50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

My 10k was not quite as fast as I hoped for, but definitely OK. I ran 43:06, and, as far as I know, only two 70-74 guys have run under 44 minutes this year, with one of them being my team mate, Rick, who ran just about a minute ahead of me this morning (also, Gene Dykes will probably run under 41 minutes in a couple of days at World Masters). My splits went 6:55, 6:53, 6:54, 6:55, 7:07, 7:02. Mile 5 was into a little headwind, and my legs really started to feel toasted at about five and a half miles. So, I need to do some more endurance work before XC starts.

Happy 4th to all!

“my legs really started to feel toasted” ……😹…..know the feeling…..good race……

I didn’t get to race today. I just had this feeling.

So, last night, I got the map out and figured out where the aid stations go. I just had a feeling I’d be doing that.

sure enough, when I got there at 4:00 am, my fellow outstanding volunteer, who also races 100 races a year, was on his iPhone talking to AAA.

The RD, looked around and said “ we gotta get the aid stations set up”.. and #### cant do it!
we had gotten the registration area, post race tubs of water and grilling pits set up by 4:45! ( two of us showed up early)….

The volunteer on the iPhone had car trouble.

I said “ I looked at the map last night and I think I know where they are and the truck driver and I took off. Accept for turning right once instead of left and having to double back, we found the paths between the houses that lead to the trails and we set up the stations.
By the time we got back it was gun time. I couldn’t have run anyway.

Great morning. I’m having problems again where I had cancer.. I unfortunately have a follow up in 3 weeks. I’m dreading it.

Congratulations old guy II - I'm 62 and can run 10K in about 52 minutes. I will find out the exact answer at a 10K race in September.

A little over 43 minutes for a 10K in your 8th decade of life. You are an extraordinary athlete.

If it ain't one thing, it's another.

I still can't run more than a few dozen strides at a time because my left foot will start to scrape the ground while coming forward and I'm afraid I'll trip and fall. However, I had worked my way up to walking 6-7 miles each day at better than 15 min/mile pace. But the Morton's neuroma on my left foot, which I've been managing OK for 20 years, gradually became more and more of a problem. Apparently fast walking really puts a lot of stress on the forefoot. Finally it hit a tipping point 10 days ago and I had to quit walking altogether. I can still ride a bike and it feels OK while I'm riding, but as soon as I get off I have a tingling knife stabbing me in the left forefoot. After a few days I started trying a home remedy, taping a square a gauze on the bottom of my foot just behind the ball of the foot. This is designed to emulate the foot pads you can buy that are supposed to help alleviate Morton's neuroma pain. Some combination of minimal walking and the foot pads seems to be helping.

I've had a backpacking trip with my husband and dogs planned for this week (right after the 4th). The weather forecast is excellent and the trails should be uncrowded mid-week right after the holiday. But I don't know if my foot will hold up, and even if it does, I don't know whether I still have the physical strength to haul a backpack up steep grades. Yesterday morning I loaded my backpack with 29 pounds and tried to go for a walk in my neighborhood, and I felt the pack was squishing me to death. I managed to walk up our one steep hill OK, but I felt like stepping up even to clear a 6-inch curb was a massive effort. We decided to cut the trip back to 3 days and 2 nights and that I would carry no more than 22 pounds (which gives my husband about 34 pounds--roughly body weight proportional). I guess I'll find out tomorrow whether I can still do this.

It seems ridiculous that I'm questioning whether I can carry a 22 pound pack, but reality is what it is, not what you wish it were.

good luck with the trip. You've had to deal with a lot more than your share, and you deserve a break!

Late report this weekend, as I waited until the Butte to Butte 5k on July 4.

Sat - 25 - 7.29 miles in 53:17, at 7:19 pace, including 12 x 400m at around 94.5 sec. with 400m steady run recovery.

