Elizabeth Warren weighs in on the issue of transgender athletes dominating women's sports

That is the thing with these athletes. We have absolutely no clue what transitioning means. We get stuck looking at photos to see if they picked up 10lbs of fat that suggests lots of estrogen or lost muscle (i.e. tough to see in distance runners) but none of that is remotely scientific. At the pro level, the IAAF has regulations on test and the like. NCAA or HS, not so much.

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Isn’t boxing a combat sport? Are boxers really complaining about the fighting being too violent? I feel like I’m on “Punk’d” right now.[/quote]

Are you being deliberately obtuse? Even if both competitors are men, boxing matches are made between fighters of comparable experience and weight. Boxing commissions exist to attempt to ensure boxers aren't dangerously over-matched at at excessive risk of serious injury.

They don't allow heavyweights to fight middleweights and they won't allow men to fight women, even if they are exactly the same weight. It's a boxing ring, not a gladiatorial arena.

Lenny Leonard wrote:

Woke Science wrote:

Oh, this is rich. Somehow got don't believe I'm a fairy yet believe trans that claim biology doesn't exist or that they are multidimensional multibeing "transexuals" that have a hive mind. Me claiming to be a fairy compared to what I am seeing from trans is normal by comparison.

And you want to preach morality and yet want to let biological men beat up women in boxing and races.

I guess I misjudged your tone. I thought you were being facetious with your fairy comment. You have my apologies.

Isn’t boxing a combat sport? Are boxers really complaining about the fighting being too violent? I feel like I’m on “Punk’d” right now.

really? did Mike Tyson fight Oscar De La Hoya?

They don't allow heavyweights to fight middleweights and they won't allow men to fight women, even if they are exactly the same weight. It's a boxing ring, not a gladiatorial arena.

But the time's they are a changin'... though IMO not necessarily for the better on this score.

Nyla Rose, a trans-identified male whose nickname is Beast, was just crowned 2020 women's champion in the AEW. I realize that AEW-type wrestling is as much choreographed play-acting as an actual sport, but there sure does seem to be a fast-growing market for spectator events in which large males claiming to be women get applauded and win awards for physically dominating and trouncing females who are much, much smaller.

In a spectacle that the brilliant Andy Kaufman - who wrestled women for comedy in the early 1980s -could never have imagined even in his wildest dreams, the strapping trans-identified male won the championship from the previous women's title holder, a small and slight female from Japan named Riho.

Nyla Rose aka Beast is 5'7" and weighs 185 pounds. Riho is 5'2" and usually weighs in at between 93 and 98 pounds.

To get an idea of Nyla Rose's size compared to other's of the same sex, the new women's champ known as Beast can be seen next to a male AEW wrestler around the 4:40 mark:

i'm a stupid liberal and right now, bernie sanders is the only one i could even consider. andrew yang seemed promising but he got screwed by the system unfortunately. the other democrats are trash. still better than trump, but trash non the less

i'm against trans women being in women's sports, but the pro wrestling issue is a non issue. pro wrestling doesn't have weight classes, so even if we were to assume it was real, it wouldn't make much of a difference.

why no one say this wrote:

just saying man wrote:

And on another note, I’m curious if you or the other people who truly view them as girls would consider being in a relationship with one?

This is an underrated comment. Feel like people's true response to this reveals their deep down belief and not the one they project in order to pander or feel like they are with the "in" crowd.

Back in 2009, when Semenya arrived back in SA, the Sports Minister told the TV cameras , "She's a Woman !!"

In a Trevor Noah stand up at the time, not sure if he made it up, but when re-enacting the TV interview, he goes:

Sports Minister: "She's a woman!!"

TV reporter: "Would you marry her?"

Sports Minister: "She's not THAT kind of woman"

I am Sam wrote:

why no one say this wrote:

This is an underrated comment. Feel like people's true response to this reveals their deep down belief and not the one they project in order to pander or feel like they are with the "in" crowd.

Back in 2009, when Semenya arrived back in SA, the Sports Minister told the TV cameras , "She's a Woman !!"

In a Trevor Noah stand up at the time, not sure if he made it up, but when re-enacting the TV interview, he goes:

Sports Minister: "She's a woman!!"

TV reporter: "Would you marry her?"

Sports Minister: "She's not THAT kind of woman"

This POV is summed up by the popular saying, "trans ally in the tweets, transphobe in the sheets."

When it comes to Track there are only 2 data points: CeCe and Eastwood. I read somewhere that CeCe trained much harder after she transgendered and we don't know how diligent she was with her hormone treatments.

Eastwood was clearly 30 seconds a mile slower after transgendering. Her recent 4:45 mile is about 35 seconds slower than Jonathon Eastwood's 1500 conversion. BTC's belief that a 9:55 boy could transgender and receive a scholarship as a girl is extremely unlikely.

