My 2 cents, which might only be worth less than 1 cent.
He is an amazing runner. When I saw his Silver Rush 50 time, I knew he had a fast time in Leadville in him. Leadville and Javelina speak for themselves. However he trains. If he only trained on an elliptical, well good for him. If he consumed human breast milk ;) well good for him...to each his own.
This part of his Western States DNF Strava post caught my attention. It made me think about all the different levels of what look like attention seeking behavior to me. "Mostly, I just didn’t have it. That compounded with unfounded health fears that I need to work through with a psychologist." And if you look at his Strava activity, he cropped it at the age station entry into Foresthill so there was no registry of his walking out and back. /hmm emoji
That's my takeaway here - I don't know what type of demons he may or may not have under the covers that nobody else can see. But I hope he and Megan can manage those and find true happiness and peace, because I get the feeling real life is not what he shows the world.
Once again, how does his terrible training explain Leadville and Javelina? Beating Magavoro by 10 minutes at Javelina? You guys are so focused on tearing him down that you conveniently ignore the facts.
Got a good laugh from the "his athletes are super talented" and "any monkey could coach them" type comments. So predictably LRC that it's a parody at this point. Yeah, Grant Fisher is so talented that I think I could coach him to some damn good results, so Mike Scannell is just along for the ride.
Can you hear yourselves? It's a joke. If he's a terrible coach, the roster of pros wouldn't use him and word would get out in the pro community. Guess what, despite the anti-Roche jihad on here, the opposite has happened. Picking up Jess McClain was huge because she's by far the best road runner that he has, as far as I know. Though Christian Allen's 2:10 at Houston to go along with his trail success is up there too. End of story.
I'm trying to understand the training. One of the foundations of training is specificity. I could see running on a treadmill for many miles if he lived in Kansas, but he doesn't right? He lives in Colorado, where there are trails -- so why not run on the trails?
Maybe another concept is "no free lunch". I think there is argument to make that Roach's attempt to use fast track workouts as a way to "hack" his way into superior shape. Often people will switch to very high intensity workouts and get good results temporarily, crediting these workouts, which did help. But you're just in some sense adding intensity to a long career of slower runs -- you just periodized. You can't do that again and again as you're in a sense de-training your base. Maybe makes sense his best result this year was a 50 miler, not a 100 miler, and not a 100K.
All the rest of the training does in fact feel like trying to grab attention and is something I would expect from a Youtuber or TikTocker who is in it for the views. Training for a distance race is ultimately pretty f'n boring, right? You do practically the same week worth's of workouts again and again and again. Which is why I guess Roche leans heavily on superlatives to keep/gain attention. If Roach was in his early 20's, with that edge in pure fitness of being young and not edging ever so closer to middle age where this all feels a little cringe, this could have all worked.
It is too bad -- like many have written: he could have had a much better race by training and racing the race more intelligently: finished, with a good time. But it's not about the race.
I'll be curious for the next time he pulls the whistle on that hype train, who's going to react -- and how. I may be in the, "f- this again?" crowd.
Once again, how does his terrible training explain Leadville and Javelina? Beating Magavoro by 10 minutes at Javelina? You guys are so focused on tearing him down that you conveniently ignore the facts.
Got a good laugh from the "his athletes are super talented" and "any monkey could coach them" type comments. So predictably LRC that it's a parody at this point. Yeah, Grant Fisher is so talented that I think I could coach him to some damn good results, so Mike Scannell is just along for the ride.
Can you hear yourselves? It's a joke. If he's a terrible coach, the roster of pros wouldn't use him and word would get out in the pro community. Guess what, despite the anti-Roche jihad on here, the opposite has happened. Picking up Jess McClain was huge because she's by far the best road runner that he has, as far as I know. Though Christian Allen's 2:10 at Houston to go along with his trail success is up there too. End of story.
How long was Christian Allen coached by Roche before Houston? Two weeks? Then he suffered a major stress fracture a few months later under his tutelage. Didn't make the Worlds Team in the Classic as a result
Allie O admitting she is having a terrible season. Also suffered a major injury.
What about all the pros who have left Roche? This has been covered extensively elsewhere.
That's my takeaway here - I don't know what type of demons he may or may not have under the covers that nobody else can see. But I hope he and Megan can manage those and find true happiness and peace, because I get the feeling real life is not what he shows the world.
