Steve Magness is the Joe McCarthy of running. He uses the doping issue to accuse others of cheating without any credible evidence. All to raise his profile. He was completely unknown as a coach and only achieves "fame" when he makes his accusations against other athletes.
What Magness doesn't realize is that he has already set up his athletes for failure. None of his athletes can have a major breakthrough or else they will be accused of doping (by their own coach, no less) and not great coaching.
Already his runner at Houston, Barraza, was on here having to defend himself for his improvement and then basically threw Magness under the bus saying it was his hard work, not Magness's coaching that resulted in his improvement.
I have nothing to say about doping, only about the title of your thread.
Do you write for buzzfeed or some other hack of a 'news' website? Why the sensationalism? Did he explode or did he call a performance laughable? Know the difference. I'm assuming you're under 25.
George Hirsch wrote:
Why doesn't someone ask him what he thinks is the fastest time someone should be allowed to run. His automatic accusations suggest a new rule--automatic disqualification to anyone who sets a world record, even if they have never failed a test.
Magness clearly has a chip on his shoulder and the inability to understand the sport at an elite level. Historically we do see jumps in women's distance records as we saw yesterday and in the marathon record.
We saw Ayana try a different tactic yesterday ,go hard from the start to bury any thought of a kickers race. Brilliant tactic and confidence in her fitness to do it.
Magness just has no understanding of elites outside of a book or chart. His verbal vomit of nonsense is just that.
This type of breakthrough will give a mindset for others that sub 30 is an achievable barrier. My guess is Molly has talked with her coach already plotting next year a shot at it.
oly runner wrote:
Steve Magness is the Joe McCarthy of running. He uses the doping issue to accuse others of cheating without any credible evidence. All to raise his profile. He was completely unknown as a coach and only achieves "fame" when he makes his accusations against other athletes.
unknown? he coached/coaches at nop and a major d1 university. think he's a little bit closer to what is really going on, smart guy?
yeah, I'm not saying huddle is doping, but it's unfair to just 100% assume that she's clean while trashing other athletes for outrageous performances. Everyone should be held under that scrutiny.
hold the phone. wrote:
oly runner wrote:Steve Magness is the Joe McCarthy of running. He uses the doping issue to accuse others of cheating without any credible evidence. All to raise his profile. He was completely unknown as a coach and only achieves "fame" when he makes his accusations against other athletes.
unknown? he coached/coaches at nop and a major d1 university. think he's a little bit closer to what is really going on, smart guy?
hold the phone. wrote:
oly runner wrote:Steve Magness is the Joe McCarthy of running. He uses the doping issue to accuse others of cheating without any credible evidence. All to raise his profile. He was completely unknown as a coach and only achieves "fame" when he makes his accusations against other athletes.
unknown? he coached/coaches at nop and a major d1 university. think he's a little bit closer to what is really going on, smart guy?
Hahahahahaha do you think Magness ever wrote a workout for Rupp or Farah? Get real.
He had nothing to do with any of the real NOP elites.
Just Alberto's bag-carrier.
679 wrote:
I have nothing to say about doping, only about the title of your thread.
Do you write for buzzfeed or some other hack of a 'news' website? Why the sensationalism? Did he explode or did he call a performance laughable? Know the difference. I'm assuming you're under 25.
More than 4 tweets in less than an hour against Ayana's WR, from one of the most recognizable coaches in America. It's not normal, and If that wasn't "exploding" on twitter. IDK what it is.
ignorant jealous Magness again wrote:
hold the phone. wrote:unknown? he coached/coaches at nop and a major d1 university. think he's a little bit closer to what is really going on, smart guy?
Hahahahahaha do you think Magness ever wrote a workout for Rupp or Farah? Get real.
He had nothing to do with any of the real NOP elites.
Just Alberto's bag-carrier.
Take NOP out and glance through his athletes coached on his blog. He's got Oly in English, several athletes who've been to world champs of some kind with Hall, Spence, Barraza and Areson, Rogers resurrected her career under him, and he had that other random guy get top 10 at Boston and he's what, 30 years old?? I think the only athlete who has joined after the NOP allegations broke is English..
