Nico Young runs 4:10, 4:16 in practice!!!

It definitely is historic, but I think Young is going to make history. He also seems to be an absolute aerobic beast, so he can handle that volume better than most. Really hard 800 pace workouts would probably take a lot more out of him.

Also, If we scaled the workout to an 800 ( 400,200,400,200), and the runner was a 2:00 guy the workout would be something like 58.3, 29.7, 59.7, 29.4. It would definitely be a tough workout, but no one would bat an eye and say that kid's going to burn himself out since it's just a 2:00 guy.

I know that example isn't exactly equivalent but I think it gets my point across that - Nico runs really fast workouts because he's really fast. Does no one remember when Makhloufi ran an 800,500,400,300 all at 1:44 pace? He seemed to do okay.

As I will say time and time again: 50+% of an athlete's success has ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to do with the coach. It is first and foremost the genetic makeup and personal habits the athlete brings TO THE COACH that matters.

The entire team would benefit from listening to Leftover Crack and Choking Victim.

Wow, kid can run 7:50 right now... but it seems awfully early to be that fit.

Thought the same thing and also what is the progression?

The name of the game for kids is to earn a free education anything after that is just icing on the cake. It’s not easy to waste 10 yrs of your life chasing a medal and earning maybe 50-100k a year. Nobody in the real world gives a rats arse about the Olympics these days. And god forbid they do not medal the running cult (community) only knows how to tear down runners not build them up. In this community everyone is a world class Coach but a never been runner

Nico is great. Ryun was better.

Ryun went to the Olympics at age 17 after his junior year and ran a 3:55 mile on a dirt track his senior year. In that 3:55 race, he beat Peter Snell who was the #1 miler in the world at the time. The world record at the time was 3:53.6.

To merely equal Ryun, Nico would have to qualify for the Olympic team this year. He would have to beat Timothy Cheruiyot. He would have to be run the mile in around 3:45 (two seconds off the current world record).

colorunner123 wrote:

Nico is great. Ryun was better.

Ryun went to the Olympics at age 17 after his junior year and ran a 3:55 mile on a dirt track his senior year. In that 3:55 race, he beat Peter Snell who was the #1 miler in the world at the time. The world record at the time was 3:53.6.

To merely equal Ryun, Nico would have to qualify for the Olympic team this year. He would have to beat Timothy Cheruiyot. He would have to be run the mile in around 3:45 (two seconds off the current world record).

Well first of all Ryun was a 800/mile guy and Nico is a 3000/5000 guy. Ryun is definitely better thus far in their careers, but because of his individual performances and times, not his world rankings.

Not super fair to compare him based on world ranking. Ethiopia and Kenya were hardly even competitive on the world stage back then. The USA was far less diverse in athletics too. It’s just more competitive now.

Looks like ALAN WEBB

I presume I'm not the only one who rolls their eyes every time they see another "Look at the great workout that someone did" post? Geez. On the one hand, sure, folks can find whatever they want interesting. And certainly the volume and/or "quality" of elite runners' training is of interest. But any given workout? Again, geez. You don't see breathless stories about how well Mahomes threw the ball on a Wed at practice. And for good reason.

No, it's not. Parenting is a constant for every coach though admittedly it's more of an issue in some schools/demographics than others. But I'm also not necessarily talking about specific individual athletes as much as I am a coach's overall record. I'm betting we can all name a few high school programs that have kids and teams at or near the top year in and year out but who overall develop poorly or not at all later on.

Zero respect for high school coaches like that. It's much easier to get your kids to run fantastic in high school if you're willing to make long-term sacrifices for short-term gains.[/quote]

There are a lot of people who think like this and close to none of them have actually coached anyone who has reached the national level. It’s easy to blame the high school coach in this manner and think ok they must be running 60-70+ miles a week and/or doing tons of hard speed workouts but it’s just not the case a lot of times. You could have a kid not improve because they grew up in Socal and then move off to Washington, Oregon, DC, Boston, etc and suddenly it’s darker and or wetter than they are used to for months at a time. That can really throw someone off. Or they put on 10-20 pounds and it only helps them in the shorter distances they don’t even race. Or they aren’t used to doing tons of speed work and then go to a school where the coach says the training is tailored to each individual but actually that’s total horse sh.t and only said to help recruit them so they get pounded with tons of speed even though that was never their strength and never will be.

