Mihaly Igloi

It is really pity that coach Igloi doesn’t live for having with him a great discuss, a lot of questions, arguments, putting down all of the new aspects.When I was young –a student of physical education-i often asked him but I didn’t have the knowledge and the experience that I’ ve got now.Once I was asking him why his athletes never doing stretches, gymnastings or weight lifting.He replied to me, “do you have you the solist playing violin?how fast move his fingers?Know that this man never lift weights or make stretches, he only practices again and again.Same happens with the leopard.It is the faster animal with no weight lifting.”

The two important points on coach Igloi training system were first that the original program could change several times, depends on athlete’s shape and second that every athlete had his own program

Some words from Jim Beatty:

“Igloi was able to dissect the ability of each runner.He functioned like a human computer.Everyone’s workout was designed specifically for him or her; each workout was part of a master training plan for the athlete.Within the space of a half-hour, Igloi might be dispense 40 different workouts to the 40 runners working under him.This scene would replay itself three or four times in the afternoon because he rarely revealed more than one part of the workout at the time.Before arriving at the track, we never knew what kind of training session we would be doing.This never bother anyone, because we all regarded Igloi so highly.Besides, we were happy not to have to worry about this daily concern.Igloi took care of everything…………………

Those who trained under him were always amazed at how he could give specific reasons for so many workouts for so many different runners.During the years I trained with him, I never did the same workout twice.If a became an Igloi disciple, I had a good reason:after six months with him I broke four minutes for the mile and set an American record in the procces……………

After I had been with him for three years, he said, “Now the hard training can begin.Now you can go ahead.”In other words, your stamina kept increasing so you could train harder and harder, continuing to improve year after year.”

I am sure that some posts readers will have their objections because Igloi’s training system it is difficult to be understood in terms other training models, exactly for this reason there is no model.Of course could somebody to discuss many things about his philosophy despite he is not in life

you are right about a couple of things that have now, come to pass with science and proven by example: 1) all the pre stretching, before a workout or race is NOT a good thing and could actually hurt you in possible injuries and performance. Stretching AFTER a workout or race, carefully, can help. Stretching BEFORE a race or workout has been totally overrated for the past 30 years!

the other point about weight lifting....true again.....I ran my fastest times on the track during a period where I did no lifting at all....and I had a good kick.....as one of Igloi's coaching contempories and rivals, Arthur Lydiard said, way back in the early 60s....Murry Halberg, a world class middle distance runner of his from New Zealand, who had a withered arm due to a permanent injury, never had a problem with his racing or kicking at the end of a race......again, Igloi was right.....weight lifting and stretching....both overrated.

Comments of Igloi’s training system from Jim Beatty:

“Basically, the Igloi system is interval training. If its essence is speed, its foundation is stamina. Over a period of time the runner is exposed to high mileage through many shorts repetitions. The preponderance of short, fast repeats is such that a runner could cover 100 miles a week without ever running farther than 400m. in a sustained burst. This is not to say that Igloi’s runners never take longer, more relaxing runs-we often met for Sunday morning “play runs” along Santa Monica beaches –but the emphasis was always the stamina through speed.

Most runners I meet don’t understand interval speed training. They either think that you supposed to burn yourself out with some blazers, or that you should run a lot of slow intervals to fit in with your roadwork program. In its purest sense, interval training is controlled training. The purpose is to combine the qualitative with the quantitative. If you’re running 24*200m with a 100m jog, you should be able to run the last 200 as fast as the first. If you run the first repeats too fast, and slow down at the end, you ‘re losing the qualitative speed factor.

Correctly done interval training combines the quantitative and qualitative factors. Today’s runners find it easy to understand the quantitative. They know all about 60-and 80- and 100-mile training weeks. The thing that made Igloi unique was the way he had us put those miles together. I typically trained 13 times a week-an hour in the morning and hours in the afternoon. I took three days off-Christmas, New Year’s and Easter .Although it was reported otherwise, I never trained three times a day……………..

