Everyone loves a comeback story, especially when they are an underdog. I guarantee you 90% of the haters on here would be superfans again if she exceeds expectations. The only reason most became haters in the first place is because they were living vicariously through her and when she stopped meeting their expectations it causes them to feel bad. It's like expecting the Lakers to win a ring every season: totally unrealistic but their fanbase is emotionally tied to them winning and feel bad when they don't, so take it out on the players/team if they're not winning.
No! We are not "haters" because "she stopped meeting our expectations". It's perfectly fine to lose. We are "haters" because Mary Cain is highly conceited and blames everyone else for her own shortcomings but never mommy and daddy or herself. Mary Cain has just been jumping from one "Look at me! Look at me!" thing to another to try to be the center of attention, really sad when you notice it. Just look at what she did with "Atalanta" and calling herself CEO. There's more Instagram posts and photos of herself in magazine interviews than races they've done. And there are still only 2 runners in that whole club. It's like Mary Cain simply got bored of Atalanta when it didn't bring enough attention to herself and now she is abandoning it in order to pretend to be into triathlon to try being center of attention there.
There's an argument for Mary being a little bit more entitled than normal and that makes sense given her upbringing, but I think "blaming everyone else for her own shortcomings" and "look at me! look at me!" is taking things a little too far.
Mary lost her superhuman abilities by 2015 (we all know what happened there) and was literally silent in the shadows for years. When Kara+Company came out with their allegations there was silence on Mary's part. She didn't actually come forward and reclaim her story until 2019, four years later. That's four years where she could have blamed everyone for her problems and grabbed some attention but didn't. It took Mary a long time to figure out and process what happened to her and feel compelled to tell the story in order to help others.
Can you blame a kid for wanting some justice for what happened to her and wanting to make the sport a better place? Do I agree with the lawsuit? Well, maybe but not really. Do I agree that her approach with Atalanta is long term a success? Definitely not. But she's young and she's trying to establish a place in the sport because like it or not (and I'm guessing you don't like it) she has a legacy. She was one of the greatest HS distance runners ever, and what is more, she started a movement in women's sports.
To me it seems like you want Mary to shut up, and obediently join the elephant graveyard with all the other girl prodigies that came before her. You don't like facing the ugly truth that Mary, along with many of the other girl prodigies, didn't just "fizzle out", some really bad things happened to her, and there were people who should have supported her and didn't. Mary telling her story as graphically as she did forces us to face a question. How many other girls did we do this to? Would we have more talent and success in US distance running if we didn't have so much abuse and eating disorders in coaching and training? Maybe it's not simply puberty...is it something more insidious?
You know, there's a fine line between "blaming everyone for your problems" and holding people accountable for bad things they did to you. Also strength is measured differently when it's someone powerful vs. when someone is powerless. For the powerful, strength is measured by how they command, yell and bully people (example: Salazar is a TOUGH coach because he yelled at Mary and called her fat) I think for many of you, Mary's story falls under a gray area, but to me it doesn't. For the powerless, strength is determined by a person's ability to take abuse on the chin and not complain (example: Mary was weak for speaking out about Salazar's verbal abuse, she should have just taken it.)
Like I said before, having grown up in a loving household in one of the richest communities in the country, I'd imagine Mary, like everyone else in her community is privileged and probably a bit entitled. She's used to seeing success, and I'd imagine to some degree, takes success for granted. But it doesn't cheapen what happened to her. Salazar gave her prescription drugs she didn't have a prescription for to lose weight, and fixated on it in an unhealthy way. She was cheated out of privacy by the "sports psych" Darren Treasure who spilled her secrets to Salazar. She was humiliated in front of a large crowd of peers. She was weighed in front of her teammates. 114 pounds is far too thin, even for a runner of her height. He coerced her into an eating disorder. She's entitled, but he's accountable.
No! We are not "haters" because "she stopped meeting our expectations". It's perfectly fine to lose. We are "haters" because Mary Cain is highly conceited and blames everyone else for her own shortcomings but never mommy and daddy or herself. Mary Cain has just been jumping from one "Look at me! Look at me!" thing to another to try to be the center of attention, really sad when you notice it. Just look at what she did with "Atalanta" and calling herself CEO. There's more Instagram posts and photos of herself in magazine interviews than races they've done. And there are still only 2 runners in that whole club. It's like Mary Cain simply got bored of Atalanta when it didn't bring enough attention to herself and now she is abandoning it in order to pretend to be into triathlon to try being center
You know, there's a fine line between "blaming everyone for your problems" and holding people accountable for bad things they did to you. Also strength is measured differently when it's someone powerful vs. when someone is powerless. For the powerful, strength is measured by how they command, yell and bully people (example: Salazar is a TOUGH coach because he yelled at Mary and called her fat) For the powerless, strength is determined by a person's ability to take abuse on the chin and not complain (example: Mary was weak for speaking out about Salazar's verbal abuse, she should have just taken it.)