Sun - 26 - 4 miles at 7:45 per mile

Mon - 27 - 3 miles including strides at 7:29 per mile

Tue - 28 - 2 miles at 7:46 per mile

Wed - 29 - 4 miles/strides at around 7:30 per mile

Thur - 30 - Off

Fri - 1 - 3 miles at 7:30 average

Sat - 2 - 2 miles/strides at 7:52 per mile

Sun - 3 - 1.5 mile jog, stride

Mon 4 - Butte to Butte 5k. Fifth Master, First Grandmaster (50+) in 19:49.0. Garmin had splits of 6:20, 6:20 and 6:23, but got the distance as 3.14, so is reading a little short. Still, seems relatively even paced.

Feel like I didn't quite taper enough over the last two weeks as legs were still not 100% fresh - I've definitely got more aerobic capacity than I have legs. I've also got to still (re)learn to push a bit harder. Was running around 6:08 pace for a bit with about 0.5 of a mile to go, and let the pace slip by sitting in when I caught someone, rather than keep pushing, even though HR shows that I could have worked more.

On the positive side it was age graded better than the 40+ winner, Don Sage (who many will remember as an NCAA 1500m champ and sub 4:00 miler). With the recently revised age grades it also appears to be better than anything I've run in USATF Masters Champions (which includes thirds in a 5000m, 3000m indoor and 3000 s/c, twice), so I can't complain. On the track it would have be around 7th in the 5000m in the World Masters in Finland last week.

Fast running for sure!

Cavorty,

My congrats on your great race! Glad to know you reached your goal and broke 20:00. I still think your potential (according to workout results you reported) is way higher and you can break 19:30 soon if you just continue without an injury. So, stay safe and good luck!

Orient,

Thanks. I feel that there is more there, I'm just out of practice extracting it!

I'm really just getting back after about six years of injury and one knee surgery. Before that, I was always relatively speedy (better at 800m-3000m than 5000m), and a 5k would feel like a fairly relaxed pace initially (my best age graded run in the USATF was in the 1500m).

Now, having done a lot less speedwork, I'm having to mentally adjust to a higher level of perceived intensity. Mentally, I kept wanting to slide out to 6:25 pace here, when I was capable of pushing harder, as I think I've improved my aerobic strength with the Easy Interval Method.

In this race, there was a point with about three minutes to go, where I was running about 6:08 pace, chasing someone, but then I sat in behind them when I caught them, instead of running through them and after then next target.

I can tell I let up as, looking at Garmin, my heart-rate dropped. Then I had too much left for a kick and was still accelerating hitting 5:44 pace at the line.

I was actually a bit more aggressive - and more tired - at the end of the 2 mile time trial, so I have to re-learn to commit harder.

I guess not totally surprising, after 1 race in 2019, no races in 2020, 1 in 2021, and 2 (not including a 15 mile trail race) in 2022.

Hoping, if I can keep at it and stay uninjured, the ability to really push will come back.

Thanks for the encouragement.

Endless Summer of Newbi:

Mo 7 miles easy

Tu 2.5 miles tempo @6:40mpm, 5x150m

We off, tired

Th 30 min jumps and drills uphill, 8x60m flat

Fr 7 miles easy

Sa 4x100m buildups, 6x300m, 4x100m cut down, all with 100m walk in max 2 min

Su 90 min easy in the hills

Run, walk, be well. BR

Ah forgot: Saturday 300m runs were 56/57sec.

Peace

Amkelley: It’s a hell of a thing. If anybody can solve for X it’s you.
Allen1959: My very best wishes for your recovery.
RobertELee: I pulled my time timing races with the old tag-tear and manual input devices and tape output. I realized that if I volunteered an organ or two, they’d take ‘em and…a little later….ask for more. I quit and I’ve never looked back or volunteered again.
Cavorty: Congrats! That’s some mighty fine racing!

