The morons who run Let's Run never cease to blow. High school kid breaks Jim Ryun's ancient U20 1500 record, and their first article is "why Kessler's time is not as impressive as all these SLOWER times."
https://www.letsrun.com/news/2021/05/hobbs-kessler-ran-amazing-but/
Just stunningly ill-conceived.
Their coverage of the first moon landing would be, "Yeah, they landed on the moon, BUT . . . ."
runderun wrote:
raging clue wrote:
Kessler finished fifth but less than a second behind Engels. Looks like he got boxed in slightly after the last turn so probably could’ve shaved another half second off his already amazing time. If he runs at the Trials I can see him nipping Engels.
The spikes have nothing to do with these times, it’s funny reading comments about the supposed advantage they offer. No clear evidence
Almost everyone hit a PR in that race and it's crazy how often that has happened over the last year. That included Mason Ferlic running 3:35. He hasn't run a 1500 for 4 years so he was probably due a revision to his old PR. But he has run the mile. In 2019 he ran 4:01, last year he ran 3:58. His performance yesterday converts to a 3:53 mile. It's just not plausible that someone improves that much so late in their career without some kind of boost.
I'll enjoy the racing at the Olympics, but I can't celebrate times or records in the distance events anymore
Ferlic has been one of the few top runners to come out and say the new shoes are offering a big bump in performance, but I think his massive PR is a little bit misleadingly big. He split 3:55 in a DMR 1600 back in 2016, so I bet he was in 3:38/3:39 shape five years ago.
Larry Dickman wrote:
The morons who run Let's Run never cease to blow. High school kid breaks Jim Ryun's ancient U20 1500 record, and their first article is "why Kessler's time is not as impressive as all these SLOWER times."
https://www.letsrun.com/news/2021/05/hobbs-kessler-ran-amazing-but/Just stunningly ill-conceived.
Their coverage of the first moon landing would be, "Yeah, they landed on the moon, BUT . . . ."
Super shoes are the major controversy of these times and this site has had articles and threads about them and how recent performances should be evaluated compared to the past.
Visitors to this site care about this issue and it would have been strange if it hand't been brought up especially since it was such a big improvment in PR. Though it would have been nice to establish what shoes he was wearing.
What's really a bad look is all these posters trying to shout down discussion.
That's hard hitting journalism for you. The kid drops a six second pr in a crowded field, looking great at the end, dusting Webb's converted 1500m time by 2 seconds and crushing Jim Ryun's 56 year old American junior 1500m record by 2 seconds as well, going 3 tenths under the new in-season collegiate record, and all we see are six reasons this isn't as good as Webb. It is every bit as good as Webb and then some. This was a rare American race with the field going faster than 3:35, but then so was that Pre mile with El Guerrouj, Bernard Lagat, and Alan Webb. The spikes are not having a measurable impact, in contrast to the road shoes. This kid is the future, and maybe he'll even make the finals at the Trials.
Chef Gordon Ramzi wrote:
Jakob is the greatest teenage athlete ever and likely the clean WR holder at 1500 and possibly even the 5000. Insulting to compare him to some random American kid.
Lol wow now. Best teenage 1500m athlete, or whatever ya wanna say, ok. He wouldn’t be in the top 500 athletes in one class of US graduates lol.
Don’t confuse being a good distance runner with being an athlete or athletic.
Larry Dickman wrote:
The morons who run Let's Run never cease to blow. High school kid breaks Jim Ryun's ancient U20 1500 record, and their first article is "why Kessler's time is not as impressive as all these SLOWER times."
https://www.letsrun.com/news/2021/05/hobbs-kessler-ran-amazing-but/Just stunningly ill-conceived.
Their coverage of the first moon landing would be, "Yeah, they landed on the moon, BUT . . . ."
I agree 100% with you. Some of the so called reasons that gave make no sense, such as Webb running in the fancy pro race. Please! For many runners, being in the larger race with the world class runners is a motivator and spur on great performance, not inhibit it.