Igloi allowed no walking during the workouts. He wanted the body constantly in motion. He was a taskmaster and a disciplinarian. Because the training was so hard to often , it was easy to resent him. I recall often cursing him under my breath when I was feeling sorry for myself in midworkout. Even here , Igloi knew that the coach must maintain rigid authority. When you are tired and hurting , it’s easy to cut your workout short or back off. With Igloi around, you didn’t have to worry about that.”

If I recall, Lydiard's guys and Igloi's guys had a good rivalry going in the early 60's. Can any of you seniors from that era speak to that? Did they hate but respect each other? Like each other? How did that all go down there in the early 60's? If you throw Bowerman's guys in, like Dyrol Burleson, Jim Bailey, etc; you had some real fireworks between 1960 and 1965.

In February 1962 at the Los Angeles Times indoor track meet Igloi’s runners and Lydiard’s ones were at this meeting but in different races. First Murray Halberg won the two-mile race in 8:42.5 . Then Peter Snell set a new world record at 1000yards race in 2:06.Two weeks earlier he had set a mile world record , running in 3:54.4.Snell and Halberg with their coach Arthur Lydiard were sitting in the stands of the arena when Jim Beatty broke the indoor world record at the mile in 3:58.9, lowering by 2.5 seconds the previous record which held by Ron Delany.

Said Snell: “I ‘m glad I was not at that mile.I don’t think I would do so well on the boards.”

just as Kenny Moore, just wrote a book "Bowerman and the men of Oregon".....someone should write a book on Igloi and his runners and his interesting life.

My first real coach was Tabori and I find this Igloi thread fascinating. I've been reading Kenny's book and just finished the section on the Igloi runners and the contrasting work styles. I was really clueless as a kid about the things we did, but Tabori had us follow a hard day/ easy day schedule, the easy day was "go run for an hour". Anyone contemplating a book should not forget that the Hungarian interval method was adapted by Laszlo with great success and he had a huge impact on women's distance running in the 70's.

did you run with Babaraki and Sutherland in the late 70's/early 80s, with Tabori and the SFVTC? Did he train Julie Brown and some of those Naturite women? I think he trained Miki Gorman.

When coach Igloi started training his runners in California some American coaches wanted to know about his training methods. But coach had no relationship with nobody except his athletes. One of coaches decided to learn more about coach Igloi training system. So, therefore send his assistant coach to watch the training of Igloi’s runners. For a week he was at the top of a belltower which was aside of the track where coach Igloi’s runners group were training.

When assistant coach came back, his headcoach asked him what type of training Igloi was applying. His answer was that he couldn’t understand the kind of the training.He said, “thirty runners make thirty different programs, run up-down , on the track or on the grass hundreds of 110yards without any sense”.

On June 1960 at Modesto Relays mile race, some of Igloi’s runners competed with some runners of Oregon. Jim Beatty and Laszlo Tabori met Dyrol Burleson, George Larson and Bill Dellinger. In that race was going to run the great Herb Elliot but a knee problem made him in withdrawal. Anyway in a wise-planed by Igloi race where the “dog eat dog”, Beatty destroyed Burleson’s finishing kicks set a new record .His time was 3:58, while Burleson run 3:59.2 and Tabori 4:00.0.

What was the strategy used by Beatty, per Igloi? Did he start his kick early - say 500-600 out from the finish?

Hey Perspective! Another old MSJ runner out here! Contact me please....

As for training, Yes, Jack Marden came from this system, and thus everything I read in this post is great. We never, never asked Coach Marden what we were doing. He would just tell us to run 9 x 300 build to good, then go and see him. You never left your workout on the track because you never knew when you were done. The thing that I think is great about this, is just like in racing, pacing and effort change and need to change when you race. You have to pick it up to go past someone, or to stay with the break that is going on.

We ran 100 strides everyday at practice. He watched all our workouts, except Mondays when he chased us up Mill Creek Road. And he would not hesitate to "pull" you from a workout if things were not going well. The other thing he would do is if he told you to run a 400 in "whatever," don't even bother running it faster, because he would tell you that you ran the time he told you to...Coach Marden to me was one of the greatest High School coaches ever. And if you look at the teams he produced, it speaks for itself.

Sports Illustrated June 6 1960

By Tex Maule

“………..After an early morning workout-they were out (Beatty and Tabori) on the track sprinting up and the grass. Then they rested in the hotel in downtown Modesto, waiting for Igloi to tell them what to do.