Mon = July 4th 5K: 24:19, 7:49 pace (7:45, 7:52, 7:59, 6:48), 2nd 60M (course was accurate)
Tue = 60 min easy flat, hot, a bit sore from Mon
Wed = 70 min easy flat, hot
Thr = 70 min, easy flat, hot
Fri = Every Fri off
Sat = 71 min easy, flat, cool, cloudy
Sun = 71 min easy, flat, enjoyable light rain whole way

The July 4th 5K race was a good tough race. It was hillier, warmer and more humid than my last race in May. I managed to improve my time a bit and beat some folks that beat me in the May race. I chased a couple folks (a 17yo and a 20 yo) the last mile, slowly reeling them in. When we got to the last quarter I was really happy I could outsprint them both. At least in my case all this shuffling has not affected my basic leg speed. That’s actually a surprise to me.

Of course you could argue that the pace I was running at the end could be considered by some to be rather pedestrian. My counter would be that it’s the same ‘pedestrian’ pace as when I was actually doing speed work….so I’ll take it and keep hitting that big red “Easy” button.

Have a good one!

I hit my modest training goals for the week. Volume came in at 46 Igy miles with totals of 14 miles walking, 8 miles running, 120 minutes spin bike, and 4,000 yards swimming. Intensity is not much to speak of but improving with fitness. Next week hope to bump up the running a tad, and add some gym exercises.

Have a good week.

Igy

Mon: 2 miles. I was beat after yesterday’s race

Tue: Nothing. Knees throbbed

wed: am. 6 miles;am 2,miles

thurs: 5.3 miles. 4 sets of curls, pull downs and bench press

Fri: 7 miles and strides

sat: am 3 miles;am 2.2 miles

Sun: am 5 miles;am 2 miles 4 sets of curls, pull downs and bench press and swim.

Took knee braces off for first time in 12-15 years. My knees hurt anyway so I said to hell with them. I think they never worked anyway.

May skip next Saturdays race. The two clubs whose races I race have to put on their races in city parks and along canals. I’m a member of one of the clubs. The last time I raced at this park, which is closer to the center of the city, there was something going on where the bicyclists openly gave the runners in the race a hard time. My job back then was clean up too and as I walked around picking up cones and mile markers found most of them thrown in the canal. So, I may not race at that park this Saturday. The next week is set up, race then clean up again at a park closer… I do like the camaraderie of being with runners but the memory of that race day still angers me.

67 y/o.. cancer, 3 miniscus surgeries and a colectomy. Been training and racing since 1977.

Solid week Igy, Nice race efforts Cavorty and Rtype.

Psyched to be heading to Eugene for Worlds in just 4 more days...as excited to see so many friends from more tha a half decade in the sport as watching all the action on the track...and there's going to be plenty of it. GREAT time to be a track & field fan.

I managed to put together a pair of back to back 30 mile weeks...that's really my weekly threshold these days. Am in a steady groove of one hard day three easy days...rinse and repeat.

This week's hard days were a 5 miler (including warm up w/ strides and mile cool down) w 1:00, 2:00, 3:00, 4:00, 2:00...all at about 2 mile race pace effort and just 2:00 running (not jogging) between reps.

The other session was a 8 miler...a course I have been running for years...so am able to compare apples to apples in the trainingg log...hit 1:08:51 yesterday which is my best in almost six years...a combination of a good long training streak and, but of course, goofy shoes.

Oh, and surpassed 700 miles year-to-date on Thursday...right on.

If you can't be up in Oregon these next two weeks, the at home coverage should be pretty excellent. My favorite way to watch at home these days is streaming with Peacock...costs $4.99 per month, has the best filming vantage points, and the announcers all have awesome British accents...if you haven't tried it, you really should.

Have a smokin' awesome week of training and racing...I gotta; get out there NOW as it's going to hit a 100 degrees here today...uggghhh.

Your pal,

MF

Greetings, fellow 50+ers! I hope you all enjoyed any Independence Day festivities that you were able to attend. We enjoyed a nice cookout and some fireworks with family and friends. Good times!

