josh1988 wrote:
Real issue is the police releasing a statement that the man slipped and was injured.
Everyone wants to claim “one bad apple” but 20 cops witnessed this assault and not one of them wrote their own report of what actually happened.
And now 57 of them have resigned in support for the two reprimanded officers.
answers we need wrote:
Obvi wrote:
1) Enforcing the law would mean arresting him.
2) Shoving him to the ground is not only failing to enforce the law (see point 1), it is breaking the law/assault. The policeman should have been arrested on the spot. As such, it must be asked of you: Do you not want laws enforced? Do you believe in laws at all?
1) How would they go about arresting him? He had failed to comply with all lawful orders through that point in time. Is it your belief that he would suddenly have had a change of heart and complied with an order to turn around and peaceably place his hand behind his back to be handcuffed? Why do you believe that based on the available evidence? Assuming he would not, would force then need to be utilized? If he resisted, what force would be acceptable for police to use then? Grabbing? Pushing? Pepper spray? Tasing? If he fell to the ground while attempting to be handcuffed, would that be materially different in your eyes than what happened here? Why?
2) Police are duly authorized by the laws in that state to employ the force necessary to gain compliance with lawful orders. To any claims that, "if you or I pushed a 75 year old man down we'd be arrested immediately" that is correct. You would also be arrested for wearing a badge and gun in public, while police would not. Are you aware that laws exist which cover this dichotomy? Are you stating that pushing is not an authorized use of force? Are you basing that on any actual case law or is it a gut feeling based on emotion?
If your complaint is that police are enforcing laws you disagree with, your beef is with the elected officials who passed the curfew law. Elect leaders who better represent you
If you think the police should have moved around him, what then is the point of the curfew law? Should they only allow people 75 and older to continue to reside in the area past curfew? All people? No people? Is that not then selective and therefore discriminatory enforcement of laws and inherently unequal?
If your complaint is that, "just following orders" isn't a valid defense, are you saying that police should selectively ignore laws your own democratically elected officials pass? Which ones? Would you protest if police decided not to enforce any laws as a matter of personal reasoning, but still continued to be paid? How many laws could they reasonably ignore before you would begin to be upset that they are no longer carrying out their functions?
Are you trying to get cop j*zz on your face man? You are sucking it so freakin hard
ReallybroReally wrote:
former West Pointer wrote:
Thank you. This is the point I have been making.
Does anybody remember exactly how the U.S.A. came into existence? Does anybody remember the oppressive abuses of power that led to the Revolution?
Why are some U.S. citizens, the inheritors of that legacy, now supporting the same sorts of abuses of power? Amazing.
U.S. citizens should not be subject to:
- illegal abuses of power
- assault,
- violations of constitutional rights
- extrajudicial killings
at the hands of government authorities or employees.
Everybody -- Agree? Disagree? Let's hear it. Where do you stand?
Agree but I do not believe this(Buffulo) instance involved any of those items.
getting stiff armed so your skull bones off the pavement and you start bleeding out of the ears is not assault?
this was very nearly an extrajudicial killing as well, the mn is in serious condition
you don't think American's have the right to not being assaulted by their own police?
you don't think that was abuse of power?
There are a bunch of entitled brats in this thread. You all cry about police being evil, but you all are the FIRST to call the cops if someone scratches your Prius in the parking lot of a Whole Foods.
You scream loudly that we should defund the police while you are the LEAST likely to be able to defend yourselves in the absence of a police presence.
You bask in the security that they provide you, yet complain from your mom's basement about how they do it.
If you continue to disrespect the cops, they might not be there the next time you need them.
fact checker 642572498 wrote:
We should hold citizens up to higher standards. There are tens of thousands looting and lighting this on fire and many are murdering police, yet morons like you cheerlead that behavior. And a copy exerts 5 pounds too much force in a light push and that's all you can focus on.
what your dumb skull doesn't seem to understand is that if cops didn't do dumbshit like shown in this video.....THEY WOULDN"T BE OUT FIGHTING RIOTS RIGHT NOW.
game over wrote:
ReallybroReally wrote:
Agree but I do not believe this(Buffulo) instance involved any of those items.
getting stiff armed so your skull bones off the pavement and you start bleeding out of the ears is not assault?
this was very nearly an extrajudicial killing as well, the mn is in serious condition
you don't think American's have the right to not being assaulted by their own police?
you don't think that was abuse of power?
he was pushed, staggered back and lost his balance. probably because he was 75 and wasn't ready for the push.
answers we need wrote:
If he fell to the ground while attempting to be handcuffed, would that be materially different in your eyes than what happened here?
OF COURSE THAT WOULD BE MATERIALLY DIFFERENT
fact checker 642572498 wrote:
There are a bunch of entitled brats in this thread. You all cry about police being evil, but you all are the FIRST to call the cops if someone scratches your Prius in the parking lot of a Whole Foods.
You scream loudly that we should defund the police while you are the LEAST likely to be able to defend yourselves in the absence of a police presence.
You bask in the security that they provide you, yet complain from your mom's basement about how they do it.
If you continue to disrespect the cops, they might not be there the next time you need them.
No one is saying we do not the police in our communities. We need police reform to clean up their act.
fact checker 642572498 wrote:
There are a bunch of entitled brats in this thread. You all cry about police being evil, but you all are the FIRST to call the cops if someone scratches your Prius in the parking lot of a Whole Foods.