Kessler blew away Webb’s record - end of story. Had Kessler broken the record by 0.2 seconds, that’s one thing, but the record was massively crushed.
The only disadvantage Webb had was being on tv and there being expectations of a strong performance. Unfortunately, that seemed to be one of the factors that affected Webb his whole career and he never solved it.
zcxvzxcv wrote:
That's hard hitting journalism for you. The kid drops a six second pr in a crowded field, looking great at the end, dusting Webb's converted 1500m time by 2 seconds and crushing Jim Ryun's 56 year old American junior 1500m record by 2 seconds as well, going 3 tenths under the new in-season collegiate record, and all we see are six reasons this isn't as good as Webb. It is every bit as good as Webb and then some. This was a rare American race with the field going faster than 3:35, but then so was that Pre mile with El Guerrouj, Bernard Lagat, and Alan Webb. The spikes are not having a measurable impact, in contrast to the road shoes. This kid is the future, and maybe he'll even make the finals at the Trials.
Super shoes and super spikes are real. Hobbes isn't in a separate universe.
DontForgetTheShoes wrote:
Larry Dickman wrote:
The morons who run Let's Run never cease to blow. High school kid breaks Jim Ryun's ancient U20 1500 record, and their first article is "why Kessler's time is not as impressive as all these SLOWER times."
https://www.letsrun.com/news/2021/05/hobbs-kessler-ran-amazing-but/Just stunningly ill-conceived.
Their coverage of the first moon landing would be, "Yeah, they landed on the moon, BUT . . . ."
Super shoes are the major controversy of these times and this site has had articles and threads about them and how recent performances should be evaluated compared to the past.
Visitors to this site care about this issue and it would have been strange if it hand't been brought up especially since it was such a big improvment in PR. Though it would have been nice to establish what shoes he was wearing.
What's really a bad look is all these posters trying to shout down discussion.
No, Webb ran on a superior track and had infinitely better spikes than Ryun, just as Ryun ran on a better track and had better shoes than his predecessor. When you have to bring up crowd size, enthusiasm, and wind speed, you're just churning out loads of grossly opinionated BS.
It's the shoes it's the shoes it's the shoes.
He bounced his way to 3:34.
Is it true he is a rock climber too?
Chef Gordon Ramzi wrote:
Jakob is the greatest teenage athlete ever and likely the clean WR holder at 1500 and possibly even the 5000. Insulting to compare him to some random American kid.
Lol. Got a bridge to sell you if you think either of them are clean.
He's running the 4x8, 800, and 1600 at the Michigan State Meet next weekend. Should be good!
Last night, US high schooler Hobbs Kessler stole the headlines despite finishing 5th place in the 1500 at the Portland Track Festival. His time of 3:34.36 broke Alan Webb‘s 20-year-old US high school record of 3:38.26, which came in the midst of his legendary 3:53.43 mile which was run 20 years and two days before Kessler’s 1500. Kessler’s time is also faster than Jim Ryun‘s US U20 record of 3:36.1, which had stood since 1966, and is actually faster than Yared Nuguse‘s collegiate record (3:34.68) as well.
So....... if Ryan did (3:36.1) at the 1500m point on his way to a full 3:51.3 mile as a (19 and under junior) Right? So, if Kessler's (3:34.36) 1500m converts to a 3:51 miles as well - assuming he maintains or increases the momentum/pace the last 100.9 meters to gain equal distance for the full mile, I still see Ryan's effort as slightly superior knowing that he had to go longer; especially on a cinder/gravel track with crap spikes.
Fasterer wrote:
Chef Gordon Ramzi wrote:
The training wouldn't even be relevant.
It's the shoes. I repeat. It's the mf'ing shoes. The sooner we all come to grips with that the better.
If the clown shoes had existed in 2001 Webb would have run 3:49 with el G winning in 3:45. Facts.
Yeah, whatever dude.
Shoes might help kipchoge in a two hour race but they're not making any of the pros that Kessler just outkicked faster.
They all have the same shoes and he just blew by half of them in the past lap.
