Don't tell me its due to the numbers! where we in the US have a larger base. The UK sprint coaches are rubbish!
How many are actually able to develop sprinters and not just get ones that are nearly there, and then never take them further?
male or female athletes across the events aren't really any good, the ones who are successful aren't with UK coaches.
Why?
First off, there are far fewer opportunities in the UK for coaches to work at that level. You have a better chance of playing for the Lakers than a sprints coach has of landing a coaching role making close to the average salary in the UK.
That aside, John Blackie has done a phenomenal job with Dina, who is ahead of anyone the US can offer at the moment. Jonas Doodoo is consistently doing good work with a range of athletes. Steve Fudge has a decent record too.
You can't just discount the population difference. The UK is 1/5 the size.
Another big factor is you have a massive sport that values speed. Our huge sport is soccer, which values being an allrounder in terms of physicality - no coincidence that a lot of decent soccer players were good MD runners. You guys have athletes playing college football and going to the Olympic trials, some making the games - Jeff Demps came away from London with a medal! It's unlikely you could even fill a heat at the English Schools senior boys 100m with Premier League soccer players who could achieve the entry standard, let alone threaten the senior British team. That lack of exposure to speed for anyone who doesn't train as a sprinter has a massive impact in reducing the pool from which GB is pulling its talent.
Linford Christie had great success - most notably with Katherine Merry and Darren Campbell. but has been - it seems - persona non grata in UK Athletics. I trained over the summer at one of the few tracks that were open in London and Linford was there every day I went. Whether it's working with his internationals or kids with no great talent he seems to have great rapport with his athletes and gets his ideas across really succinctly and clearly. It was a real inspiration, as an aspiring coach myself to see him working. Unlike many of his generation who earn their money on the corporate speaking circuit or appear as talking heads on TV, he is giving something back to athletics every single day.
(And to be honest, I was always slightly equivocal in my support of him as an athlete).
GGGG wrote:
First off, there are far fewer opportunities in the UK for coaches to work at that level. You have a better chance of playing for the Lakers than a sprints coach has of landing a coaching role making close to the average salary in the UK.
I'd be surprised if there are even 1,000 sprinters racing each year in the whole of the UK.
Schools don't do much to promote sport anymore so unless you realise you're super fast and join a club, it's not particularly accessible.
So if you've got a small sport then only a smaller percentage of those people get involved in coaching.
And that's before we begin to talk about how poor coaching standards / mentoring / pathways are in UK sport generally.
Uhhh wrote:
GGGG wrote:
First off, there are far fewer opportunities in the UK for coaches to work at that level. You have a better chance of playing for the Lakers than a sprints coach has of landing a coaching role making close to the average salary in the UK.
I'd be surprised if there are even 1,000 sprinters racing each year in the whole of the UK.
Schools don't do much to promote sport anymore so unless you realise you're super fast and join a club, it's not particularly accessible.
So if you've got a small sport then only a smaller percentage of those people get involved in coaching.
And that's before we begin to talk about how poor coaching standards / mentoring / pathways are in UK sport generally.
In 2019 there were 3665 athletes recording 100m times faster than the minimum standard for inclusion on the rankings. Anyone running school fixtures wouldn’t be included since their meets wouldn’t have licences. Almost every club has a waiting list for juniors, but the volunteer structure means there is a massive shortage of coaches
There are some fantastic coaches in the UK, but some dinosaurs that refuse to learn. I’m sure the same is true in the US.
Why even bother with coaches for the sprints? What are they going to say, "Hey, you, give me three starts and then go lounge around for two hours?" Sprinters are lazy and shiftless, but it doesn't matter because it is the most reliant of all sports on natural talent.
Sub 48F wrote:
Don't tell me its due to the numbers! where we in the US have a larger base. The UK sprint coaches are rubbish!
How many are actually able to develop sprinters and not just get ones that are nearly there, and then never take them further?
male or female athletes across the events aren't really any good, the ones who are successful aren't with UK coaches.
Why?
It’s all about the maths.
cormley git wrote:
Why even bother with coaches for the sprints? What are they going to say, "Hey, you, give me three starts and then go lounge around for two hours?" Sprinters are lazy and shiftless, but it doesn't matter because it is the most reliant of all sports on natural talent.
Hilarious! Captures the completely-clueless-distance-runner vibe perfectly!
Well played, sir/ma'am.
I am going to guess they are underrepresented with west-African-genetics runners compared to the sprint powers.
Coaches should:
Have large amount of specific knowledge
Affect the development of the athlete (improve performance)
Sustain that development
Repeat it with others
Of those British coaches mentioned, who would you say meet that criteria.
Be critical in what you perceive as develop btw! (only one the coaches above meet that criteria)
I’m sorry but I would tend to completely disagree with you. The schools competitions do bring talent through, I know people who were the fastest in their year so went to boroughs, did well, made counties and ended up representing the county, without being at a club. Each youth age and gender group (u13, u15, u17,)has about 200 ranked sprinters for just 100m in 2020 (bearing in mind the lack of competitions this year), so that’s around 1,200 just for ranked youths. Add on about 600 more for ranked senior men and women. Even then that is only those who are fast enough to be ranked (many more compete who aren’t fast enough), and this only 100m, if you include 200,300 and 400 then you’d have quite a lot more than 1000 people (obviously some people will be on multiple rankings). (The rankings are at
https://www.thepowerof10.info/rankings/rankinglist.aspx?event=100&agegroup=U17&sex=W&year=2020
)
Also as an athlete currently in the talent pathway system who is surrounded by numerous amazing coaches I would disagree with your statement about poor coaching standards, mentoring and pathways because I couldn’t have asked for anything better.
I apologise for the rant, you may have personal experience to base your post off, in which case I apologise- it was just it didn’t seem to match the excellent experience I have as a junior athlete in the uk.
In response to the statement that there aren’t even 1000 sprinters in the uk
YMMV wrote:
I am going to guess they are underrepresented with west-African-genetics runners compared to the sprint powers.
Not true. Lots of Jamaicans came to work here from the 50s onwards. Linford Christie was born in Jamaica.
9 out of our A-T Top 10 male 100m runners have Caribbean &/or West African family backgrounds. I believe Gemili is the exception (Iranian / Moroccan family background)
Because you've never had any great runners. Maybe in 20 years Asher-Smith will come back and share all her knowledge orrrrr most likely she'll choose to live in America lol.