Zola Budd, a class act. Mary Slamey, a bitter rhymes with witch

If any of you have ever been in a championship style race, then you're all aware that they aren't all run in perfect alignment with everyone overly concerned with Track etiquette. There's positioning, pushing, shoving, and incidental contact due to everyone trying to get where they want to be... it's a race, not an old English tea party.

Sometimes you get caught up the pack, sometimes you get shit position, sometimes you make a move when you need to sit back for a second... If anything, all that happened here was some accidental contact that should have caused Budd to speed up or move out or Decker to slow down.

Either their inexperience or ego's told them not to give an inch and amazingly (sarcastic) the same result occurred, except this time it culminated with a fall.

The step and a half rule is obeyed about as much as NBA players get called for traveling... it's just part of the game. You learn to race and to adjust accordingly to your situation or shit like this happens.

Call it inexperience or panic, but with 1400 + meters to go, there's no need to stand your ground right there to prove your point that you don't have the step and a half... the race wasn't being won right there and Puica was good enough to know it.

You can throw all the rules in the world at Budd, but Slaney blew that for failing to adapt to the race... no one else.

canadeh wrote:

Astro;

We all have a clue and can obviously see better than you - please get your eyes checked ASAP, you're obviously seeing things, and get your mind checked as well since your perspective seems to border on paranoia. We all know the track rules just as well as do you. Perhaps people would take your opinion more seriously if you didn't talk down to them!

It was an accident - they both are culpable (but not for disqualification), yet Mary was the one in the position who needed to be careful, she wasn't and so she suffered the consequences. It's ancient history, why does this topic resurface so often? Nothing is going to change the outcome!

My perspective does not border on paranoia, but I admit I am extremely frustrated and I am not really sure why. This happened so many years ago and I actually like Zola as a person and can't stand Mary, so I have no idea why I care what people think about this incident? In reading the thread I would say it is about 50/50 split on who everyone thinks is at fault, with many people saying it is nobody's fault. I just don't understand it. To me it is not one of those grey areas; it is pretty clear that Zola moved in front of Mary without having a stride lead. That is an infraction. Should be case closed, but so many people are seeing things or writing things that are just plain false and aren't backed up by the video. You cannot pass someone and move into lane one without a full stride lead. That is the rule, plain and simple and it wasn't followed. Mary could have slowed up to allow Zola to illegally assume the inside of lane one, but she didn't have to. Mary also did not know who was behind her or how far, so by her slowing up she may have risked being tripped from behind. She was put in a very precarious situation and in the end lost out on her chance for a gold medal. It was a sad situation and it is so nice to see that Zola has moved on and is doing well. In reading the Runner's World article, it really was amazing how crazy things were for her leading up to the Olympics and then of course, immediately after. Unfortunately, Mary never really moved on from that, but she wasn't really a good person even before that incident. I always liked to watch her race, but hated to see her interviewed.

And I apologize if I have talked down to people. Not usually my nature and again, not sure why I feel so strongly about this thread. I will go away now.

Astro wrote: Again it was both of their inexperience that caused the fall

There you go.

I took your advice and I still see it as 100% Slaney's fault. I asked my wife, who is a former 800m runner who has never seen or heard of this race, what she thought after watching the video. With no prompting or bias from me, other than the question, "who is at fault?", she chose Slaney, reasoning that you can't run up on someone's heels. FWIW.

Bingo. Exactly what I was referring to in my post a page or two back. Defend your space and learn how to race. Mary never learned how to do either and was used to having people defer to her in domestic races. The fall was completely her fault and running up the backside of Budd was the cause of it.

Remarkable number of pages on a 27yo race.

An indictment of the media choosing sides and a study of racing tactics and catastrophes.

It certainly was worth tossing around

You'll notice that Decker pulled of Budd's number when she fell, is if she tried to drag Budd down with her (metaphor intended). Just like Decker.