The NCAA is not forcing hormone treatment on anyone. If the athlete does not want to take the treatments, she has the option not to compete. Semenya fought the requirements of testosterone surpression at the highest level and lost.

This argument has been round and round the mulberry bush: transitioning does not level the playing field.

Armstronglivs wrote:

SDSU Aztec wrote:

When it comes to Track there are only 2 data points: CeCe and Eastwood. I read somewhere that CeCe trained much harder after she transgendered and we don't know how diligent she was with her hormone treatments.

Eastwood was clearly 30 seconds a mile slower after transgendering. Her recent 4:45 mile is about 35 seconds slower than Jonathon Eastwood's 1500 conversion. BTC's belief that a 9:55 boy could transgender and receive a scholarship as a girl is extremely unlikely.

The NCAA is not forcing hormone treatment on anyone. If the athlete does not want to take the treatments, she has the option not to compete. Semenya fought the requirements of testosterone surpression at the highest level and lost.

This argument has been round and round the mulberry bush: transitioning does not level the playing field.

I didn't say it leveled the playing field, but BTC seemed to believe the treatments had zero negative effect and that a 9:55 boy could transgender and receive a scholarship.

missilesilo wrote:

Would you expect anything different about men pretending to be women from someone who has spent their life pretending to be Native American?

+1 THIS

RunRagged wrote:

This POV is summed up by the popular saying, "trans ally in the tweets, transphobe in the sheets."

lol

I never saw where BTC said that treatments had zero effect. BTC said that a 9:50 boy who decides to identify as a girl could take the roster spot and scholarship of a girl. Nowhere did it say anything about transitioning or treatments. This is exactly what is happening - boys are identifying as girls in HS and denying biological girls the opportunity to win. I’ve never read of any of these identifying girls that are taking treatments. The only thing they are taking is state medals from biological girls. And to cite ONE individual (Eastwood) as a case study is ludicrous!!! That’s like saying “smoking doesn’t cause cancer. My grandpa smoked for 50 years and never got cancer.” Besides, what if Eastwood had not wanted to inject chemicals into their system but still identified as a girl and provided a letter from their physician stating their ‘intent’ to transition. Sounds like they would still have been able to compete as a woman in the NCAA. Back to the original argument...this whole topic is laced with so much ambiguity and denial of factual science that it will create complete legal havoc as more cases are heard. Legally you can’t have Title IX/Women’s rights where the definition woman is open for opinion.

Armstronglivs wrote:

Warren is probably another politician who has never competed at any significant level in sports. Without that background, she is like many others who haven't understood the overwhelming advantages that biological males have in women's sport.

Politicians almost always support what their party supports.

As for me and my house we shall vote against the trumpeteer.

Even if she is wrong in a few cases. Anything is better than the

pompous texter.

Lenny Leonard wrote:

just saying man wrote:

If you had a daughter and she was competing against a trans in a boxing match, would you feel the same way?

I have a daughter. I would never encourage her to box, as I don’t think it’s a safe sport for any of my children but especially for girls. Then again, if she became a boxer despite that, I wouldn’t care. It’s a sport about punching people until they can’t get up, not a tickling contest.

Seems like you're contradicting yourself here Lenny? You say you wouldn't want your daughter to box because it's not safe...but that if she did, you wouldn't care if she fought someone who had an obvious physical advantage

.....making it even more unsafe.....

Your arguments are weak and disingenuous.

judgmentalness wrote:

Putterpus wrote:

Anyone who thinks a man or woman who wants to change their gender isn't suffering from extreme mental illness is just deluding themself.

There's such a crisis of "not wanting to offend" that people will now tolerate any destructive behavior.

You should accept them for being who they are just like they accept you for having a low IQ.

But that's NOT who they are. It's what their mental/emotional illness makes them THINK they are.

g. chuvalo wrote:

Lenny Leonard wrote:

I have a daughter. I would never encourage her to box, as I don’t think it’s a safe sport for any of my children but especially for girls. Then again, if she became a boxer despite that, I wouldn’t care. It’s a sport about punching people until they can’t get up, not a tickling contest.

Seems like you're contradicting yourself here Lenny? You say you wouldn't want your daughter to box because it's not safe...but that if she did, you wouldn't care if she fought someone who had an obvious physical advantage

.....making it even more unsafe.....

Your arguments are weak and disingenuous.

I contain multitudes.

I didn’t contradict myself.

I think boxing is unsafe at any level. Whether or not you are fighting someone 50 lbs smaller than you or 100 lbs more, you deserve whatever you get.

I’d be disappointed in her in either situation, and i wouldn’t feel sympathy for her or her opponent when they both willing agree to beat the hell out of each other.

Multiple genders should result in one category for sports. That is the only solution. How can we continue to count everything in terms of male or female when we have several other genders? Title IX requires equal opportunity for males and females but does not address the other genders.