In this article from 2012, you already see that she was a converted swimmer and a good one, who just happened to be immediately very good at running. As a sophomore, in running 4:39 before Salazar, she closed that race in 62.5 for a huge pr! Her coach talks also of how she just loved to run. Salazar really killed that. A real shame that she started to be coached by him, and especially that she went out to Oregon to be coached in person, because before that, she had her hs coaches and then John Henwood coaching her or administering her workouts in a way that was not unhealthy and soul-killing.
MaxPreps News - A converted swimmer, the talented New York sophomore is now making a big splash on the track - even drawing comparisons to Mary Decker.
In this article from 2012, you already see that she was a converted swimmer and a good one, who just happened to be immediately very good at running. As a sophomore, in running 4:39 before Salazar, she closed that race in 62.5 for a huge pr! Her coach talks also of how she just loved to run. Salazar really killed that. A real shame that she started to be coached by him, and especially that she went out to Oregon to be coached in person, because before that, she had her hs coaches and then John Henwood coaching her or administering her workouts in a way that was not unhealthy and soul-killing.
She CHOSE to be coached by Salazar. She chose to go pro in high school. You can complain about Salazar all you want, but the FACT is that she BEGGED Salazar to start coaching her again after she left him.
The majority of the blame for Cain's struggles lay 99.99% on Cain and her family.
Everyone was rooting for her, but she wasn't the first and won't be the last female high school phenom to peak at 16 years old.
Someone I knew in swimming played golf in high school, decided to get more serious about swimming year around...went from decent recruit at a D1 program that at the time was ranked maybe 25th. His progression once fully into swimming was incredible: NCAA titles, Olympic Trials wins, Olympic medals (gold in relays).
I don't doubt at all she had the engine to have a roster spot. Some coaches would even take the raw athlete just on possibility.
You had a friend who was a nothing swimmer in highschool, who decided to get serious in college and won a gold medal for the US?
That is incredibly rare. Like no one ever does this rare. I wouldn't suggest Cain is going to get her form back that easily.
She didn't choose Salazar. Her father chose Salazar. And Salazar to them didn't represent anything like what he actually was to her, which was a complete disaster. He represented the possibility of greatness to her and the end of a Nike contract if she left, which is why she hung on, but the fact is undeniable that her career cratered not long after she went out to Oregon. She was historically great beforehand. high school times of 1:59.51/4:04/9:38/15:47.
She didn't choose Salazar. Her father chose Salazar. And Salazar to them didn't represent anything like what he actually was to her, which was a complete disaster. He represented the possibility of greatness to her and the end of a Nike contract if she left, which is why she hung on, but the fact is undeniable that her career cratered not long after she went out to Oregon. She was historically great beforehand. high school times of 1:59.51/4:04/9:38/15:47.
100%. Think how easily kids and their parents get swindled when little jonny gets offered a partial scholarship. Now imagine being given the keys to Nike. Most are gonna take it.
In this article from 2012, you already see that she was a converted swimmer and a good one, who just happened to be immediately very good at running. As a sophomore, in running 4:39 before Salazar, she closed that race in 62.5 for a huge pr! Her coach talks also of how she just loved to run. Salazar really killed that. A real shame that she started to be coached by him, and especially that she went out to Oregon to be coached in person, because before that, she had her hs coaches and then John Henwood coaching her or administering her workouts in a way that was not unhealthy and soul-killing.
She CHOSE to be coached by Salazar. She chose to go pro in high school. You can complain about Salazar all you want, but the FACT is that she BEGGED Salazar to start coaching her again after she left him.
The majority of the blame for Cain's struggles lay 99.99% on Cain and her family.
Everyone was rooting for her, but she wasn't the first and won't be the last female high school phenom to peak at 16 years old.
Exactly. Surprised her physician parents would push her to skip a D1 scholarship and go to Alberto. And yeah yeah she attended college. And then when it didn't work out she cried about being accountable for her weight etc and she wasn'ttreated nicely. Her triathlon coach should take note.
In this article from 2012, you already see that she was a converted swimmer and a good one, who just happened to be immediately very good at running. As a sophomore, in running 4:39 before Salazar, she closed that race in 62.5 for a huge pr! Her coach talks also of how she just loved to run. Salazar really killed that. A real shame that she started to be coached by him, and especially that she went out to Oregon to be coached in person, because before that, she had her hs coaches and then John Henwood coaching her or administering her workouts in a way that was not unhealthy and soul-killing.
She CHOSE to be coached by Salazar. She chose to go pro in high school. You can complain about Salazar all you want, but the FACT is that she BEGGED Salazar to start coaching her again after she left him.