It happens to many around his age in this town of very wealthy people, where they realize the wealth and privilege they grew up with, and the surface and transactional relationships they've promoted as the most important to foster aren't what make for real happiness. Usually what then happens is they look for some sort of guru figure and get themselves taken for a ride...
And if you look at his Strava activity, he cropped it at the age station entry into Foresthill so there was no registry of his walking out and back. /hmm emoji
Of course he did. Can't have the walk back negatively affect his average pace..what would all his little SWAP stans think?!?
My 2 cents, which might only be worth less than 1 cent.
He is an amazing runner. When I saw his Silver Rush 50 time, I knew he had a fast time in Leadville in him. Leadville and Javelina speak for themselves. However he trains. If he only trained on an elliptical, well good for him. If he consumed human breast milk ;) well good for him...to each his own.
This part of his Western States DNF Strava post caught my attention. It made me think about all the different levels of what look like attention seeking behavior to me. "Mostly, I just didn’t have it. That compounded with unfounded health fears that I need to work through with a psychologist." And if you look at his Strava activity, he cropped it at the age station entry into Foresthill so there was no registry of his walking out and back. /hmm emoji
That's my takeaway here - I don't know what type of demons he may or may not have under the covers that nobody else can see. But I hope he and Megan can manage those and find true happiness and peace, because I get the feeling real life is not what he shows the world.
Laughing at the armchair psychologists on here. This thread really has gone of the rails. A Roche thread that's off the rails, shocker!
You conveniently left out the joke about the "exorcist", and I'd bet $1000 that he's talking about the vision loss issue. It would be scary to anyone. I've been around ultras enough to know that it's a thing, and Courtney Dauwalter had a famous incident with it. All the tough guys on here will say "just run blindly," but that's a joke if you have 50 miles to go and are cratering anyway.
Speaking of which, where's the hate for Farvard dropping out at 92 miles. What a fraud he is! What a soft loser! Just walk it in! I'm sure that was pre-planned! See how this works and how ridiculous you guys sound?
Yeah, yeah, his coaching sucks and every athlete who he has coached has gotten worse and injured. Except that it's not true. But keep saying it and maybe your dreams will become reality.
Regarding his "insecurity" about this talent, I'm learning that he really is damned by "the haters" either way. He is either a talentless ego-driven blowhard, or is he is uber-talented with deep-seated psychological issues. I appreciated his humility about the guys who are way better than him, like Kilian. I never thought he was going to win, and predicted beforehand that he's be 6th or 7th if he had a good day. But when you're so focused on tearing him down, his humility is also dismissed as fraudulent. Whatever.
I'm not Megan. I thought her interview was cringey. She should have said, "He's having a tough patch, some vision issues, but he's going to keep going and hopefully he'll start to feel better." Nothing more. But unlike the rest of you, I'll give her some grace for being caught up in the moment and being disappointed. If I can play take a turn as armchair psychologist, she seems like the one who kept saying "you're going to win" to him. Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, it could go either way since I'm not there and don't know them.
trying to figure out why people don't like him? he's an obnoxious blowhard snake salesman to anyone who's been in this sport for a while. saturday ended just where we all thought it would. he's a great runner, but not the best, and clearly not mentally tough, which is why everyone was betting on his DNF around Michigan bluff to forest hill. I guess he exceed expectations by a half mile or so (comically, right when it gets "easy" and entirely runable).
"compounded with unfounded health fears that I need to work through with a psychologist"
Laughing at the armchair psychologists on here.
He's the one who brought it up.
Your behavior mirrors his very closely - you both seem way too emotionally brittle, attention seeking, and caring what other people think. Its not healthy.
My 2 cents, which might only be worth less than 1 cent.
He is an amazing runner. When I saw his Silver Rush 50 time, I knew he had a fast time in Leadville in him. Leadville and Javelina speak for themselves. However he trains. If he only trained on an elliptical, well good for him. If he consumed human breast milk ;) well good for him...to each his own.
This part of his Western States DNF Strava post caught my attention. It made me think about all the different levels of what look like attention seeking behavior to me. "Mostly, I just didn’t have it. That compounded with unfounded health fears that I need to work through with a psychologist." And if you look at his Strava activity, he cropped it at the age station entry into Foresthill so there was no registry of his walking out and back. /hmm emoji
That's my takeaway here - I don't know what type of demons he may or may not have under the covers that nobody else can see. But I hope he and Megan can manage those and find true happiness and peace, because I get the feeling real life is not what he shows the world.
