The official HEPS track and field thread, 2015-2016

Sorry you weren't happy with that sentence - I was thinking how Awad won the 5km and 1500m last year and I couldn't remember the racing order. I currently have limited time to do the previews since I have a newborn to also care for right now. But I can correct that sentence.

Anyways, I learned today that there will be two webstreaming options for the Heps Sunday action - the Ivy League Digital Network and now, Flotrack. Still no Saturday coverage.

Earlier this season, I recall seeing both Flotrack and ILDN cover one of the Princeton mega meets (I believe it was Larry Ellis). To me, that makes sense since there would be limited viewership overlap as the ILDNwould focus more on the conference fans while Flotrack could appeal to the wider East Coast viewership.

But having both of them cover the same portion of a conference meet makes little since to me since they are both going to be fighting for the same viewing audience. Flotrack is asking people to pay $20 (in terms of $19.99 per month or $12.50 if you sign up for a year membership) while ILDN has a $9.95/day subscription option. I've never watched a live meet through Flotrack so I cannot say if they offer anything additional to the table (although I keep hearing of complaints of the commentary) so I cannot attest to their quality. ILDN has gotten better each Heps championship they cover, IMHO.

Does anyone else think this makes any sense for Flotrack AND ILDN to do this? I wish one of them could also provide Saturday coverage.

Ivyguy wrote:

Men: Cornell 185, Princeton 135, Penn 109, Dartmouth 74, Yale 58(!), Harvard 55, Brown 45, Columbia 15

Anybody else having trouble seeing this as a 50-point meet? Even if Cornell wins two throwing events, Princeton figures to outscore them in the throws--maybe come close to doubling Cornell's points in those events. And aren't the two teams pretty evenly matched everywhere else?

ahre wrote:

Ivyguy wrote:

Men: Cornell 185, Princeton 135, Penn 109, Dartmouth 74, Yale 58(!), Harvard 55, Brown 45, Columbia 15

Anybody else having trouble seeing this as a 50-point meet? Even if Cornell wins two throwing events, Princeton figures to outscore them in the throws--maybe come close to doubling Cornell's points in those events. And aren't the two teams pretty evenly matched everywhere else?

I dont' think it will be a 50 point meet - it typically comes out to be much closer than that. I think it will depend on how each team enters their athletes. Also, who knows how much wind-aided marks in the sprints and jumps boost team's potential scores? I know someone used to do a potential meet score by only using the athlete's best wind-legal marks. And secondly, the long distance events and 4x800 has participation gaps that will be filled in come race time, so that will adjust the scoring too. I am curious on how the potential scores will change once the heat sheets are released on Friday night.

I know Princeton's Josh Ingalls has not raced an open 800 yet this outdoor season, and he's the Indoor Heps 800m champ (he rank the 4x800 at Penn Relays, but his only other mark this season was from a 1500m at the end of March). If he is well and runs the 800m, his finish should boost Princeton's scores.

Entries and Start Lists are up!

http://www.leonetiming.com/2016/Outdoor/IvyLeague/

C/M Runner wrote:

Entries and Start Lists are up!

http://www.leonetiming.com/2016/Outdoor/IvyLeague/

Thanks!

Similarly, THANKS for the virtual scoring (based on entries) that you did at hepstrack.com!

I plan to be at the meet. IIRC, the last time Princeton hosted a Heps with terribly unseasonable weather, the Big Red came away with a win:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6faeFJsj0l4

BRF wrote:

Similarly, THANKS for the virtual scoring (based on entries) that you did at hepstrack.com!

I plan to be at the meet. IIRC, the last time Princeton hosted a Heps with terribly unseasonable weather, the Big Red came away with a win:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6faeFJsj0l4

Did Hepstrack score it? Oh well, I did as well:

I tried to score it straight down the descending order list, with the only changes being I guess on the 4 x 800 using some combo of Penn Relays and Indoor results and I also put Courtney Smith as winning the 5000 (since half of her 10k time would be the #1 seed in the 5k) and moved everyone down.

I got a slightly different score than hepstrack.com

Here are my scores (Hepstrack is in (),). Please tell me if youknow where I made a mistake.

Men

Cornell 195 (185)

Princeton 131 (137)

Penn 95 (105)

Dartmouth 72 (70)

Harvard 62 (57)

Yale 57 (58)

Brown 531 (48)

Columbia 17 (15)

Women

Harvard 219 (225.2)

Princeton 122 (122.4)

Cornell 87 (92.2)

Penn 71 (86)

Columbia 63 (53)

Darmtouth 52 (46.2)

Brown 43 (35)

Yale 25 (27)

Does anyone know where I made a mistake? I seem to be most off on the Penn men and women .

I just realized that Harvard could win the meet easily with 8 women.

Harvards Superstars Yr Points Events

Gabrielle Thomas Fr 29 100, 200, LJ

Allison Morrison Sr 20 LJ, HJ, Heptathlon

Paige Kouba Sr 20 1500/Steeplechase

Autumne Franklin Sr 20 100h/400h

Nikki Okwelogu Jr 20 Shot/Discus

Courtney Smith So 20 5k/10k

Jade Miller Jr 16 100h/400h

Madison Hansen Sr. 16 Hepathlon/100H

Total 161

Why can't Brown University win ONE men's outdoor T&F title? Just once!