You guys are funny and I guess watching and weighing in on this for the first time. The talk of passing "cleanly" and the rules, etc, crack me up. I guess people have never been cut off or spiked, I don't know but there is something called avoidance and that is what happens 99.9% of the time when these event occur, and people piss and moan after the race but rarely does anyone go down crying and make a federal case out of it. Both runners are first class freaks, Zola didn't know how to pass, Mary did not know how to deal with it, both got what they deserved.

Blizzardo wrote:

...but rarely does anyone go down crying and make a federal case out of it.

You're absolutely right, it was only the Olympic finals! What is there to get upset about?

Added Perspective wrote:

Wow There wrote:

Slaney ran up right onto Zola Budd. It was not the first time she did that. Budd's culpability was zero. Looking at the tape now, that's quite clear.

Garbage. I have seen the race tape dozens of times. Budd was running in a horrendous position, not going fast enough to move all the way into lane one. If anything, she is lucky that Mary (or someone else) didn't accidentally spike her where she was running. Either pass and take the lead, or not. Don't choose something in between or something bad can potentially happen, and it did.

Budd's inexperience racing in a crowd essentially cost Mary an Olympic medal, probably the gold.

In fact, both were frontrunners, by experience and inclination, and neither had as much experience as they should have running in packs. If that had happened in a mens' race, there would not have been tears and sympathy for the follower who went down. Granted, in passing you are supposed to be clear of the runners you have passed before cutting in, but in practice, it is pretty hard to know whether you are clear and by how much, and Zola did not cut in dramatically. It is the following runner who is in a position to tell whether she is in a box and runnining into the back of it, which is exactly what happened. Zola took the lead as they came around the curve, and Mary, though on the rail, was into the space where she was up against Zola's left leg as it extended back. Anyone experienced in pack running, a man, for instance, would have put a hand out to Zola's back to establish space, to let Zola know she had a runner right there, and to keep from losing balance. The bottom line is, unless you are prepared to run from the front, you must learn to run behind others, and accept that a fact of life back in the pack is to be alert, and prepared to adjust your stride to the changing available running room.

Yes, Mary was in those days a nutjob, known to assault boyfriends, and her tearful network pouts revealed her for who she was at the time, a very talented, but neurotic prima donna whose whole notion of self-worth was tied up in her current running success or lack thereof. Her behavior in public was frankly embarrassing for its utter lack of graciousness. How much respect would Jim Ryun have lost had he'd thrown tearful tantrums in '72, where there was an clear available remedy, and it was denied him?

BTW, by all accounts, Richard has had a very beneficial effect on Mary, who appears to be remarkably at peace with her life. She had her share of exploitive relationships early on.

I have been cut off, and I have been spiked. Sometimes I pop right back up, other times the fall is bad enough that it takes me out of the race. This was an olympic final, and if there is ever a time to pay attention to the rules, this is it. Sprinters often drift a little out of their lane. No one says much about it most of the time, but in a championship final, a flag needs to be raised and a DQ should be given, especially if the rule violation affects the outcome of the race. I would say that moving towards the inside rail, thereby cutting off a competitor (a race favorite no less), definitely affected the eventual outcome of this race.Zola didn't know how to pass. Have any of you ever actually worked out with a team before, or had someone cut in on you early during a race? If you are turning a corner and the person to the outside of the turn moves over enough that you have to suddenly adjust your stride to avoid being sent to the ground, it is pretty annoying and dangerous. Why? Because the idiot should know better than to do something that is going to result in you or himself getting injured, and that is NOT the way to pass. You give your teammate one hell of an earful for not paying attention to what he is doing if this happens in a workout. Sometimes you are able to react by putting your elbow out and keeping the body away from you. Other times you are clipped before you can do anything to protect yourself.Having elbows connect, running in a huge pack during a big cut in (800m or waterfall start), jostling a bit for position coming into a curve (trying to not get stuck swinging wide)...this is all very different from having someone cut in on you and essentially throwing their legs into yours when there is not much of a reason outside of being purely unaware. I don't think anyone in that lead pack of four was expecting significant contact with 4 laps to go. They were all in lanes one and two, in decent positions, and it was not as if they'd just come off the first turn of a waterfall or were rounding the final lap. Just because elbows or shoulders connect a bit in international competition, does not mean that when someone moves inside too soon and another runner ends up on the ground in the biggest race of their life, that there is not cause for outrage.Remember when Said muscled his way through in the U.S. Champs a few years back? People were PISSED, and with good reason. This is only different because it was not intentional. There was still a rule violation, resulting in contact, that ended with an olympic finalist on the ground.To all of you that claim Slaney ran up on someone that was in front of her...Budd was NEVER directly in front of her. She was always out and to the side, then she started to drift INTO her. That is the difference between running up on someone's shoulder, and running directly BEHIND them.