The majority of the blame for Cain's struggles lay 99.99% on Cain and her family.
Everyone was rooting for her, but she wasn't the first and won't be the last female high school phenom to peak at 16 years old.
Said before, I'll say again...Salazar knows how to groom people. He did it with the Rupps, only they are still under his spell.
Salazar weaseled his way into the Rupp's family, and suddenly he's calling Galen's mom lecturing her about tamiflu, sending Galen to Nike doctors when he's in high school, giving him prednisone, and "testosterone medication" etc. Galen's parents still fawn over him. His father in an interview called Alberto "like a father to Galen". Dads usually don't say that about other men.
Salazar uses his name and clout to get into family's business. Imagine if Alberto called your home prior to 2015 and told you that your child was the most phenomenal athlete he's ever seen. You'd take the call, right? Even if you were a doctor , right?
Mary says her parents knew nothing about running, but everyone believed that Salazar was a running legend. Mary has said she was bullied off her high school team by the mean kids who were on it at the time. And I believe her when she says this. I believe she was bullied off her team and not that she was actually some prima donna who was too good for everyone there.
Why do I believe her? Do a google search of Bronxville. 7K people and a median household income of a cool 205K. The school itself is a K-12. A community of elitist elites. Heck, one of Mary's Bronxville XC teammates was the daughter of a VERY well known news anchor.
Mary was a gawky Harry Potter loving kid who brought stuffed animals with her to races. You think she was accepted by the type of people who live in Bronxville. Communities like that love conformation, and will tear down anyone who doesn't comply. I think Mary was maybe a sheltered and a bit nerdy kid who stole the spotlight from kids who felt really entitled to it. I can see why they bullied her. It happens.
So a bullied kid who basically can't go back to practice anymore gets a call from Salazar? Who wouldn't see it as a blessing!
She didn't choose Salazar. Her father chose Salazar. And Salazar to them didn't represent anything like what he actually was to her, which was a complete disaster. He represented the possibility of greatness to her and the end of a Nike contract if she left, which is why she hung on, but the fact is undeniable that her career cratered not long after she went out to Oregon. She was historically great beforehand. high school times of 1:59.51/4:04/9:38/15:47.
I said the blame is on her AND HER FAMILY (including her father). She was too immature to go pro but her parents pushed her to do it.
You are foolish. Athletes switch coaches all the time but keep their same contract and same sponsor. Cain's father was a doctor and Salazar included him in all of the training and discussions.
She CHOSE to be coached by Salazar. She chose to go pro in high school. You can complain about Salazar all you want, but the FACT is that she BEGGED Salazar to start coaching her again after she left him.
The majority of the blame for Cain's struggles lay 99.99% on Cain and her family.
Everyone was rooting for her, but she wasn't the first and won't be the last female high school phenom to peak at 16 years old.
Said before, I'll say again...Salazar knows how to groom people. He did it with the Rupps, only they are still under his spell.
Salazar weaseled his way into the Rupp's family, and suddenly he's calling Galen's mom lecturing her about tamiflu, sending Galen to Nike doctors when he's in high school, giving him prednisone, and "testosterone medication" etc. Galen's parents still fawn over him. His father in an interview called Alberto "like a father to Galen". Dads usually don't say that about other men.
Salazar uses his name and clout to get into family's business. Imagine if Alberto called your home prior to 2015 and told you that your child was the most phenomenal athlete he's ever seen. You'd take the call, right? Even if you were a doctor , right?
Mary says her parents knew nothing about running, but everyone believed that Salazar was a running legend. Mary has said she was bullied off her high school team by the mean kids who were on it at the time. And I believe her when she says this. I believe she was bullied off her team and not that she was actually some prima donna who was too good for everyone there.
Why do I believe her? Do a google search of Bronxville. 7K people and a median household income of a cool 205K. The school itself is a K-12. A community of elitist elites. Heck, one of Mary's Bronxville XC teammates was the daughter of a VERY well known news anchor.
Mary was a gawky Harry Potter loving kid who brought stuffed animals with her to races. You think she was accepted by the type of people who live in Bronxville. Communities like that love conformation, and will tear down anyone who doesn't comply. I think Mary was maybe a sheltered and a bit nerdy kid who stole the spotlight from kids who felt really entitled to it. I can see why they bullied her. It happens.
So a bullied kid who basically can't go back to practice anymore gets a call from Salazar? Who wouldn't see it as a blessing!
You are 100% wrong. As a parent you should know if your child is mature enough for a pro contract. Mary CLEARLY wasn't and her parents knew it but made her take it anyway.
