Guppy wrote:
After reading through the thread now I only have one thing to add: that the brojos et al are defending this like spoiled children is almost as pathetic as the article was disgraceful. Brojos, you've reached an all time low.
And, Tom, if so many readers "misunderstood" the intent of the article, the fault is on the writer, not the audience.
I cannot believe how absurd you guys are.
Whoops, I guess I had more than one thing to add.
In reply to Tom's post where he states: Here is the bottom line: The article is accurate and the article is called for. Why you might ask? because Alan Webb cannot and should not have had such a tantrum in a public sphere.
It is nice to know that Tom is out there policing the behavior of our elite runner's behavior. Though he should probably meet with them one on one to explain what he expects of them and what behavior he deems unprofessional. Maybe all runners should have to sign a contract with Tom once they sign a professional shoe contract just so they know what is acceptable to Tom.
I would have to say that this article is fine to write as long as what is reported really happened. Why should the brojos not be able to report on a story that took place at a meet? Was anything fabricated? Probably not. As far as the credibility of letsrun.com, anyone who actually considers this a news site should take a good, long look at the home page. Letsrun.com is a glorified blog; very biased and amateurish at times. And the message boards are in a world of their own. I wish that track had a reputable news source, but I guess letsrun is the best we got.
wejo wrote:
We give athletes a large window of privacy and don't report some things that happen off the track. This incident however was in a public place and so outside of what Emory and others considered normal behavior that we determined it was should be reported. It gives insight into who Alan Webb is.
Bullshit. Every athlete has an emotional moment at some point in their lives. You provided a play-by-play of the incident in a very exposing, embarrassing, and judgmental manner.
This is truly classless wejo, no matter how you look at it.
I cant wait to hear the excuses they will come up with next. They will continue to defend this as if they did nothing wrong.
super m davis wrote:
or better yet, why not "Super Hot on Letsrun"
That is determined by an algorithm which we haven't changed in months. So this thread despite a lot of posts isn't popular enough. Likely means there is a bunch of super impassioned people posting on it but not enough people overall reading it.
It is receiving a lesser degree of attention underneath threads as the only thread that is, "Hot Right Now!" so it is not like it's not popular.
why are people so afraid of emotion? i'm still not clear what webb did that was inappropriate. he is a big time athlete. his livelihood rides on his performances. let him be pissed at himself for 30 minutes if he has a bad race. he didn't seem to be hurting anyone or yelling at anyone.
as others have said, it is unfair to have an article that judges his behavior. seems that most on this thread agree that webb didn't do anything too extraordinary.
Agree 100%.
I like Webb. So he's got some fire in his belly. That's one of the reasons he's so good, when he's on.
It's frustrating to compete and lose. What's the big deal with dropping a little adult languange on the festivities? Is this f'in church?
Geez, what a bunch of wussy prudes!
No one is faulting Webb for his behavior. It's wejo that crossed the line.
Tom Davis wrote:
To the many of you who are clearly upset about this, it is my hope that you can try to understand why this article was written. In my personal opinion, I would hope that this article, in some shape or form, can help Alan learn that he needs to be better behaved and more responsible in a public setting. Alan Webb, just like any other person in the world, should and will be held accountable for their words and actions. If a high school kid acted like this after a race, it would not be acceptable; and why? Because we try to teach high school kids to be responsible for their actions. Alan hasn't entirely learned this yet, but you are never too old to learn something new and, sometimes it takes bold action for an individual to realize this.
Tom,
Your article portrays not only bad journalism, it also shows mean, almost evil character. But fine, you are what you are: some writer for an online news magazine that focuses on a rather small target group.
With that being said I cannot resist but to inform you that Alan Webb does not read letsrun. I know this first hand, as I am a friend (albeit not close) and have asked him in person a year or so ago. So, in this sense your intention to educate Alan has failed unfortunately. I am deeply sorry about that, as I am sure you are in a mature enough state of your life in which you are in a position to publicly "educate" an Athlete which you don't even know in person. I am sure he cares.
In the end, I know why you guys (Brojos included) write such kind of things. It is in your interest to stir up controversy, because people (me included) continue posting on that message board - and help you increase your profit. That's fine. Just be aware that although you may increase overall visitors on your site, those of professional athletes have steadily decreased. In fact, among many of the top US runners your site gains more and more enemies. I mean, certain people (I am sure you know who) literally laugh behind your back and feel sorry for you.