Moving away to college means your entire life changes: your friends, your teammates, the type of training you do, your diet, your sleep patterns, having a roommate all of a sudden, being able to get blackout drunk without mom or dad knowing, etc.

One of my friends went to Jesuit a while back and was national class. He went off to Arkansas and ran like trash but it wasn’t because of his high school coach, it’s because he drank more alcohol than one should be able to without dying. If I blamed anyone in that scenario it would be his dad that was an extreme disciplinarian and didn’t let him be a kid at home so he went nuts in college.[/quote]

I think another factor for kids moving on to success in the college program has to do with team culture. Kids who come from a great HS team that has had a lot of success, close bonds with teammates and coaches, knowledgeable coaching, etc. sometimes find that the college team isn't quite the same thing. Whether you agree with the particular HS 'system' or not, the kids/team run well, and most good HS coaches are good at individualizing training because we have to be. Sucks to blame the coach of a successful HS program for the lack of support and atmosphere on some college teams. I have kids who are running well at the next level. Most are in their first or second year of college now and all have improved based on cross performances and /or on the track. None will be superstars in college, I don't think. Most were state champions or better in HS in either cross or track, or both. Some of my former athletes love their new college team/coach and others admit that it just isn't the same as in HS as far as culture and coaching. But they are sticking with it anyway, at least so far. But I could see other things becoming more important to them if the rewards of being on the team start diminishing in their eyes.

Another issue is that many college coaches have their system and their 'individualization' only works within their system, which just means they don't really individualize. I have one girl whose college coach never bothered to even ask me about her HS training who became injured almost immediately when she went off to his team, because while he promised to individualize training based on what the athlete told him, that was a load of crap. The girl had no chance of handling 50 mile weeks but was forced to not only almost double her mileage, but had to run it all a lot faster as well. Sorry, that's bad coaching. 5 out of 7 of his freshmen ended up injured and didn't finish the season.

Zat0pek wrote:

. I'm betting we can all name a few high school programs that have kids and teams at or near the top year in and year out but who overall develop poorly or not at all later on.

What is the school that has runners that develop more later on? What is the school that is cranking out the future DI AA, sub 14:00 5k runners or heck even just kids who end up with faster lifetime PRs than those powerhouse programs?

The powerhouse schools get criticized for their 9:10. runners not turning into 13:50 guys. But lets not forget these same kids would be 9:40 runners at most schools and never run a 9:10 in their life. They would give up the sport after high school because they weren't "talented" enough.

garlicaladiablo wrote:

The kid is ready for this weekends Millrose 3k. Drew Hunters HS & Chris Derricks 3k record in jeopardy?

German ran 7:47 indoors as an 18 y.o. Why doesn't it count as indoor AJR? Oversized track? Who cares. And yes, he was in College, sure, but Nico is likely training just as hard and as many miles as German was. Ryun ran an equivalent 7:47 outdoors at 19. Outdoors yes, but track was probably no faster than the indoors tracks we have today.

So THOSE are your American junior 3k marks. 7:47. Nico seems like a true superstar, but if he wants to talk big and talk about breaking records, he shouldn't be fooled by *'s (oversized indoor track, outdoor OLD track,etc), and should know what the top of the heap really is, if he wants to shoot for it. 7:47 is no joke, that's for sure.

(or he can be content and just say he is aiming for the indoor HS record, which is what, 7:59? Sounds reasonable)

It's a hard time trial. Finishing work intended to inspire confidence. You only should do this once per season.

And Ingebritzen is better than Ryun. All three have one thing in common: tackling post-collegiate level intensity in their teens. Reaching a higher level than they would if they took it a bit slower. But who's to criticize, or even suggest things would be different if they were developed slower. Some motivated people like to move on from the sport. Ryun became a congressman.

MILEKILLS wrote:

Looks like ALAN WEBB

No, he doesn’t.

Yes, German is living proof that it’s important to run fast at a young age. How else could have he finished his running career with a 7:20 best (oh wait)

7:47 remains his PR

Dude looked cooked with 6 laps to go and still ran 7:56. This kid is a problem.