It was back to normal for me this week with a tad over 19 miles of actual running. I even threw in a relatively ambitious “speed” workout. I had one very quick tug in the calf, but it almost immediately subsided and has not returned. The knee is about 95%, which is to say “age appropriate”. While my volume has returned to my desired level, the intensity continues to lag. At times I am as much as 10% slower than this time last year. I have a few theories for this and would like some input, from those willing, regarding one of them.

One of the daily supplements I have been taking for many years is CoQ10. It is recommended for people over 40, or those taking a statin, or athletes. I qualify on all three counts. Recently my PCP increased my statin dosage. Thinking this might have contributed to my lack of leg energy, I increased my CoQ10 dosage too. Now I am reading about Ubiquinol which is a more bioavailable version. Do any of you take either of these, and what has been your experience? I appreciate any feedback you can offer. Thanks in advance.

Mon: 54’ CR ; swim

Tue: off

Wed: 44’ CR w/ 4 x 440y on/off; body wt ex + med ball routine

Thu: off

Fri: 56’ CR; body wt ex + med ball routine

Sat: off

Sun: 55’ CR; body wt ex + med ball routine

All the best!

Congrats to Cavorty and Rtype on excellent 4th of July races.

My backpacking trip was a bit of a fiasco, although not for any of the reasons I feared. My 22 pound pack felt perfectly comfortable, my neuroma squawked from time to time but was never a serious problem, and the dystonia felt considerably less severe than usual--on rugged terrain my hiking stride felt fine, and even on smooth trails it felt only mildly off. No, the first mistake we made was leaving on the 5th of July. Idiots in the neighborhood were setting off explosives all evening on the 4th, and our dogs were pacing, panting, and trying to get into bed with us, and no one slept well. The second mistake was attempting a too-ambitious first day given that we were starting out tired. We went 10 miles with over 3000 feet of climbing, and by the time we arrived at our lovely campsite we were all pretty whipped. (Even our dogs, very uncharacteristically, flopped down for long naps immediately upon arrival in camp!) Then, despite being very tired my husband couldn't sleep our first night on the trail either, and by the morning of day 2 he was a real wreck. The mosquitoes were also moderately bad, and we decided to just call it an overnighter and walk out. So we went 20 miles in two days with loaded backpacks, and we were all really tired. But I was really encouraged that everything worked OK for me mechanically.

We're already planning the next trip in a couple of weeks, when the mosquitoes should be down and we'll do less mileage. Unless, of course, the fires make that impossible. There's currently a big fire burning in Yosemite but I don't know whether that smoke is reaching the areas where we plan to hike at 8000-9000 feet. There may well be other big fires between now and then.

I'm looking forward to watching Worlds on TV next week and am jealous of Mike F.

sounds like a good call on cutting the trip short. Hope the wildfires don't interfere with next one.

fun week of running for me, highlighted by 2:30 with 30:00 at marathon pace (thru 4 miles on bike path at 28:34) Tuesday and a track mile Friday night -- first official one since 2019 though I did a 60th birthday TT last summer.

Finished in 5:40.2 for 50th OA (silver medal in 4th fastest heat, as I prefer to think of it) and 1st AG. 8 seconds slower than last one, but that's about on par with per-mile slowdown at other distances since 2019. My PR is 4:41, so i barely beat PR + 1:00/mile, which is working out at a wide range of distances to be a good challenge for me these days.

Bit of yo-yoing in first half to get position and then stayed a bit too patient with being boxed in (1:23/1:27), but once I had clear running room I ran evenly (1:25/1:25), and I had nothing left at the end, so I was satisfied that it was the max I could do.

Some good age group results incl. 5:10 by 56-yo Pete Wergin and 5:47 by a 10-yo girl in the heat after mine -- great pacing, confident stride, big finish. Really impressive. Back when I was coaching kids that age, we had a few who went on to be good HS and college runners, and I don't remember any of them having any sort of command of what they were doing in a mile that young.

have a great week,

Dave