We merged two threads into 1 and then re-named it so this would be the offiicial thread for the day. The other threads were titled, "Euro 1500 final" and "Euro 1500 final today - can anyone challenge Jakob?"
Ghost let us know what you find out. I wouldn’t be surprised to hear he is higher in mileage/altitude training now, as he seems an even stronger athlete. Worth noting plenty of the best (Cheptegei, Bekele, Kiplimo) achieved quite a bit in the 5-10K at 75-85 mpw. 100mpw might be necessary to thrive at the Marathon, but it’s not a requirement at 5-10K for athletes doing a lot of quality and training at altitude.
I was just talking to Rojo about this race. Gourley did not run well tonight (the rounds probably had something to do with it) but then Rojo asked me to see how far back Gourley was at Pre -- he was 2.14 seconds behind Jakob at Pre and 2.16 seconds behind today.
The way I see it right now, Kerr and Ingebrigtsen are on another level from everyone else, Nuguse is one step down, and then there's a gap to the rest of the world. Maybe Wightman can close that gap by the Olympics. Not sure who else can.
Undoubtedly impressive what Jakob did tonight but I think Kerr would have been right with him tonight. I don't expect any of the guys in this race to be close to Jakob in Paris.
Somewhat dismissive to Tim Cheruiyot and the Kenyans. Tim was already closer to Jakob in Oslo and Kerr’s level than Jake who ran a 3:30.7 equivalent not finishing nearly as strong as Tim. We’ll learn more at their Trials, but I expect Komen and Tim to be real challengers. Jake I’m now less sure as it seems he’s been plateauing after coming out of training so far. You should be getting better as you race, not hitting the same level which is what happened indoors/Australia and now outdoors so far.
Nuguse is such a sneak in all these discussions. If he was Australian or Swedish, he wouldn't get a mention.
Somewhat dismissive to Tim Cheruiyot and the Kenyans. Tim was already closer to Jakob in Oslo and Kerr’s level than Jake who ran a 3:30.7 equivalent not finishing nearly as strong as Tim. We’ll learn more at their Trials, but I expect Komen and Tim to be real challengers. Jake I’m now less sure as it seems he’s been plateauing after coming out of training so far. You should be getting better as you race, not hitting the same level which is what happened indoors/Australia and now outdoors so far.
Someone was asking me about the training mileage of Dr Yann Schrub and I told him that he normally is pretty low mileage with about 50 to 60 miles a week but that was in the past and that may have changed now as he's devoting more time to training but I don't think he goes over 120 kilometers per week (75 miles) I will try to confirm in the coming days. Also Dr Schrub trains quite a bit more when he goes to training camps three to four times a year compared with when he's based in France.
He kicked really well for a white dude. I was waiting for him to drop off but he stayed strong.
1) His first 150m continues to be a thing of beauty - zero interest in getting off the line fast, must have been the slowest 150m of his race
2) Agree with Hutchings on how easy the field made it for him to reach the front. It was so easy he was able to do it running around a bend and it seemed to take nothing out of him. I don't get that.
3) I posted earlier that I wondered if he would try and really blast the final 800m and for a while it looked like he would. He didn't really but still ran 1.50.56 for those final two laps and only really looked like he accelerated with 120 to go (26.11 for the final 200m going 13.25, 12.86)
And yet I still have no idea re: Paris - it was clearly incredibly impressive how he controlled and dominated that field but not sure that puts any fear into the subconscious of Josh Kerr. It's just going to be an all time classic in Paris in 7 weeks time.
Agree with all of this.
I was just talking to Rojo about this race. Gourley did not run well tonight (the rounds probably had something to do with it) but then Rojo asked me to see how far back Gourley was at Pre -- he was 2.14 seconds behind Jakob at Pre and 2.16 seconds behind today.
The way I see it right now, Kerr and Ingebrigtsen are on another level from everyone else, Nuguse is one step down, and then there's a gap to the rest of the world. Maybe Wightman can close that gap by the Olympics. Not sure who else can.
Undoubtedly impressive what Jakob did tonight but I think Kerr would have been right with him tonight. I don't expect any of the guys in this race to be close to Jakob in Paris.
It is sad you do not get to hear the interviews with Jakob in Norwegian after the race. He is talking quite a bit about racing, training and also about that it is important for him to race the European Championships.
He has 6 golds in 6 attempts. And still 23.
Of course for Americans it can be hard to understand that a European Championship is important. But look at the amount of spectators.
Jakob is 3 (I think) years younger than Kerr. I understand that on LR some think Jakob is a failure. But any runners living today would gladly swap their career with Jakob's
Somewhat dismissive to Tim Cheruiyot and the Kenyans. Tim was already closer to Jakob in Oslo and Kerr’s level than Jake who ran a 3:30.7 equivalent not finishing nearly as strong as Tim. We’ll learn more at their Trials, but I expect Komen and Tim to be real challengers. Jake I’m now less sure as it seems he’s been plateauing after coming out of training so far. You should be getting better as you race, not hitting the same level which is what happened indoors/Australia and now outdoors so far.