I just want to add another vote of disapproval. Although I can see why the brojos made the decision to publish this story, their decision caused me to lose a great deal of respect for them. I think of their actions much like a paparazzi who publishes an embarrassing photo of some celebrity in public. Sure, Webb's behavior was in public. But it wasn't at a press conference. There is a difference between a celebrity's public life and his life in public. Unfortunately, media-ghouls have blurred those lines by chasing down celebrities whenever they leave their private property. Documenting and broadcasting Alan Webb's every move after a race is reprehensible. He's in public, because he's living his life. He shouldn't have to scurry away to privacy after a race lest anything he say or do be broadcast to all of his fans. If you want to hear his reactions, ask for an interview with him. If you're really so interested in how he processes a race immediately afterward - ask him in person. Have some integrity. Allow him the opportunity to explain himself. Otherwise, you're no better than a creepy paparazzi looking for an upskirt shot of some teenybopper celebrity. You're hunting for public moments of weakness. Preying on celebrities like this is despicable. There is a market for it (paparazzi can make a pretty penny), but I didn't think the brojos would stoop so low. I guess in publishing this story the brojos are telling the running community that they would like letsrun to be seen as a trashy tabloid: come to letsrun for judgmental gossipy garbage.
This article is trash. We have all had moments after races where we didn't act as mature as we like to think we are. At least Webb tried to do it away from the cameras.
Unfortunately, you decided to write this article painting Webb as immature. He's probably kicking himself for even granting you an interview.
The media these days isn't anything but glorified gossip. It is a shame that everyone in the public eye has to have their worst moments thrown back in there face constantly.
bobby e. wrote:
At least one prominent running journalist has already posted in this thread (without specifically identifying himself as such, but without hiding his identity either), and has concurred with the majority opinion that the piece is in poor taste, if not actually poor journalism.
I'd like to hear from some other writers who cover our sport with a greater degree of professionalism. David Monti, Peter Gambaccini, Doug Binder, etc. Or anybody else who wants to post their name and journalistic affiliation. (I am not a journalist myself.)
Perhaps they feel that to do so would further detract from the attention that should be paid to the athletic performances at the meet. I can't say that I blame them if this is the case.
I covered the financial sector and not athletics, but while at industry conferences I would regularly hear and witness things that would have made for a hot read, but in my judgment were not wise or appropriate to publish. In most of those cases the people involved didn't even realize I was a reporter. Now if I had overheard some massive Ponzi scheme or something, that might be worth blowing wide open. But seeing prominent figures chasing tail at the hotel bar or talking about possible market-moving deals didn't register high enough on the importance scale to 1) possibly ruin a reputation based on a single moment and 2) alienate myself forever from these future sources.
I think if you had seen Webb injecting himself with EPO that would have been one thing, but this probably wasn't worth blowing the lid off.
Just my opinion.
Much of what Letsrun has done so well for more than a decade is provide objective and insightful information on elite runners from training to racing and much of that was based on access. From the Slicko days to pacing Paula to the Malmos and Patti Dillions etc posting. It just seems to me that the site is using a blow off of steam by a brilliant but troubled runner to benefit themselves. In reality it hurts the integrity of everything here.
Tom Davis wrote:
Guys,
To those of you who don't understand what the article is trying to convey, that is simply a matter of 1) misunderstanding or 2) a difference of opinion.
Here is the bottom line: The article is accurate and the article is called for. Why you might ask? because Alan Webb cannot and should not have had such a tantrum in a public sphere.
I was one of a select few people to witness this entire episode from the time of the race until Reggie was closed. Mostly everyone else, including everyone commenting here, only saw the flotrack video, which didn't show much and was taken after the fact as to what Emory and myself are trying to get across here.
To the many of you who are clearly upset about this, it is my hope that you can try to understand why this article was written. In my personal opinion, I would hope that this article, in some shape or form, can help Alan learn that he needs to be better behaved and more responsible in a public setting. Alan Webb, just like any other person in the world, should and will be held accountable for their words and actions. If a high school kid acted like this after a race, it would not be acceptable; and why? Because we try to teach high school kids to be responsible for their actions. Alan hasn't entirely learned this yet, but you are never too old to learn something new and, sometimes it takes bold action for an individual to realize this.
All this boils down to is that Alan Webb needs to shape-up his negative emotions. No one is trying to make Alan out to be some bad-guy, but we are just trying to report this unacceptable behavior in the hopes that it might help him realize that he IS held accountable for his behavior. Alberto Salazar has said on numerous occasions that Alan has turned a new leaf in regards to his emotions, but that is clearly not the case. I believe that if he can turn this around and truly learn to take things in stride (just like every other elite athlete who had a bad race there did), Alan will soon be back to being one of the best athletes to ever step on the track. I am a big fan of the guy, and I wish him the best. I only hope that he can learn that he can't act like this as it only brings him down.
Dude, you are judging Alan way too much in the above.
Who are you to determine that Alan cannot and should not act like that?
I'm sorry you have your puritan values, but you need to understand that not everyone will think and act like you and you need to learn tolerance.