Bash all you want if you disagree on Magness calling out Ayana, but to say he was unknown before the NOP allegations is ignorant and shows that you simply have an axe to grind.
Did Magness beat you at a road race or snub you at a track meet or something?
knower of things. wrote:
Primero, I like you kid, but please, you're smarter than this. making easily refutable statements like this makes you sound like donald trump, and makes me more likely to ignore your posts in the future (for the record, I always stop and read your posts when I see your name as I'm skimming a thread).
Tirunesh is not coached by Aden. just because she goes to visit her baby sister and keeps training while she's there does *not* mean that he's her coach. Ayana's coach is purported to be her 1500m runner husband. both of these facts are widely known, and easily unearthed. They may well both be doping, and they might just as well be completely clean. But a false statement about coaching serves nothing.
Primo Numero Uno wrote:How about we all use our brains. 2 Ethiopians have broken records by the doped to the gills Chinese that were considered untouchable for years. Oh and one of their coaches was found with epo in a raid. Hmm...... nothing to see here.
I was referring to the little sister who broke the 1500m world record and is coached by the coach that got caught with EPO not Tirunesh who has not broken a WR in the past year. I thought that was obvious.
Just making a point that two athletes from a country with a completely out of compliant anti doping federation break the heavily tainted Chinese records which were untouchable for years.
29:17 > 2:15
Western Women, take it up a notch, like Paula did. And Molly Huddle did today. This has been 25 years in the making - now the Kenya and Ethiopian women are like the men.
Remember - Ingrid Kristiansen ran 30:13 in 1986.
He's an egomaniac. Anything to draw attention to himself. First he a accuses OP of doping and after years it still hasn't been proven.
So now it's time to make more accusations to get some publicity.
His podcast is an hour of chit chat, name dropping and bragging.
A tip for Steve......let your coaching results do the talking not your mouth.
There's something lacking in the analysis here. Someone did run 14:11, but it was not Ayana. It was Tirunesh Dibaba in 2008, the same year she ran 29:54 winning the gold in Beijing, age 23. Somehow though, Ayana, with a similar PR, ran 37 seconds faster for the longer distance than Dibaba was able to! Apparently though, Dibaba was dogging it back in 2008 as at age 31 she just broke her PR by 12 seconds. Just looking at the numbers, it would seem these performances were super-enabled. It might be the track, it might be doping, but the numbers invite scrutiny.
benefit of the doubt wrote:
wejo wrote:I haven't read this thread. But if a woman can run 14:11 I'm not surprised she ran run 29:17.
I'm not naive that some of these runners could be doping.
The US women haven't been competitive at 5000 for a while. Now the 10,000
But if Molly Huddle can run 30:13, and set a huge PR, why can't Ayana?
The conditions were perfect.
Where do we draw the line on who was and who wasn't doping in the race?
I haven't read it either, but you are right. The 10000 has always been soft because no one has ran it hard. Always sit and kick. 29:17 could be totally legit and the backlash is wrong IMO. Athletes aren't allowed to improve anymore?
MarathonMind wrote:
There's something lacking in the analysis here. Someone did run 14:11, but it was not Ayana. It was Tirunesh Dibaba in 2008, the same year she ran 29:54 winning the gold in Beijing, age 23. Somehow though, Ayana, with a similar PR, ran 37 seconds faster for the longer distance than Dibaba was able to! Apparently though, Dibaba was dogging it back in 2008 as at age 31 she just broke her PR by 12 seconds.
Just looking at the numbers, it would seem these performances were super-enabled. It might be the track, it might be doping, but the numbers invite scrutiny.
Do you feel the same way about Huddle?? She broke her p.r. by OVER 30 seconds after running the event for 10 years, and after going out too fast, then having to run by herself and run in lane 2 half the race passing lapped runners, i.e. NOT ideal. Why is THAT believable? If she never lost contact, and never had run in lane 2 she might have run right about 30:00, breaking her P.R. by close to 45 seconds. Believable??
