decline from aging makes it a dismal way to spend your time. There is little reward in going out and bashing your legs just to run a marathon 3-4 minutes slower every year.
But O'Keefe is a clown. The science of "exercise dosing" is very weak. If you look at the studies, they do not have a statistically significant sampling of fast runners who run high mileage. Instead, they lump sub 3 guys who run 70-90 mpw with people who run 4 hour marathons off of 30-40 mpw. Apples and oranges.
What we do know is that marathons risk exacerbating any heart issue you may have. If you want to run marathons in your 40s and 50s, you need to get regular heart screenings to make sure everything is good. -
You are aiming for a 2:25 Marathon, which is performance running. Any sport on performance level is not healthy. And you know that.
If you just run for pure health reasons run a 4 hour Marathon.
But we are runners, so that is not happening.
Overall lifestyle choices of a hard training runner should be still a lot better than Joe Normal who doesn't do anything.
I would say, don't listen to your doctor and keep running. -
Training hard and high mileage through my forties, I developed A-fib. Shifting to polarized training in my fifties (and not competing), and more importantly, changing my diet from high carb/plant-based to high fat/keto and now 100% carnivore, has allowed me to train exactly as I like, with no episodes or symptoms for over a decade.
O'Keefe is not completely off base. Three prominent long-term vegetarian marathoners all died in their 50s. Diets high in carbs and especially linoleic acid (found in plant oils) are a high risk for aging runners. There is no doubt in my mind, as a biologist, that animal-based eating is protective from many diseases of modernity, including cancer, CHD, Alzheimer's, diabetes, etc.. An increasing body of science supports this. -
Just follow the doctor/patient alcohol routine. Give him a number that is about 1/10 of what you actually run.
Doctor: Do you drink alcohol?
Patient: I have a beer or two on the weekends.
Doctor: So you drink at least 3 glasses of wine each night and triple that on the weekends?
Patient: Um... Yeah, that sounds about right. -
Frank Shorter here wrote:
You are aiming for a 2:25 Marathon, which is performance running. Any sport on performance level is not healthy. And you know that.
If you just run for pure health reasons run a 4 hour Marathon.
But we are runners, so that is not happening.
Overall lifestyle choices of a hard training runner should be still a lot better than Joe Normal who doesn't do anything.
I would say, don't listen to your doctor and keep running.
I’m about a year and a half out of college but I agree with this. Obviously significantly younger then the OP but I agree that any sport done at an extremely high level and for performance is not good for health. But it is better then not working out at all. If you like running and training keep doing it, it’s like people don’t constantly do unhealthy things they enjoy, like drinking and smoking. Training hard isn’t a bad vice to have in the grand scheme of things -
YMMV wrote:
animal-based eating is protective from many diseases of modernity, including cancer, CHD, Alzheimer's, diabetes, etc.. An increasing body of science supports this.
As long as the animals are organically fed and raised without antibiotics. Also, avoid burning/browning your meat and NEVER use a grill to cook anything. -
jvarunner wrote:
During my yearly physical my doc told me I should quit serious endurance training for marathons by the time I reach my mid 40s. He recommends this for anyone that is a serious endurance athlete. He said numerous studies, consistently demonstrate that the type of training that I do is a significant risk factor for two of the main types of heart disease and rhythm related heart issues. I should mix up my exercise and race only short stuff, like 1 mile to 5k.
He gave me some stuff to read and pointed me to this podcast for some basic info.
https://peterattiamd.com/jamesokeefe/
Anyone here been told the same thing by their doctor? Or read any of the research?
I am currently 37 years old and run 70-90 miles per week (was hoping to increase that to over 100) and have goals of breaking 70 in half and 2:25 in the marathon. I still have a ways to go to get there but those are my high end goals.
It's not bad advice, but I suspect that orthopedic risks are greater than cardiac risks.
And no, I don't have any research to back that up. -
Frank Shorter here wrote:You are aiming for a 2:25 Marathon, which is performance running. Any sport on performance level is not healthy. And you know that.
People act like it is common knowledge, but it's nothing but a totally unsubstantiated hypothesis.
What we do know is that physical activity, particularly aerobic physical activity, has unquestionable health benefits as compared to being sedentary. These benefits are undeniable up to a very high level of activity. There's also no suggestion that even extreme aerobic activity is worse for you than being sedentary.