I also question your definition of "public setting". There is a difference between having an outburst on national tv and a heated conversation with your agent with hardly anyone around and letting off a little steam to yourself. Why did you feel the need to follow him around when this happened?
wejo wrote:
While I wasn't at the meet, I stand behind the article. We did not put up the article on a whim. It was taken down from the homepage earlier by mistake while two people updated the site at the same time and we didn't notice it until after the Super Bowl.
I got a phone call about Webb's outburst last night. Emory was completely shocked by what he saw and felt it should be reported. We discussed it and all agreed it should be reported.
I was not totally shocked by Webb's behavior because I know of his competitive nature and know a lot from Chris Lear. I advocated holding off last night and finishing the article today to try and put it in context and get it right. I hope if you read the article that's what you see.
There is probably no athlete I root for more than Alan Webb. Having said that the point of LetsRun.com is not to just be a cheerleader for American runners and only report positive news. If Ben Roethlisberger smashed up the lockerroom after a game I hope it would be reported.
If an American underperforms in a meet I hope we say as much. When Regina Jacobs pulled out of the Olympics after EPO testing was instituted, I'm glad we were the ones to ask her about it.
When other track and field media tell Emory in Boston they don't want to interview Alan because if they do and its negative, he may never do an interview with them again, it reinforces my decision in reporting the story. If our runners only do good, and all we do is be their fans then the site has no credibility and ultimately we believe you won't come back. Much of the other running media only report positive stories and that is why you won't see a negative shoe review, drugs weren't discussed in the 1980s, and all interviews are positive.
We give athletes a large window of privacy and don't report some things that happen off the track. This incident however was in a public place and so outside of what Emory and others considered normal behavior that we determined it was should be reported. It gives insight into who Alan Webb is.
Having said that normal people don't run 3:46 in the mile. Alan Webb has been so damn good because he believes and wants to beat everyone in the world. Although Nick Willis has an Olympic silver medal, he often in the past has not raced like he could beat everyone. Alan is perhaps the only American born runner I've seen on the men's side who truly believes he can beat anyone. That fire that Alan has is one of the things I love about it him. But our greatest strengths are often our greatest weaknesses and I think that is the case with Alan.
A hard part of the article was choosing what words to use. "Meltdown" and "tantrum" were discussed along with others. I felt "meltdown" was more judgmental but you could argue their is judgment in both. Perhaps we could do a better job in putting in words what actually happened. In talking to Emory, he was so stunned by what he saw, that it was his #1 story from the meet. That may not come across in the article but I think we did a good job with a very difficult subject matter that we spent a lot of time trying to get right.
Wejo, I sort of understand what you're saying, you're just really bad at communicating like an edumucated person. For one, I suggest proofreading. It helps avoid third grade level mistakes (for example, 'there' is not the same as 'their').
Many of the people who have disagreed with you (holy cow, there's ten pages of that!) make the mistake of assuming that you (and the other fellas at LetsRun) are trying to be "journalists," when in reality you are just track fans like the rest of us (and one of you is a sub-mediocre college coach). That being said, it's your own fault you are perceived this way. Either be legitimate or don't. You can't be both.
Tom Davis wrote:
...we are just trying to report this unacceptable behavior in the hopes that it might help him realize that he IS held accountable for his behavior.
Most of us know that this was not in any way the reason this article was published. Please do not insult us.
wejo and rojo need to determine whether they want to be classless punks or whether to grow up like most of us have.
I'm not a big Alan Webb fan but I feel bad for him today.
Somehow, the joy we experience as runners and how ideally we should share that joy as a running community has been undermined by a couple of snot-faced Texas boys.
Wisco Fan wrote:
If you guys can't handle this level of emotion in professional athletics, stay in the stands. Unfettered access comes with resonsibility.
This post is where I am in this debacle.
I want to know what the runners reactions were (good or bad), I want to know about the behind the scenes action, I want to know about their post race workouts/goofing off cool downs. All that is good stuff.
What I don't want to know is whether you were offended by it or worse, try to lecture Alan from the "bully pulpit".
It probably would be a worthwhile investment for you guys to get some counseling on how to get access to/ generate more insider knowledge and get less of the preaching.
That post by Tom Davis was laughable and the article was almost as embarrassing as the Salazar interview.
Am I the only one that thinks it’s time for a front page poll?
After reading the article and all these posts, I have to say both Webb and the Brojos screwed up. I'm probably repeating a lot of what already has been said. Webb definitely should not have acted in that manner, and it reminded of some my immature behavior I displayed in high school after bad races. An athlete, or anybody else for that matter, cannot act that way in a public setting.
As for the article, it's ridiculous and classless. Why do the letsrun readers need a play-by-play of some athletes emotional outburst? And we sure as hell don't need the character judgments and public chastising. Webb already made a fool of himself by acting the way he did. It was not necessary to dedicate a lengthy article to his ridiculous behavior.
All those involved in the article do not have sufficient justification for posting it on the front page. All their posts on this thread are weak explanations for a decision they must admit was a mistake.