He also went faster than the entire NCAA has despite the entire NCAA having access to those same spikes.
...Have you seen the spikes Jim Ryun ran in???
The spikes from 1980s are WAY better than the spikes Ryun ran in, BTW. ....Do we say Come was inferior to Ryun because Coe ran in super spikes in comparison. ....Have you seen the track Ryun ran on compared to say, Monaco??
Puh-phukking-leeze drop it with the shoes bs.
Kessler is a MF badass runner dude.
Get over it.
great reply. thanks for telling it how it is. all these idiots and their talk about the shoes have no clue.
everyone that claims this is only because of the shoes are also saying that every collegiate runner including cole and teare sucks then.
oh well......
Chef Gordon Ramzi wrote:
It's the shoes it's the shoes it's the shoes.
He bounced his way to 3:34.
Well, we should all look forward to Tim C running 3:21 this summer
Oh Please wrote:
Chef Gordon Ramzi wrote:
The training wouldn't even be relevant.
It's the shoes. I repeat. It's the mf'ing shoes. The sooner we all come to grips with that the better.
If the clown shoes had existed in 2001 Webb would have run 3:49 with el G winning in 3:45. Facts.
If it's the shoes, why did he run the 3rd fastest 1500 of the year? What are all the pros doing, it's almost June? Going to go to the trials and hope to pick up the standard there?
Because he trains with pros. And the shoes definitely play a part. Too many records broken in them to say otherwise. The run is still impressive no one is saying that it isn't. But let's be real
bjergsoe1 wrote:
everyone that claims this is only because of the shoes are also saying that every collegiate runner including cole and teare sucks then.
oh well......
It isn't ONLY because of the shoes. But let's be real.
In the first full track season since they have come out
We have had:
Indoor ncaa 1500m record
Outdoor ncaa 1500 record
Indoor ncaa mile record
Indoor hs mile record
Outdoor hs mile record
And I feel like we can almost bet on another record at the ncaa championships
Rather than argue about the effects of the shoes on the absolute times being run currently...from a relative standpoint, can we just appreciate that this is faster than any collegiate athlete has run in the 1500 in these exact same shoes.
Don't feel like doing the research, but anyone know the last time a HS athlete led the NCAA performance lists at the end of the outdoor season?
NOPETOYOU! wrote:
Last night, US high schooler Hobbs Kessler stole the headlines despite finishing 5th place in the 1500 at the Portland Track Festival. His time of 3:34.36 broke Alan Webb‘s 20-year-old US high school record of 3:38.26, which came in the midst of his legendary 3:53.43 mile which was run 20 years and two days before Kessler’s 1500. Kessler’s time is also faster than Jim Ryun‘s US U20 record of 3:36.1, which had stood since 1966, and is actually faster than Yared Nuguse‘s collegiate record (3:34.68) as well.
So....... if Ryan did (3:36.1) at the 1500m point on his way to a full 3:51.3 mile as a (19 and under junior) Right? So, if Kessler's (3:34.36) 1500m converts to a 3:51 miles as well - assuming he maintains or increases the momentum/pace the last 100.9 meters to gain equal distance for the full mile, I still see Ryan's effort as slightly superior knowing that he had to go longer; especially on a cinder/gravel track with crap spikes.
This Hobbs is imho very very good ...!
The kid just ran on a great track and superspikes the equivalent of ~ 3:51.5 mile... being towed around the track, using other athletes as targets and pacing; finished 5th, (as did A. Webb)
Now on the other hand; Ryun racing on ash or dirt; with the adidas of 1966 ... ; Ryun ran in front and ran alone and obviously finishing first.; running an actual 3:51.3 mile @ 19yo.
Ryun set the WR twice 3:51:3 (1966) & 3:51.1 (1967) on ash/dirt & 19/20yo.
Here’s another great fact and challenge , Ryun ran solo gun to tape at his Kanas State Meet 3:58.3, the only HS boy to accomplish this in 1965 ... again on dirt.
Hobbs and Webb great; Ryun otherworldly.