So the remaining question is whether extreme levels of training (i.e., close to professional level) are less healthy than more moderate training. If this effect exists, it is almost certainly modest. This is a question worthy of study, but for a lot of reasons, the current research on the question is truly worthless. It's also very difficult to study because there's a limited population of people training at that level. It's possible that PED use is high enough among that population to skew research results. It's also possible that--if there is a statistically significant negative health impact--it's a result not of high level training but of overtraining, which is obviously far more common among people who are trying to push their limits.
turkey man wrote:
It's not bad advice, but I suspect that orthopedic risks are greater than cardiac risks.
This has always been my sense as well, but the research doesn't really support it. At the very least, running when done properly isn't inherently destructive to the body's structures. But insufficient mobility, training through injuries, and other training errors can definitely cause permanent damage. -
YMMV wrote:
Training hard and high mileage through my forties, I developed A-fib. Shifting to polarized training in my fifties (and not competing), and more importantly, changing my diet from high carb/plant-based to high fat/keto and now 100% carnivore, has allowed me to train exactly as I like, with no episodes or symptoms for over a decade.
O'Keefe is not completely off base. Three prominent long-term vegetarian marathoners all died in their 50s. Diets high in carbs and especially linoleic acid (found in plant oils) are a high risk for aging runners. There is no doubt in my mind, as a biologist, that animal-based eating is protective from many diseases of modernity, including cancer, CHD, Alzheimer's, diabetes, etc.. An increasing body of science supports this.
Prove it or back it up by science -
Spare Tire wrote:
Just follow the doctor/patient alcohol routine. Give him a number that is about 1/10 of what you actually run.
Doctor: Do you drink alcohol?
Patient: I have a beer or two on the weekends.
Doctor: So you drink at least 3 glasses of wine each night and triple that on the weekends?
Patient: Um... Yeah, that sounds about right.
God. We need an upvote ability. This is my POD.
How many of you lie to your doctor about your habits out of shame? -
rojo wrote:
Spare Tire wrote:
Just follow the doctor/patient alcohol routine. Give him a number that is about 1/10 of what you actually run.
Doctor: Do you drink alcohol?
Patient: I have a beer or two on the weekends.
Doctor: So you drink at least 3 glasses of wine each night and triple that on the weekends?
Patient: Um... Yeah, that sounds about right.
God. We need an upvote ability. This is my POD.
How many of you lie to your doctor about your habits out of shame?
Never. This would be something a very weak person would do. -
Tommy Hughes 60. Ed Whitlock mid 80s. Dan King 61 and runs 4:49 mile. The problem is not the training bit the western diet of high carbs sugar and chronic inflammation of most people. Those who’ve trained and raced at a high level previously ie collegiate and post typically do not have problems. Its the couch to marathon types who’ve no idea how to train properly who most typically have issues. Genetics plays an even greater role
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My pomologist is almost 70 and has completed over 100 marathons with a lifetime best around 2:30. Due to the aging process and additional recovery needed, he has reduced his training load to 4-days a week.
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rojo wrote:
Spare Tire wrote:
Just follow the doctor/patient alcohol routine. Give him a number that is about 1/10 of what you actually run.
Doctor: Do you drink alcohol?
Patient: I have a beer or two on the weekends.
Doctor: So you drink at least 3 glasses of wine each night and triple that on the weekends?
Patient: Um... Yeah, that sounds about right.
God. We need an upvote ability. This is my POD.
How many of you lie to your doctor about your habits out of shame?
Yes, please add a simple voting feature.
A simple up and down arrow is all you need. Newschoolers.com has a good system if you need inspiration. -
We ain’t in out for our health.
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Only if you eat meat eggs and dairy which clog up your arteries! Go vegan no cholestrol and a clean pumping heart. Most people over 40 start having heart disease problems it's the biggest killer in the world and add running to the mix and you will run into problems as you can't out run a bad idea. Your saturated fats and cholestrol diet will catch up with you like everyone else.
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[quote]Precious Roy wrote:
You should give up marathon by your mid 40s because the physical decline from aging makes it a dismal way to spend your time. There is little reward in going out and bashing your legs just to run a marathon 3-4 minutes slower every year.
So wrong! I'm running marathons at age 65 and I love it. There is great reward in pursuing age-graded times and crushing the competition. Never stop getting after it! Running is a fabulous gift, and training is a great way to use the gift -- the farthest thing from a "dismal way to spend your time".