Laughing at the armchair psychologists on here. This thread really has gone of the rails. A Roche thread that's off the rails, shocker!
You conveniently left out the joke about the "exorcist", and I'd bet $1000 that he's talking about the vision loss issue. It would be scary to anyone. I've been around ultras enough to know that it's a thing, and Courtney Dauwalter had a famous incident with it. All the tough guys on here will say "just run blindly," but that's a joke if you have 50 miles to go and are cratering anyway.
Speaking of which, where's the hate for Farvard dropping out at 92 miles. What a fraud he is! What a soft loser! Just walk it in! I'm sure that was pre-planned! See how this works and how ridiculous you guys sound?
Yeah, yeah, his coaching sucks and every athlete who he has coached has gotten worse and injured. Except that it's not true. But keep saying it and maybe your dreams will become reality.
Regarding his "insecurity" about this talent, I'm learning that he really is damned by "the haters" either way. He is either a talentless ego-driven blowhard, or is he is uber-talented with deep-seated psychological issues. I appreciated his humility about the guys who are way better than him, like Kilian. I never thought he was going to win, and predicted beforehand that he's be 6th or 7th if he had a good day. But when you're so focused on tearing him down, his humility is also dismissed as fraudulent. Whatever.
I'm not Megan. I thought her interview was cringey. She should have said, "He's having a tough patch, some vision issues, but he's going to keep going and hopefully he'll start to feel better." Nothing more. But unlike the rest of you, I'll give her some grace for being caught up in the moment and being disappointed. If I can play take a turn as armchair psychologist, she seems like the one who kept saying "you're going to win" to him. Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, it could go either way since I'm not there and don't know them.
As a friend of Rod I can say with certainty there is absolutely no comparison between him and Roche. Rod has put in the years at WS. DNF, 58th place, 12th place, 2nd place. The dude is a workhorse and runs with integrity and humility. David is a man-child clown who crumbles under the slightest pressure and needs the endless support of his codependent wife and random YouTube losers. My guess is you’re one of those 2. Keep on coming with the stupid comments, makes this thread fun!
My 2 cents, which might only be worth less than 1 cent.
He is an amazing runner. When I saw his Silver Rush 50 time, I knew he had a fast time in Leadville in him. Leadville and Javelina speak for themselves. However he trains. If he only trained on an elliptical, well good for him. If he consumed human breast milk ;) well good for him...to each his own.
This part of his Western States DNF Strava post caught my attention. It made me think about all the different levels of what look like attention seeking behavior to me. "Mostly, I just didn’t have it. That compounded with unfounded health fears that I need to work through with a psychologist." And if you look at his Strava activity, he cropped it at the age station entry into Foresthill so there was no registry of his walking out and back. /hmm emoji
That's my takeaway here - I don't know what type of demons he may or may not have under the covers that nobody else can see. But I hope he and Megan can manage those and find true happiness and peace, because I get the feeling real life is not what he shows the world.
Laughing at the armchair psychologists on here. This thread really has gone of the rails. A Roche thread that's off the rails, shocker!
You conveniently left out the joke about the "exorcist", and I'd bet $1000 that he's talking about the vision loss issue. It would be scary to anyone. I've been around ultras enough to know that it's a thing, and Courtney Dauwalter had a famous incident with it. All the tough guys on here will say "just run blindly," but that's a joke if you have 50 miles to go and are cratering anyway.
Speaking of which, where's the hate for Farvard dropping out at 92 miles. What a fraud he is! What a soft loser! Just walk it in! I'm sure that was pre-planned! See how this works and how ridiculous you guys sound?
Yeah, yeah, his coaching sucks and every athlete who he has coached has gotten worse and injured. Except that it's not true. But keep saying it and maybe your dreams will become reality.
Regarding his "insecurity" about this talent, I'm learning that he really is damned by "the haters" either way. He is either a talentless ego-driven blowhard, or is he is uber-talented with deep-seated psychological issues. I appreciated his humility about the guys who are way better than him, like Kilian. I never thought he was going to win, and predicted beforehand that he's be 6th or 7th if he had a good day. But when you're so focused on tearing him down, his humility is also dismissed as fraudulent. Whatever.