Blizzardo wrote:

You guys are funny and I guess watching and weighing in on this for the first time. The talk of passing "cleanly" and the rules, etc, crack me up. I guess people have never been cut off or spiked, I don't know but there is something called avoidance and that is what happens 99.9% of the time when these event occur, and people piss and moan after the race but rarely does anyone go down crying and make a federal case out of it. Both runners are first class freaks, Zola didn't know how to pass, Mary did not know how to deal with it, both got what they deserved.

Pre-Nuptial Turnon wrote:

Look at ZB's left foot starting at 5:08 and you will see that she was firmly in the middle of lane one, with barely a half-stride advantage, and if anything slowing slightly. At 5:18 ZB's stumble almost causes her left foot to hit the rail. Clearly Budd was illegal, and should have accelerated to make that move.

The problem here is that the "Innocent Kid" wronged the "Primadonna". It should always be the "bad" people who are in the wrong. FWIW Slaney's histrionics possibly cost her the ruling.

As an aside, Lynn Williams was a babe!

Zola'sstumble. of course. was caused by the FIRST time Mary clipped her. After that, Mary clipped her again. Zola was in the lead,in the middle of the lane one, as she was entitled to be; Mary was in lane one, on the rail, but behind. When the leader is any place in lane one, you try to share that lane on the inside at your peril.

This is just pure fantasy. Stop posting, take a breath, and realise that you are talking rubbish. Budd did not "cut in" on Slaney - suggesting that she did damages your argument beyond repair.

This could have been an interesting thread, but your little fantasy world of unfounded accusations and patently untrue claims is destroying any possibility of sensible discussion.

only me wrote:

...but your little fantasy world of unfounded accusations and patently untrue claims...

...is probably an accurate assessment regarding several observations within this thread on both sides of the fence.

Added Perspective wrote:

only me wrote:

...but your little fantasy world of unfounded accusations and patently untrue claims...

...is probably an accurate assessment regarding several observations within this thread on both sides of the fence.

True enough.

"Budd didn't know how to pass."

Now that's funny! Also absurd, ridiculous, and lame.

How many of you took track classes in "how to pass"?

Hhahahah, oh god, that's good.

Budd, in fact, did pass, and she established herself in that lane.

DeckerSlaneyTabb just couldn't handle pack.

I've read through the whole thread and found the discussion really interesting. I'm not a track rules expert so I have no idea who was at fault. Whatever happened, it seems a shame. Seems to have embittered the one woman and subjected the other to some horrible accusations. Whatever the rule, it's application seems difficult enough that in a situation like this, the ruling appears to have an almost zero chance of being applied consistently. Reminds me of other subjective calls in sports such as soccer.

What I actually found more interesting was peoples' attempts to persuade each other. Reminded me of political or religious arguments where the lines are clearly drawn yet people still attempt to persuade one another. I never studied rhetoric but there must be a name for this.

I'd just be curious whether anyone actually changed their mind about the collision based on someone else's argument here?

How true - the first time each of us was on the track we were aware of whether or not we were clear of the person we were trying to get around. Not a difficult concept.

Budd Lite wrote:

"Budd didn't know how to pass."

Now that's funny! Also absurd, ridiculous, and lame.

How many of you took track classes in "how to pass"?

Hhahahah, oh god, that's good.

Budd, in fact, did pass, and she established herself in that lane.

DeckerSlaneyTabb just couldn't handle pack.

Astro wrote: I apologize if I have talked down to people

Fair enough. I take back my last comment.