Nuguse is such a sneak in all these discussions. If he was Australian or Swedish, he wouldn't get a mention.
I was just talking to Rojo about this race. Gourley did not run well tonight (the rounds probably had something to do with it) but then Rojo asked me to see how far back Gourley was at Pre -- he was 2.14 seconds behind Jakob at Pre and 2.16 seconds behind today.
The way I see it right now, Kerr and Ingebrigtsen are on another level from everyone else, Nuguse is one step down, and then there's a gap to the rest of the world. Maybe Wightman can close that gap by the Olympics. Not sure who else can.
Undoubtedly impressive what Jakob did tonight but I think Kerr would have been right with him tonight. I don't expect any of the guys in this race to be close to Jakob in Paris.
It is sad you do not get to hear the interviews with Jakob in Norwegian after the race. He is talking quite a bit about racing, training and also about that it is important for him to race the European Championships.
He has 6 golds in 6 attempts. And still 23.
Of course for Americans it can be hard to understand that a European Championship is important. But look at the amount of spectators.
Jakob is 3 (I think) years younger than Kerr. I understand that on LR some think Jakob is a failure. But any runners living today would gladly swap their career with Jakob's
Well it's important for Jakob. It wasn't important for Kerr or Wightman. And I saw the spectators. Good crowd tonight but the rest of the meet was not very impressive.
I'm not trying to knock Jakob. The dude is incredible. He won the Olympics at 20 years old. I don't know how anyone can consider him a failure. But it's also okay to consider how this race affects his chances at the Olympics.
This post was edited 46 seconds after it was posted.
They should have pushed pace instead of letting it go slow and then finding themselves behind a handful of runners. Good luck for Gressier kicking around 5 or 6 people when he's fallen like 10m behind leader
Almgren and Gressier were the too fastest runner of the field in the 1500m.
I predicted to somebody that the Swede would not win the 10,000 meters but I thought he might get a medal.
Somewhat dismissive to Tim Cheruiyot and the Kenyans. Tim was already closer to Jakob in Oslo and Kerr’s level than Jake who ran a 3:30.7 equivalent not finishing nearly as strong as Tim. We’ll learn more at their Trials, but I expect Komen and Tim to be real challengers. Jake I’m now less sure as it seems he’s been plateauing after coming out of training so far. You should be getting better as you race, not hitting the same level which is what happened indoors/Australia and now outdoors so far.
Nuguse is such a sneak in all these discussions. If he was Australian or Swedish, he wouldn't get a mention.
There are four men in history with mile PBs under 3:44 including Nuguse. The other three all have Olympic 1500m gold medals. I’d say he belongs in these discussions.
I was just talking to Rojo about this race. Gourley did not run well tonight (the rounds probably had something to do with it) but then Rojo asked me to see how far back Gourley was at Pre -- he was 2.14 seconds behind Jakob at Pre and 2.16 seconds behind today.
The way I see it right now, Kerr and Ingebrigtsen are on another level from everyone else, Nuguse is one step down, and then there's a gap to the rest of the world. Maybe Wightman can close that gap by the Olympics. Not sure who else can.
Undoubtedly impressive what Jakob did tonight but I think Kerr would have been right with him tonight. I don't expect any of the guys in this race to be close to Jakob in Paris.
Yeah far be it for me to overly critique the best MD runner of the last 19 years (btw I only remembered recently that El G basically never raced again after that Athens 5000m), but I really thought he might try and practice something/send a message to Kerr in that race tonight and he didn't really. Because yeah, based on the shape we saw Kerr in at Pre, I think he would have won this race tonight. As it is he had his feet up relaxed and would be well within his rights to have been thinking "I could and would have won that". I wonder if the final 800 had been in the low 1.48's if he's so confident about that.
That to me was a perfect situation to try something like this. He is clearly sooo much better than anyone else in that field but it's still a championship final and he was in no danger of not winning that.
I wondering if we would see something that made us think "oh wow, that's something different we haven't seen before". It was as impressive as always but it wasn't that.
I was just talking to Rojo about this race. Gourley did not run well tonight (the rounds probably had something to do with it) but then Rojo asked me to see how far back Gourley was at Pre -- he was 2.14 seconds behind Jakob at Pre and 2.16 seconds behind today.
The way I see it right now, Kerr and Ingebrigtsen are on another level from everyone else, Nuguse is one step down, and then there's a gap to the rest of the world. Maybe Wightman can close that gap by the Olympics. Not sure who else can.
Undoubtedly impressive what Jakob did tonight but I think Kerr would have been right with him tonight. I don't expect any of the guys in this race to be close to Jakob in Paris.
Yeah far be it for me to overly critique the best MD runner of the last 19 years (btw I only remembered recently that El G basically never raced again after that Athens 5000m), but I really thought he might try and practice something/send a message to Kerr in that race tonight and he didn't really. Because yeah, based on the shape we saw Kerr in at Pre, I think he would have won this race tonight. As it is he had his feet up relaxed and would be well within his rights to have been thinking "I could and would have won that". I wonder if the final 800 had been in the low 1.48's if he's so confident about that.
