Say you're racing on Sunday, what's the latest day you'd do your last hard session? Monday? Tuesday? Would it depend on the distance you're racing? Any thoughts are appreciated, thanks.
Say you're racing on Sunday, what's the latest day you'd do your last hard session? Monday? Tuesday? Would it depend on the distance you're racing? Any thoughts are appreciated, thanks.
I would do a moderately hard workout on Thursday.
Depends on how important of a race and type of race.
Less important/build up, I might do a decent workout on Tuesday or Wednesday (not a killer, save it for the race) for Sunday race. And then a sharpener on Friday, like 5X 300 getting faster. Or 4X 400 at mile pace for a 5K or 10K.
For a bigger race or something longer like a half marathon it's a light workout on Tuesday or Wednesday and just a set of pick ups later on the week. For peak races I'll take a day off, usually two days before the event (so Friday off for a Sunday race), and a light workout out the day before (shakeout and a few strides).
It changes depending on, at least,
a) age
b) training age
c) distance
d) priority of the race
e) how banged up you are at the end of a buildup.
There's no point, and in fact it's counter-productive, to do a workout you can't recover and gain fitness from in time for a peak race.
Tuesday but an easier workout than usual.
Like race pace but 60% of usual volume.
So no really "hard".
The really hard one would be 10 days before so that I can recover and gain 100% physically and mentally from it.
If the race is not important I would do a normal workout on Tuesday but not a killer.
Impala31 wrote:
Tuesday but an easier workout than usual.
Like race pace but 60% of usual volume.
So no really "hard".
The really hard one would be 10 days before so that I can recover and gain 100% physically and mentally from it.
If the race is not important I would do a normal workout on Tuesday but not a killer.
Impala31 is correct. Here is the science for 10 days from Dr. Bob Treffene
The first stage of division (mitosis) takes 3 days and requires iron for the recombination during this three-day period. The following building and rehousing of the proteins take approximately 7-10 days. So for ten days the athlete will have an oxygen utilization problem, especially if the mitochondria are changing as a group. All muscle fibers contain mitochondria They are therefore all ablet to produce ATP within thes mitochondria.
Impala31 wrote:
Tuesday but an easier workout than usual.
Like race pace but 60% of usual volume.
So no really "hard".
The really hard one would be 10 days before so that I can recover and gain 100% physically and mentally from it.
If the race is not important I would do a normal workout on Tuesday but not a killer.
Precisely this. The latest date to gain fitness is 10 days out. Your goal during race week is to stay sharp and feel good, and it is easy to overwork it.
Worth noting: I think a lot of folks on the recreational end of the spectrum lay off too much before race day because they are worried about being worn down. A lot of folks on the more competitive end do too much because they want to either maximize their gains or are afraid of “losing it” during taper for an A race. Doesn’t help that tapering can make you feel like hot garbage, but you have to trust the process.
Ganbatte wrote:
Impala31 is correct. Here is the science for 10 days from Dr. Bob Treffene
The first stage of division (mitosis) takes 3 days and requires iron for the recombination during this three-day period. The following building and rehousing of the proteins take approximately 7-10 days. So for ten days the athlete will have an oxygen utilization problem, especially if the mitochondria are changing as a group. All muscle fibers contain mitochondria They are therefore all ablet to produce ATP within thes mitochondria.
10 days is a solid rule of thumb, but it depends on whether this is the adaptation you're trying to achieve. Not every workout is trying to produce more mitochondria. Neuromuscular training can produce adaptation within 2 days, so you could do hard sprints and hills very close to a key race. And late in a training stage, it's actually quite unlikely that you're going to be getting ANY aerobic development from your workouts. It's likely that many of the adaptations at this stage are actually neurological. You become more economical by practicing race pace under fatigue. You also become somewhat calloused to the pain, which is probably one of the most important effects of training. Because these are adaptations that happen very quickly, the key question, I think, is how much time is necessary to recover. That's distinct from adaptation.
Asking A Question wrote:
Say you're racing on Sunday, what's the latest day you'd do your last hard session? Monday? Tuesday? Would it depend on the distance you're racing? Any thoughts are appreciated, thanks.