Do you think the swimmer Ledecky is on drugs, crushing everyone and swimming not much slower than the men?
rojo wrote:
[quote]George Hirsch wrote:
He is not in a position to know this. He is seriously detracting from the overall effort against cheating by making claims he has zero ability to back up. He dos not work for the IAAF.
I think Magness is hurting the antidoping fight by saying that and I say that as an admirer of his. You can't just say something is laughable because it's fast.
To me, a coach should know the idea that a 14:05 athlete (and come on she's run 14:12 with horrible pacing) running 29:17for 10k isn't that shocking. So unless you were already calling her a doper before tonight, you shouldn't be doing it now.
At cornell, we had a couple guys run faster than 29:17 and none of them were sub 14:00 in the 5000.
We're about to update our 10k recap with this sentiment.
http://www.letsrun.com/news/2016/08/history-rio-almaz-ayana-smashes-womens-10000-world-record-2917-45-greatest-womens-10000-ever-molly-huddle-breaks-american-record-6th/Here is what we wrote:
[quote]LRCwrote:
Rojo,
If you simply look at the women's 5K and/or marathon record, Ayana's 10K record perhaps does not look that spectacular. However, it is absolutely spectacular to see a women run so fast in a non-paced race with 37 athletes, constantly going from lane 1 and 2 to get around lapped athletes and make it look easy. There is a reason why the previous record had been around for so long. For a decade, the record was considered untouchable and when great athletes like Radcliff, Defar, Cheruiyot and Tirunesh made legit attempts, they missed it by nearly half a minute and Ayana smashes the record. Certainly the math makes the record plausible, but it is difficult to maintain focus for 25 laps and having the balls to go after a long distance WR in a global championship.
I admit that a lot of my suspicion is because of Ayana questionable OOC testing. After rewatching the race I didn't see the fatigue on Ayana I saw on the other athlete's faces. She seemed like Superman. Btw, Ayana could have run sub-29 with fewer lapped runners and if she pushed harder the last 800m.
Trackbot! Compare Paula Radcliffe with Fine Upstanding Citizen
TrackCoach,
You must have missed the live feed of the race for you to someone write "non-paced race." That girl from Kenya set out at WR pace for well past 3000m. It was perfectly paced for a WR race, especially from an athlete like Ayana whom loves to accelerate mid-race and break it wide open. She was clicking off 70s for the remainder of the run without a Dibaba-esque 60-flat last lap. I think her last lap was another 70.
We have been saying for 2 years that Ayana could run 29:00. She ran close, 29:17. And she can run much faster, which is why you didn't notice the "fatigue" that we've never seen from the likes of El G, Dibaba, Tergat, Geb, Lagat, Webb, Cheserek, you name it. Take a look at Ingrid, Grete, any of the greats when they win. No fatigue whatsoever.. include Bolt, Johnson, etc.
When you're fit, you're fit.
No comparison exists between Paula Radcliffe and a Fine Upstanding Citizen
MarathonMind wrote:
There's something lacking in the analysis here. Someone did run 14:11, but it was not Ayana. It was Tirunesh Dibaba in 2008, the same year she ran 29:54 winning the gold in Beijing, age 23. Somehow though, Ayana, with a similar PR, ran 37 seconds faster for the longer distance than Dibaba was able to! Apparently though, Dibaba was dogging it back in 2008 as at age 31 she just broke her PR by 12 seconds.
Just looking at the numbers, it would seem these performances were super-enabled. It might be the track, it might be doping, but the numbers invite scrutiny.
The olympic final in 2008 started much slower than 2016. Dibaba's first 5k was about 1 minute slower than her pr. I would be almost impossible to set a WR starting out that slowly (for her). Also Dibaba didn't need to push the pace because she had a far better kick.
I'd be interested in hearing about 10,000m for women that have been paced at WR pace for the first 5k. It seems like it almost never happens until yesterday.