“I don’t know how I’ ll run,” Beatty said. “Igloi hasn’t told me. I ‘ll run however he says.”

Igloi briefed his two runners only a couple hours before the race. His instructions were precise and detailed almost to the 10th of a second. The first quarter mile was to be run in 57 seconds, with Beatty setting the pace. The time at the half mile was to be between 1:57 and 1:58, with Tabori leading the way on the second lap. The first 150 yards of the third lap with both Tabori and Beatty leading and running hard but not dropping back, either. Then they were to run hard enough to finish the three-quarters in three minutes flat.

“The last lap was dog eat dog,” Beatty said later. “We were on our own.”…………

Ta the gun , Beatty, following Igloi’s orders, took the lead. He is a small man-5 feet 6 and 128 pounds-and he runs nearly straight up, with his chest out, churning away on muscular sprinter’s legs. He ran the first lap in 57.9 seconds, less than a second off Igloi’s timetable. Just as he finished the lap Tabori, on schedule , took over. Burleson following his plan , stayed in third place well off the pace.

Tabori hit the half mile in 1:58 right on Igloi’s timetable, with Beatty a stride behind and Burleson still following-as he had planned-10 yards behind. And at the three quarter-mile mark Tabori was in the lead at 2:59.7. Beatty, exactly on the 10th second, finished the third lap in three minutes flat, as Igloi had told him to do. Burleson had begun to close up by now , preparing for his strong finishing kick, and he was only a few strides behind Beatty.

In the last lap-the “dog eat dog” lap for Tabori nad Beatty-Igloi’s wisdom was quickly apparent. He had planned the race to destroy the finishing kicks of both Elliot and Burleson.(Elliot decided not to run about 10 minutes before the race began) Now Burleson ,worn down more than he realized by the killing early pace, tried to pass Tabori and Beatty, who had moved into the lead, on the backstretch. He got past Tabori, but Beatty, hearing his coming, began his own kick and held him off by half a yard apart. Then Beatty, running very strongly, drew away and left the laboring Burleson eight yards behind at the finish. His time was 3:58, Burleson’s 3:59.2, Tabori’s 4:00.0.

“This is the first time since I’ve been running that I didn’t have any kick at the end,” Burleson said after the race. “I made the last turn and said to myself, Where’s the kick? And it wasn’t there. They burned it out of me. That Beatty is America’s best miler. I’ll have to train hard to beat that guy.”

Dave was always at our SFVTC tues/thursday sessions. I can't say I ran with him though! I don't recall Sutherland, but I was just a teenager pretty focused on my own thing and don't remember all the names. My group included Miki, Jacqui Hansen, Leal Ann Rinehart, Vicki Cook, Kiki (another mighty mite about Vicki's age - sub 5 minute mile 11 year olds)and Sue Kinsey, who later went to Naturite (our arch rival team coached by the Infamous Chuck Debus). I was with Tabori from 74-the end of 77 and then headed North to Oregon.

mistake, I ran with Tabori from fall of 74 to the end of 76, then off to OTC and ducks.

you just missed the big influx of midwestern distance runners, graduated from college who moved out and ran with Joe Douglas at the SMTC from around '77 to 85. That ad they had in T & F News was like a magnet to those of us who still wanted to keep running and were left with no support system, once we were out of college.

runamook,

I ran with Tabori during the same time period, almost exactly. I started with Lazlo in February of 1975, and ran thru the Culver City Marathon in December of 1976. My training group for most of that time was Babaracki and Sutherland. I recall one session that I ram with Dave where we ran 2400m, 2000m, 1600m, and 1200m all at about 4:30 mile pace. Soon afterwards I ran my best 3000 meters.

Ghost of Igloi

way to "put the guts to it!" , ghost.

runamook,

Too funny, yes I recall that Lazlo-ism. I also remember some runner giving Lazlo a hard time at practice. I don't recollect why, but anyhow, Tabori tells him: "I'm not your dog. Geta Hell outa here!" The athlete didn't say another word, he was just gone.

Ghost of Igloi

Coach Tabori learned well from Coach Igloi!