It depends. If it's an important race that you're not just training through I would say 3 days out, so for a race on Saturday, the last hard workout would be on Wednesday. I would make it a pretty hard workout as well but nothing too hard leading up to it. The intensity of the workout depends on the race, if it's a more anaerobic race like the 800, I would do more anaerobic type training. If it's more aerobic like 1500-5k I would still do a little bit anaerobic training but not too much, the main component of the workout should be aerobic.
my 2c wrote:
It changes depending on, at least,
a) age
b) training age
c) distance
d) priority of the race
e) how banged up you are at the end of a buildup.
Yup. Trial and error. Everyone is different.
I’ve found success doing 4-6x60m all-out about 2-3 days out from a big competition (had been doing them all season, but 6-8 reps).
My runners would always be sore the next day, then feel great on race day.
I know many runners who like to do “race pace” work, but at a percentage of a normal workout (only 4 reps instead of 8).
Just depends.
Thanks for the advice everyone! I'm running a 10K TT on Friday, did my last session on Sunday and it was a bit of a killer so I've now learned that was a mistake but I know better for next time. Anyway, hoping for sub-33. Fingers crossed I can bang out those consistent 79s!
I like 2-3 easy days before a race. 2 if the race isn't important, 3 if it is. I usually workout on Tuesdays and races are usually on Saturdays, so I usually get 3 days of easy running regardless.
Just in response to the part of mitosis:
If you're referring to muscle cells undergoing mitosis, that doesn't happen in adult muscle. As other's stated, there are neurological and mitochondrial adaptations that will be beneficial for performance but the muscle specific division mentioned is not something that happens in adult muscle
that is to say, unless the muscle is severely damaged enough to need to undergo regeneration and incorporate muscle satellite cells. Training should never need to result in muscular regeneration and if that's happening, you have a bigger issue in terms of needing to learn how to properly train as you most likely just gave yourself rhabdo. When muscles are damaged to the degree that would require MSC's, the muscle fibers are regenerated and "relatively" normal looking by about 11-days post-injury but have altered characteristics like centralized nuclei (normal muscle has them of the periphery) that persists for weeks afterwards.
Agreed: ~ 10 days out should be your last real session. Then you can do 2-3 more light sessions just to spin the wheels a bit but with volume and/or intensity a bit down.
For a 5k, say your last hard session is 3 x mile @ 5k. You do that on Tuesday/Wednesday. On Friday you do some strides. On Saturday/Sunday you do your long run but cut off a few miles -- maybe 10-13 miles instead of 14-16+. Then on Tuesday you either do a small number of reps at pace if you feel the need to or I like to just do a light threshold session -- 4 x 1200 or 5 x 1k @ half marathon. Then maybe Thursday or Friday you do strides or something more structured like 5-6 x 300m. Race Saturday or Sunday.
Pretty much the same formula I use in the last week and a half from the mile to the marathon with slight tweaks. The main one being what the workout is 10 days out.
Mostly my runners do just the last preparation workout on a Tuesday if race on Saturday or Sunday. And it`s just a very easy one 6-8 x 400m at LT-pace.To race at your individual top is a question of loading the energy batteries to maximum.
-J.S -
NO DAYS OFF!. STAY HARD!
I’ve always done my hard workout 10 days out. Sometimes further out if I have a qualification meet.
It’s pretty individualistic with tapering and such, but I’ve found over the years that unless you’re doing a lot (maybe over 70-80 mpw, just a ballpark) that a taper is just going to consist of shortening the long run and taking a couple miles off each distance run.
Last cross country season I ran probably around 50 mpw coming back from an injury and probably dropped to 40-45 the week of the state meet and ran a 20 second pr which I had previously set two weeks before. Usually the week of a peak race I’ll do 8-10x200. If I’m racing on Saturday I’ll do them on Tuesday. These are at whatever pace you want, with full recovery. The goal is just to get the legs moving fast, but not really ripping it. Maybe 5k-mile pace or so.
The rest of the week is just light jogging with some strides the day before. I think the key is not changing what you’ve been doing. I think I heard somewhere that David McNeill ran a 10 miler two days before he won NCAAs.
It takes some trial and error. I’ve had some great teammates that were certainly at the level to get all state, and it was frustrating racing with them at meets and seeing them do poorly because, presumably, they didn’t taper correctly.
What’s the distance?
Depends on the type of runner, your current mileage and the race distance as well. For me I found leaving 1-2 days between my last hard workout and works perfectly.