You scream loudly that we should defund the police while you are the LEAST likely to be able to defend yourselves in the absence of a police presence.
You bask in the security that they provide you, yet complain from your mom's basement about how they do it.
If you continue to disrespect the cops, they might not be there the next time you need them.
Yes, when facts elude you go to the ad hominem attacks.
The man wasn't confronting police. He was returning a helmet to them. A video I saw from my area showed police attacking a protester and then pepper-spraying everything in the area, and all the protester had been doing was walking. The police looked completely out of control. The fact is that the Kerner Commission back in 1967 found that police actions usually precipitate violence, through aggressive measures, riot police gear, harsh commands, etc. Forging relationships with organizers leads to peaceful protests and very much limits violence.
"An image captured on social media moments earlier showed the man returning a helmet to an officer."
I should add that the police then lied about the protester, claiming she, a teenager, had attacked them, which a video refuted.
psghhh wrote:
fact checker 642572498 wrote:
There are a bunch of entitled brats in this thread. You all cry about police being evil, but you all are the FIRST to call the cops if someone scratches your Prius in the parking lot of a Whole Foods.
You scream loudly that we should defund the police while you are the LEAST likely to be able to defend yourselves in the absence of a police presence.
You bask in the security that they provide you, yet complain from your mom's basement about how they do it.
If you continue to disrespect the cops, they might not be there the next time you need them.
No one is saying we do not the police in our communities. We need police reform to clean up their act.
I see many, many more abuses by non-cops. I am quite disappointed in how much looting is occurring here in NYC (I’m in Manhattan), how so many protesters violate curfew and how many attacks are being made against police. There should be many more arrests and stiffer penalties for all lawbreakers, whether police or civilian, but I see the civilians as far, far more to blame.
zxcvzcxv wrote:
I should add that the police then lied about the protester, claiming she, a teenager, had attacked them, which a video refuted.
Wait, what? I haven’t heard this.
zxcvzcxv wrote:
The man wasn't confronting police. He was returning a helmet to them. A video I saw from my area showed police attacking a protester and then pepper-spraying everything in the area, and all the protester had been doing was walking. The police looked completely out of control. The fact is that the Kerner Commission back in 1967 found that police actions usually precipitate violence, through aggressive measures, riot police gear, harsh commands, etc. Forging relationships with organizers leads to peaceful protests and very much limits violence.
"An image captured on social media moments earlier showed the man returning a helmet to an officer."
He was not returning a helmet. Even if he was, he could have just left it on the ground. He was trying to be a tough guy and they called his bluff.
It's clear they were just trying to get him to move and it's unfortunate the tough guy was such a weakling. If they actually wanted to harm him, they could have whacked him in the head with a baton.
What you don't realize is that the cops are outnumbered 100 to 1. The cops are at HIGH risk of danger. Houses are BURNING and and family owned business are being LOOTED. Every extra 5 minutes they spend on this decrepit old man is 5 minutes of CARNAGE that they aren't preventing.
Everyone out there wants to make the streets resemble a war zone then when the police react accordingly you cry. You are COWARDS and CRYBABIES.
fact checker 642572498 wrote:
zxcvzcxv wrote:
The man wasn't confronting police. He was returning a helmet to them. A video I saw from my area showed police attacking a protester and then pepper-spraying everything in the area, and all the protester had been doing was walking. The police looked completely out of control. The fact is that the Kerner Commission back in 1967 found that police actions usually precipitate violence, through aggressive measures, riot police gear, harsh commands, etc. Forging relationships with organizers leads to peaceful protests and very much limits violence.
"An image captured on social media moments earlier showed the man returning a helmet to an officer."
He was not returning a helmet. Even if he was, he could have just left it on the ground. He was trying to be a tough guy and they called his bluff.
It's clear they were just trying to get him to move and it's unfortunate the tough guy was such a weakling. If they actually wanted to harm him, they could have whacked him in the head with a baton.
What you don't realize is that the cops are outnumbered 100 to 1. The cops are at HIGH risk of danger. Houses are BURNING and and family owned business are being LOOTED. Every extra 5 minutes they spend on this decrepit old man is 5 minutes of CARNAGE that they aren't preventing.
Everyone out there wants to make the streets resemble a war zone then when the police react accordingly you cry. You are COWARDS and CRYBABIES.
no one is listening to you
It’s those abusive “officers” that are cowards and crybabies, and filthy liars to boot.
fact checker 642572498 wrote:
It's clear they were just trying to get him to move and it's unfortunate the tough guy was such a weakling. If they actually wanted to harm him, they could have whacked him in the head with a baton.
They also could have tased him or...better yet....shot the guy. After all, he was in the way.
CRYBABIES.
Look in the mirror nitwit.
Yup. This is extremely disturbing. Almost as disturbing as the people who endorse this behavior.
I haven’t read this whole thread, but has the police protest been mentioned? 57 officers on the emergency response team resigned to support the 2 officers who got laid off.
The two should be charged with assault.
Hope the old man gets well . But when I watched it several times you see he goes to put his hand between the officer’s gun arm and his holstered gun .
Cop can’t be a mind reader .
What was the man trying to do ?