I had a mistake in my wome'ns 4 x 100. Add 8 more points to Cornell women.

I only did the descending order lists. I did not guess the finish of any "NTs" entered other than the relays where I used the numerical order presented in the entries. I think that could be the main difference...

Did you get Lane Russel for Triple on Princeton? That was the only one I saw that people might not be factoring in. Mark from indoors or last year outdoors would put him third on descending order list

Men's 10k and women's discus are the only remaining Day 1 finals right now.

# qualifiers for Day 2:

Men

Cornell - 17

Princeton - 14

Columbia - 7

Brown & Dartmouth - 5

Penn - 4

Harvard & Yale - 3

Women

Dartmouth - 10

Harvard & Cornell - 9

Columbia & Princeton - 8

Penn & Yale - 5

Brown - 4

Hope to do updated projected scores once those finals are done.

Ok, the women were done first, and here are my recalculated meet scores based on the results from Day 1 and keeping the entry scores for the 5k, SC, relays, TJ, SP, JT, and hept (hopefully I did this right!)

The Harvard women's 95 point cushion has shrunk to 54 points over host Princeton, while Brown has gained 21 points based on today's results.

Adjusted Heps Projected Scores - Women (difference from scoring based on entry scoring)

Harvard - 180.25 (-30 points)

Princeton - 126.25 (+11 points)

Cornell - 92.25 (-5 points)

Penn - 73 (-2 points)

Dartmouth - 63.25 (+8 points)

Columbia - 63 (-1 point)

Brown - 58 (+21 points)

Yale - 28 (-1 point)

Men recalculated meet scores

Cornell still has a good cushion over Princeton in the men's competition - 54 points compared to 61 points in the entry projected scoring. Dartmouth was the most impacted by today's races as they lost 15 points compared to the scores we shared yesterday, making it a tight battle with them, Brown, and Yale for mid-pack results.

Adjusted Heps Projected Scores - Men (difference from scoring based on entries)

Cornell- 199 (+2 points)

Princeton - 145 (+9 points)

Penn - 95 (0)

Dartmouth - 59 (-15 point)

Brown- 57 (+6 points)

Yale - 57 (-1 point)

Harvard - 47 (-9 points)

Columbia - 21 (+4 points)

They are simulcast, as in shared feed, not both doing it at the same time. ILDN is doing the broadcast and giving their feed to Flo Track. Flo Track did footage and interviews today that may be used in the broadcast tomorrow.

A little surprised not to see more of a to-do about Rudy Winkler's winning 75.10 in the hammer throw. It's the NCAA national leader, it broke the all-time Ivy League record, and it beat the sixth-place scorer's best by exactly 17m--about 56 feet!

Winkler's worst legal throw would have won the competition and he threw one that banged off the cage on its way out and still went 70m. Unbelievable!

Here's the deal. The Ivy Leauge got flotrack to cover two regular season meets and in exchange said they'd let them stream the Ivies broadcast on flo.

I've updated the projected scores after day 1. COming into the meet, it looked likely that the Harvard women would a) break the all time scoring record and margin of victory record but now both are in doubt as Smith it out of the 10k and 5k. The latest projections have them scoring 188 and winning by 55 (using today's results for the completed events and the seed marks for everything else). The record is 191.5 points (2003) and largest margin of victory is 78 (2002).

On the other side of the ledger, it's possible that the Cornell men break both records. In 2008, the Cornell team I was coaching for set the record at 199 points and a 71 point margin of victory. THe latest projections are for Cornell to score 203 and win by 69.

Speaking of Cornell's throws, Kevin Benson's third place showing in the Discus has me feeling a little uneasy. And by uneasy I actually mean that there's no way he threw that far and there had to have been a measuring error. Now before you all proceed with an indictment of libel and harass me for tarnishing the young man's performance or calling into question the officiating staff, hear me out.

Here's every make Benson has posted in first season with Cornell, according to the almighty TFRRS:

43.87m

46.17m

48.31m

47.38m

48.00m

and today he threw 55.84m

His 6 throws today were as follows:

55.84m

42.48m

47.37m

47.02m

45.60m

45.50m

I'm just gonna skip the Z test and go ahead and call this one statistically significant. I hate to call a guy out like this, but it just doesn't add up. I understand athletes sometimes really show up for HEPS and all, but a 25 feet PR is a hell of a mark up. I mean he never came within 8 meters of his first throw for the rest of the competition!

This isn't the first time discus measurements have been called into question this season, as Sam Mattis' world leading throw was a hot topic a few weeks back. From my understanding, the event was supposed to be held on the infield but was moved down to where the Hammer throw is due to looming weather. Is it possible that in the confusion there was a measurement mistake on his first heave? If so, thats huge. A 10 point swing for Cornell over Princeton.