I'm not Megan. I thought her interview was cringey. She should have said, "He's having a tough patch, some vision issues, but he's going to keep going and hopefully he'll start to feel better." Nothing more. But unlike the rest of you, I'll give her some grace for being caught up in the moment and being disappointed. If I can play take a turn as armchair psychologist, she seems like the one who kept saying "you're going to win" to him. Whether that's a good thing or a bad thing, it could go either way since I'm not there and don't know them.
Vision issues happen much later in very long races, usually way past the 24 hour mark.
Roche got all the Schadenfreude he deserved for his nonsense cringe videos. All of them. The David Poach comedian captured it best:
People trained for heat decades ago and Scott Jurek also pointed that out in his interview just before the race. All that speed training was a lot of showboating for the camera. He should have hit the Colorado hills instead. He had the best training options right behind his house.
And yet a guy who lives in Norway finished just 8-9 minutes behind the winner with not much fuss.
Courtney won the race where she got that blindness. Farvard dropping at 92 is nowhere near the same as roche dropping at 60. If anything that proves that farvard really pushed to his max.
Are you serious with these comparisons? Your cult leader failed big. Just take the L.
Speaking of which, where's the hate for Farvard dropping out at 92 miles. What a fraud he is! What a soft loser! Just walk it in! I'm sure that was pre-planned! See how this works and how ridiculous you guys sound?
Did Farvard hire a film crew to make an entire YouTube series on how he was going to (quote) SHOCK THE WORLD, while also maintaining a podcast they record in their home studio pretty much about themselves, while also guesting on practically any podcast that'll have him? Did Farvard publicly say he was going tun run "low 14" via track and treadmill workouts? Does he run a coaching business that all this hoopla is there to promote? Does Roche have his killer mustache?
No?
I guess that's your answer.
Chapeau Farvard for gutting it out. Too bad no one... gave you a bracelet.
Why are you putting "dr" in quotes? I'm no fan of hers or David but she is an actual doctor and I'm not sure why you want to try to give the impression she isn't.
Why are you putting "dr" in quotes? I'm no fan of hers or David but she is an actual doctor and I'm not sure why you want to try to give the impression she isn't.
I can’t speak for the original poster but might be a dig if she doesn’t practice and/or is not licensed. some doctors only consider practicing doctors doctors. I don’t know for sure if she practices or is licensed - just a guess as to original post intention.
Why are you putting "dr" in quotes? I'm no fan of hers or David but she is an actual doctor and I'm not sure why you want to try to give the impression she isn't.
She’s a PhD, but flaunts her MD around also when it suits her. She went to medical school, that’s it. Never treated a patient in her life. The fact that she’s a medical director at WS is a testament to how hard she “sells herself” as a medical professional. As an actual physician this is disgraceful and embarrassing to the profession.
I may be the only person on this thread who can prove they actually know David, and know him well. I have only run a few marathons so I can't address his training or race day, but I can address his character as a coach. Allow me to explain.
I was David’s professor at Duke Law School. He took my environment law class in 2010. He had the top exam in the class and was clearly personable so I asked him to be my teaching assistant the following year. I’d heard that he had gotten into trail running and somehow knew that he was going to compete in the nationals so on the Monday morning I asked him how he had done, hoping to hear he had finished. You can imagine my surprise when, sheepishly, he said “Well, I won.” He was more surprised than I. And realize that he won the nationals while a full-time student at a very demanding dual-degree program.
I got on this thread because I wanted to hear more about his running performance at the Western states. I wasn't planning on posting but the insulting remarks about how he is a terrible person or an awful coach by people either who have never met him or, if they claim they do know him, provide no evidence that's the case, deserve an informed reply.
We had 100 students in the Environmental Law class, and it was a very challenging course. Throughout the semester I saw firsthand that David was not only empathetic and patient, but went the extra yard with every student who was struggling with the material. I’m not at all surprised he’s become a successful coach. Over the years, I’ve had close to 40 teaching assistants. He is easily in the top two or three of them all. Quite simply, he is a natural teacher. I have won two university teaching awards and I know instructional talent when I see it.
Some of you have clearly already made up your mind about who David is, and this post won't mean anything to you. But for those who are interested in hearing firsthand from someone who worked very closely with him in Law School and has stayed in touch since, I can assure you he's the same person now as then. I have included my name so you can verify that this is real and not some fictional post.
That's no excuse in this case. She has both an MD from Stanford medical school and a Phd in epidemiology so she is doctor in both senses of the word and trying to diminish either is just silly and the clearest sign that the poster has some sort of agenda.
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