Canova was right! EPO does not work on trained athletes

Does Jemima Sumgong qualify as a "top level" runner?

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2017/apr/07/olympic-marathon-gold-sumgong-tests-positive-drugs

http://www.nation.co.ke/sports/athletics/Rosa-bans-Sumgong-Jepkesho-Rionoripo-dope-probe/1100-3932854-g6c0jt/index.html

Whoops.

It is just a coincidence.

where is the proof wrote:

Renato Canova wrote:

3) EPO DOESN'T WORK for the athletes at the top of the world (who already have different qualities than the best in the world, but not at the top) born, living and training ALWAYS in high altitude.

Well, since this claim can never be tested, it's an utterly meaningless statement. Why are you wasting everybody's time with this?

Canova is Esperanto for Witless Simp. Amzing / ridiculous this thread is still going.

Troll.Pup.at.Altitude.9,033ft. wrote:

Renato coached Rita Jeptoo in the past.

Renato has stated that Rita only used EPO before the 2014 Chicago marathon.

The statement was false.

This is getting preposterous - if Canova coaches Kenyans and is/has been compensated by them, then of course there will be some bias on the Kenyan doping issues...who would have thought. He seems to be on a crusade to obfuscate that EPO doesn't work with top Kenyans. The claim can't be proven scientifically as there are no studies on elites...can't imagine why. Anecdotally, it's a different story with some top performing Kenyans; Jeptoo, Chepchumba, and now recently Sumgong - an Olympic marathon champion (it doesn't get any better than that). Btw, good comment on Kisorio - couldn't agree more. And here's a few other Kenyon elites positive soley for EPO:

> Ronald Kipchumba Rutto

> Wilson Loyanae

> Julia Mumbi Muraga

There's also numerous Kenyans from the above list that have tested positive primarily for steroids, and I don't think you can rule out EPO use just because they only tested positive for androgens. Athletes very seldom use one PED...the EPO/blood doping + T/steriods seems to popular with some athletes...who could have imagined.

Troll.Pup.at.Altitude.9,033ft. wrote:

The IAAF determined that Rita had also taken EPO before the 2014 Boston Marathon when she ran her PR of 2:18:57. Her results from Boston were removed and she still owes the Boston Marathon $175,000, which she has not returned. She was banned for 4 years.

Yes. So, when do you think she started doping?

(Interestingly, that page still states "Jeptoo breaks course record with third Boston victory"...)

2013 2:19:57 Chicago, IL 13 OCT

2012 2:22:04 Chicago, IL 07 OCT

2011 2:25:44 Frankfurt 30 OCT

In any case, her PR at age 33 and course record on the hilly Boston course (without tailwind, which wouldn't have helped anyway) are probably due to finally getting serious with training and doing sit-ups and box jumps, and just coincidentally happened with the useless EPO in her blood.

Just saying, before rekrunner comes... This is fun.

Renato Canova wrote:

I see already I became a metropolitan legend.

I NEVER SAID STEROIDS DON'T WORK FOR AFRICAN, INSTEAD I SAID STEROIDS IS THE 95% OF THE DOPING OF AFRICAN.

I don't pretend everybody has read what I wrote in the past, but people can't continue to put in my mouth something I NEVER SAID.

So let's clarify this for the record, are you saying that if an African (any African I'm not picking on Kenyans) was doping, they would be using steriods?

Again

Very clear what is going on here with wada / iaaf and their agents ..................

The complete control of doping within the sport .

control of peds , the coaches ,the testing ...

agents like conova keep pushing various different angles

and misdirection and gatekeeping the obvious truth

that is the very purpose of wada

Submaximal: EPO no beuno

Maximal: EPO beuno

So, when one wins a grand tour, when and where are the big time gains?

TT and mountain top finishes, and they are the very definition of max efforts.

EPO works best when you push the hardest, EPO works.

On an interesting side note for runners Derek Clayton had a vo2max below 70, Coe & Snell were 72-73, so it is not the been all and end all of running ability.

Lance Armstrong lying? No, never.

I have wondered whether an athlete needs a couple of cycles to get the best from epo eg a 13:15 5k runner takes it during their next build-up, comes out and runs 13:04 then repeats it again in the next year's build-up and subsequently runs 12:57.

yes, it is like having one or two extra winters of good base training under your belt.

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

I have wondered whether an athlete needs a couple of cycles to get the best from epo eg a 13:15 5k runner takes it during their next build-up, comes out and runs 13:04 then repeats it again in the next year's build-up and subsequently runs 12:57.

What about Mourhit?