I've coached many athletes that were teammates with Mary Cain and they all said she was arrogant and mean because she felt like she was too good for them. It's the exact OPPOSITE of what you describe. Everyone wants to be friends with the fast kid. But Cain was mean and pushed everyone away.
she also claims that her teammates at Oregon Project were mean to her. And in interviews she stated pro's at races were jealous of her and mean to her when she was racing them. Her parents decided she didn't need to run relays for bronxville and that led to some of the issues. Her parents made poor decisions, they could have done some better research and also could have realized she wasn't ready to move across the country and join and bunch of adults in training. I mean she had a duck in interviews, she wasn't ready to be and adult training program. That's on them!
Someone I knew in swimming played golf in high school, decided to get more serious about swimming year around...went from decent recruit at a D1 program that at the time was ranked maybe 25th. His progression once fully into swimming was incredible: NCAA titles, Olympic Trials wins, Olympic medals (gold in relays).
I don't doubt at all she had the engine to have a roster spot. Some coaches would even take the raw athlete just on possibility.
You had a friend who was a nothing swimmer in highschool, who decided to get serious in college and won a gold medal for the US?
That is incredibly rare. Like no one ever does this rare. I wouldn't suggest Cain is going to get her form back that easily.
Said before, I'll say again...Salazar knows how to groom people. He did it with the Rupps, only they are still under his spell.
Salazar weaseled his way into the Rupp's family, and suddenly he's calling Galen's mom lecturing her about tamiflu, sending Galen to Nike doctors when he's in high school, giving him prednisone, and "testosterone medication" etc. Galen's parents still fawn over him. His father in an interview called Alberto "like a father to Galen". Dads usually don't say that about other men.
Salazar uses his name and clout to get into family's business. Imagine if Alberto called your home prior to 2015 and told you that your child was the most phenomenal athlete he's ever seen. You'd take the call, right? Even if you were a doctor , right?
Mary says her parents knew nothing about running, but everyone believed that Salazar was a running legend. Mary has said she was bullied off her high school team by the mean kids who were on it at the time. And I believe her when she says this. I believe she was bullied off her team and not that she was actually some prima donna who was too good for everyone there.
Why do I believe her? Do a google search of Bronxville. 7K people and a median household income of a cool 205K. The school itself is a K-12. A community of elitist elites. Heck, one of Mary's Bronxville XC teammates was the daughter of a VERY well known news anchor.
Mary was a gawky Harry Potter loving kid who brought stuffed animals with her to races. You think she was accepted by the type of people who live in Bronxville. Communities like that love conformation, and will tear down anyone who doesn't comply. I think Mary was maybe a sheltered and a bit nerdy kid who stole the spotlight from kids who felt really entitled to it. I can see why they bullied her. It happens.
So a bullied kid who basically can't go back to practice anymore gets a call from Salazar? Who wouldn't see it as a blessing!
I ran with a nationally ranked miler in my day and he was essentially a god to the rest of the team. I would think that would be the case with most national class HSers...even those who are assholes which I'm sure occurs.
To say Cain was "bullied" off the team by other much lesser teammates either is complete bs or says a lot about her personality. She has always seemed a bit "off" to me and maybe that played into any legit problem she had and probably still has. If this is the case then I really have to wonder what her parents were thinking sending their daughter across the country with basically no peer support. A terrible decision. She should have included them in the lawsuit.
Ed Moses, swam at UVA. Dude went from a middle of the road D1 recruit his junior and senior year of HS, then started swimming year around senior year and caught fire that spring. A few years later: NCAA titles, World records, Individual silver at Sydney Olympics and gold in relay. I use this example to say that talent and an engine can be there, and if someone didn't apply it to a certain sport (and in Mary Cain's case went all in with track), I don't doubt that she could have progressed to D1 swimming. Not saying she would have been elite. Ed Moses was a wild example. Pleasure to see him swim and get my butt whooped by him.
Hi. While we’re working on that, let me just say thanks to Pat and thanks to John for inviting me to come to the house and share a really fun story with you guys. I always call the period from summer nationals in our schedule...
Ed Moses, swam at UVA. Dude went from a middle of the road D1 recruit his junior and senior year of HS, then started swimming year around senior year and caught fire that spring. A few years later: NCAA titles, World records, Individual silver at Sydney Olympics and gold in relay. I use this example to say that talent and an engine can be there, and if someone didn't apply it to a certain sport (and in Mary Cain's case went all in with track), I don't doubt that she could have progressed to D1 swimming. Not saying she would have been elite. Ed Moses was a wild example. Pleasure to see him swim and get my butt whooped by him.
So basically what you're saying here is: If you want your kid to be a gold medalist and total stud go with either Ed or Edwin Moses. Worth a shot.
No joke. We’ve all learned the hard way. The technical skills required to ride a time trial bike are immense. Egan Bernal was roughed up pretty good on a training ride recently. She’ll likely make up for it on the run though.
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