That to me was a perfect situation to try something like this. He is clearly sooo much better than anyone else in that field but it's still a championship final and he was in no danger of not winning that.
I wondering if we would see something that made us think "oh wow, that's something different we haven't seen before". It was as impressive as always but it wasn't that.
I don't see the obsession with winning in any other way to show that you are better. Winning by frontrunning 900 meters out or the whole thing is way more impressive than any other tactics. Shows that you put in the most work and strength to win the final. No 2nd guesses on who is actually better or not.
I was just talking to Rojo about this race. Gourley did not run well tonight (the rounds probably had something to do with it) but then Rojo asked me to see how far back Gourley was at Pre -- he was 2.14 seconds behind Jakob at Pre and 2.16 seconds behind today.
The way I see it right now, Kerr and Ingebrigtsen are on another level from everyone else, Nuguse is one step down, and then there's a gap to the rest of the world. Maybe Wightman can close that gap by the Olympics. Not sure who else can.
Undoubtedly impressive what Jakob did tonight but I think Kerr would have been right with him tonight. I don't expect any of the guys in this race to be close to Jakob in Paris.
It is sad you do not get to hear the interviews with Jakob in Norwegian after the race. He is talking quite a bit about racing, training and also about that it is important for him to race the European Championships.
He has 6 golds in 6 attempts. And still 23.
Of course for Americans it can be hard to understand that a European Championship is important. But look at the amount of spectators.
Jakob is 3 (I think) years younger than Kerr. I understand that on LR some think Jakob is a failure. But any runners living today would gladly swap their career with Jakob's
Whoa whoa whoa - who thinks Jakob is a failure? Talking about America let's not go full victim mode here and start creating false narratives to create unnecessary sympathy for people :D
Jakob is on Mt Rushmore already. People are happy and respect he is running the Euros. 3 15-5 doubles already is incredible. I'm not American or European (in the sense of being a citizen of a European nation) and I know why the Euro's are important for Europeans and I think it's great that it is.
But the coolest head to head in the sport since Coe and Ovett is in front of us and is coming to a head in Paris and it's interesting to discuss, debate, hypothesize all aspects of it - including what happened tonight.
i'm willing to bet that Jakob would have played that race very differently if he was running against Kerr
idiot
That’s a valid response.
Perhaps. And that’s what we don’t know and the Olympics will show. The pace that both will hit at the bell and when/if Kerr tries to kick past at 300 or if he simply can’t keep up.
In short, we just don’t know what time is going to win it or what time either is capable of.
A lot of Jakob fanboys are convincing themselves that Kerr won’t go below 3.29. I think he will, comfortably.
Kerr was already sub 3:29 in the Bowerman mile. I have predicted he also will go sub 3:28. The question is how far under 3:28 he will go. KERR FANBOY.
I have also predicted that Jakob if he stays healthy until Paris will be in sub 3:27 shape. And as we has seen in the last days Jakob´s kick is greatly underrated on this board so I still think he will have the upper hand in Paris.
Contenders (other than Kerr): Nuguse if he can find his Bowerman mile shape (=mid 3:27 in the 1500m) and PERHAPS Brian Komen as a dark horse.
It is sad you do not get to hear the interviews with Jakob in Norwegian after the race. He is talking quite a bit about racing, training and also about that it is important for him to race the European Championships.
He has 6 golds in 6 attempts. And still 23.
Of course for Americans it can be hard to understand that a European Championship is important. But look at the amount of spectators.
Jakob is 3 (I think) years younger than Kerr. I understand that on LR some think Jakob is a failure. But any runners living today would gladly swap their career with Jakob's
Well it's important for Jakob. It wasn't important for Kerr or Wightman. And I saw the spectators. Good crowd tonight but the rest of the meet was not very impressive.
I'm not trying to knock Jakob. The dude is incredible. He won the Olympics at 20 years old. I don't know how anyone can consider him a failure. But it's also okay to consider how this race affects his chances at the Olympics.
I think he would very much disagree with that. In this interview he talks about how good it feels to race, and how he makes progress with every race.
Jakob is 3 (I think) years younger than Kerr. I understand that on LR some think Jakob is a failure. But any runners living today would gladly swap their career with Jakob's
What exactly do you mean by this? Obviously there are living runners whose careers have been better than Ingebrigtsen's.
Well it's important for Jakob. It wasn't important for Kerr or Wightman. And I saw the spectators. Good crowd tonight but the rest of the meet was not very impressive.
I'm not trying to knock Jakob. The dude is incredible. He won the Olympics at 20 years old. I don't know how anyone can consider him a failure. But it's also okay to consider how this race affects his chances at the Olympics.
I think he would very much disagree with that. In this interview he talks about how good it feels to race, and how he makes progress with every race.
He'd disagree with what? I don't understand what you mean.
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