>13:06.20/1998

>12:58.45/1999

>12:49.71/2000

His positive was in 2002. I wonder what cycle and dosages he did? They might have liked that ~8 sec improvement from 98 - 99, and pushed it to a higher dose from 99 - 00 culminating with the ~9 sec jump to 12.49. This was all before the rHuEPO test was introduced where Mourhit and others of that period could dope with impunity.

Real World Analysis wrote:

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

I have wondered whether an athlete needs a couple of cycles to get the best from epo eg a 13:15 5k runner takes it during their next build-up, comes out and runs 13:04 then repeats it again in the next year's build-up and subsequently runs 12:57.

What about Mourhit?

>13:06.20/1998

>12:58.45/1999

>12:49.71/2000

His positive was in 2002. I wonder what cycle and dosages he did? They might have liked that ~8 sec improvement from 98 - 99, and pushed it to a higher dose from 99 - 00 culminating with the ~9 sec jump to 12.49. This was all before the rHuEPO test was introduced where Mourhit and others of that period could dope with impunity.

Well I wasn't far off, wasn't thinking about Mourhit more like Khalid Boulami (check out his 5,000m progression) and 'looky' 'looky' he arrived on the scene in 1994. Suspicious, anyone? Anyone?

Back to this EPO cycling study, the concerning thing is that the (erroneous) conclusions that EPO doesn't work has already gone viral around the world. Radio/tv hosts all over the place are saying on their shows, I heard this while sitting in traffic this morning, "Oh, you know that eeepeeoh drug that Lance Armstrong took, apparently it doesn't work, he was just wasting his time and all those Tour de France cyclists, no benefit." The damage has been done.

Anyway, where is rekrunner?

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

Well I wasn't far off, wasn't thinking about Mourhit more like Khalid Boulami (check out his 5,000m progression) and 'looky' 'looky' he arrived on the scene in 1994. Suspicious, anyone? Anyone?

Just looked that over...very interesting. Isn't he the brother of Brahim, who followed Mourhit's lead by testing positive in 2002 😉. Btw, good info on those VO2max's - I didn't know that with Snell & Coe...that's quite surprising.

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

Anyway, where is rekrunner?

If it's the same "rekrunner," I saw him posting on some nonsensical, stupid threats 😁

Huge damage. Can we expect a slew of lawyers suing left and right for

compensation?

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

Back to this EPO cycling study, the concerning thing is that the (erroneous) conclusions that EPO doesn't work has already gone viral around the world. Radio/tv hosts all over the place are saying on their shows, I heard this while sitting in traffic this morning, "Oh, you know that eeepeeoh drug that Lance Armstrong took, apparently it doesn't work, he was just wasting his time and all those Tour de France cyclists, no benefit." The damage has been done.

I don't see how EPO is ineffective with these two going nuclear on Ventoux...Lol (nice beat with this video):

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

Anyway, where is rekrunner?

Using other troll handles now, because he couldn't remain true to his "everyone-is-clean-and-everything-is-coincidental" rekrunner character without laughing out loud.

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

Well I wasn't far off, wasn't thinking about Mourhit more like Khalid Boulami (check out his 5,000m progression) and 'looky' 'looky' he arrived on the scene in 1994. Suspicious, anyone? Anyone?

I wouldn't get too excited about RWA's "breakthrough" analysis about Mourhit's 1998-2000 "progression" because the Belgian was a 1:00.18 half marathon runner and a 7:34 3000m runner in 1997, so his "real" progression from 1997 to 2000 is very modest and almost in the range of normal seasonal fluctuations.

Mourhit's ups and downs at that time period were discussed in almost too much detail in the thread below where RWA contributed, but that is no reason not to cherry pick a few numbers from here and there whenever it fits well into his story-of-the-day.

This isn't the first instance when his "time series" aren't too convincing to put it mildly. And this notion about RWA's modus operandi or about his state of mind is fully independent whether one thinks that I am a "pro-doper", "Lance fanboy", "Russian whitewasher" or a total idiot or all the aforementioned.

High-Octane Doping wrote:

Subway Surfers Addiction wrote:

Back to this EPO cycling study, the concerning thing is that the (erroneous) conclusions that EPO doesn't work has already gone viral around the world. Radio/tv hosts all over the place are saying on their shows, I heard this while sitting in traffic this morning, "Oh, you know that eeepeeoh drug that Lance Armstrong took, apparently it doesn't work, he was just wasting his time and all those Tour de France cyclists, no benefit." The damage has been done.

I don't see how EPO is ineffective with these two going nuclear on Ventoux...Lol (nice beat with this video):

https://youtu.be/6q38Gyjv4EE

This is clearly sub-maximal effort, just hobby-riders, a couple of weeks training and anyone can do that. A small hill, perhaps a bump at best.