NOPe wrote:
You are correct though that Jakob is already a better 5000m runner than Galen ever was. That much is obvious.
...and 800, and 1500, and 3k, and steeple, and xc.
Havent even gotten to 10k and longer yet but no way does he not surpass Rupp in those too.
Reality, Rupp certifiers!
Champion of What? wrote:
Bullet_Proof wrote:
Youre right hes not a 12:50 5000m runner. But at least his 12:58 is better than 13:02.
Ingebrigtsen is NOT a 12:58 5000m runner.
Ingebrigtsen is NOT a 26:44 10000m runner.
Ingebrigtsen is NOT a 2:06:07 marathoner.
Ingebrigtsen is NOT an Olympic Silver Medallist, meaning running fast when it matters, like a baller.
Cant argue with those facts. Youre actually arguing the tadese point, that because tadese could hang 90% of the race with bekele, maybe he could beat him. Nope. Because Ingebrigtsen can hang with the best doesnt mean he can beat the best.
Also, youre mad that a middle class kid from the pacific northwest has a better overall running performance history than some smug pretentious european
Mad??
You're high.
Let's take the very significant 33 second difference in their 5k times at 18 years old and sweep them aside for a moment.
Facts:
1500/mile?
JI = 3:30 & 3:51 @ 18 years old
GR was 3:45 & 4:01 @ 18
3k??
JI hit 8:00 @ 16
GR was 8:03 @ 18
3k steeple?
Jakob 8:26 @ 16, (first and only steeple run)
Rupp never.
800 JI hit 1:49 @ 16
Rupp, ??? No 800s for young Rupp
Championships?? (NOT COUNTING OWN COUNTRY)
JI by age 18:
Euro 1500 & Euro 5k, 2018
Euro indoor: 5k & 3k, 2019
Euro xc: 2016, 17, 18
Euro junior: 1500, 5k, 3k, 2017
Rupp:
@18: Pan American junior 5k.
Since: None. Silver don't count, Bullet-proof
.....Beyond U.S. soil Rupp is NOT a Champion at anything.
You know, like running fast when it matters, you know, like you say, a baller.
In summary, no comparison really.
Rupp WAS really good.
But JI is showing to be clearly superior at every event, even without adding his future 10ks, 1/2s & marathons to his resume.
Thats not the way the OP is arguing. That is not the logic the OP is using. Lets use the OPs logic: when people claim that Galen Rupp COULD have easily run 12:50, nope is saying that that doesnt matter because he didnt ever actually run that time. Fair enough. While I disagree, I see Nope's point.
So to give nope a taste of his own medicine, we apply the same logic to Ingebrigsten: he COULD run 12:50, but he didnt actually run that time.
Comparing where people are at based on age is a futile pursuit. The only real way to compare is by absolute results.
Jakob´s progression in the 5000m:
age 15 14:38.67
age 16 13:35.84
age 17 13:17.06
age 18 13:02.03 (so far; I think that he in a fast race can go 5-10 seconds faster this year)
Why won´t you believe that he can improve with further 25-35 seconds up into his mid twenties?
LetsRun message board logic:
Rupp runs 12:58.9 but is a drug cheat
Ingebrigsten runs 13:02.03 as a 18 year old but, of course, is clean.
How come no one is thinking Ingebrigsten could be on something?
MeHereYouWhere?! wrote:
LetsRun message board logic:
Rupp runs 12:58.9 but is a drug cheat
Ingebrigsten runs 13:02.03 as a 18 year old but, of course, is clean.
How come no one is thinking Ingebrigsten could be on something?
Why would you assume that nobody thinks Jakob is “on something?” You seem as if you are on something. I have not addressed the issue but that is no indication of my thinking, and the same is obviously true for many others.
TrackCoach wrote:
he only had 3 pro races where from gun to finish the the focus was clearly on time
What an absurdly incorrect statement.
abc 123 wrote:
Really? Please let us know where Rupp had the opportunity to run a fast 5000. How many Rietis, Monacos, Lausannes, Brussels, etc did he get to run?
Monaco 2013 was won in 12:51. Roma 2014 was won in 12:54. Zurich 2010 was 12:55. He had chances. It's not like Farah where he won all of his races, either. I don't think he won any fast 5000m races outdoors.
asmither wrote:
abc 123 wrote:
Really? Please let us know where Rupp had the opportunity to run a fast 5000. How many Rietis, Monacos, Lausannes, Brussels, etc did he get to run?
Monaco 2013 was won in 12:51. Roma 2014 was won in 12:54. Zurich 2010 was 12:55. He had chances. It's not like Farah where he won all of his races, either. I don't think he won any fast 5000m races outdoors.
The Monaco 5000m in 2013 was a perfect illustration of what the fanboys cannot understand. A group of 5 went through 3000m in 7:41, which is 12:48 pace ( a perfect pace for Galen to run fast). Galen could not keep up with them and so it had NOTHING to do with the race. Galen could NOT do it. The fanboys say it was the pace. Galen could NOT keep up at the pace the fanboys say was perfect.
seasoned ranker wrote:
TrackCoach wrote:
he only had 3 pro races where from gun to finish the the focus was clearly on time
What an absurdly incorrect statement.
+1
NOPe wrote:
You are correct though that Jakob is already a better 5000m runner than Galen ever was. That much is obvious.
How are we supposed to believe you when you say that Jakob is better than Galen when Galen has a faster 5000 m time?
Bullet_Proof wrote:
NOPe wrote:
You are correct though that Jakob is already a better 5000m runner than Galen ever was. That much is obvious.
How are we supposed to believe you when you say that Jakob is better than Galen when Galen has a faster 5000 m time?
Time is just one factor, look at what would've happened to Rupp if he was in that race in which Jakob ran 13:02, Rupp would've been back in 13:08-13:10.
NOPe wrote:
asmither wrote:
Monaco 2013 was won in 12:51. Roma 2014 was won in 12:54. Zurich 2010 was 12:55. He had chances. It's not like Farah where he won all of his races, either. I don't think he won any fast 5000m races outdoors.
The Monaco 5000m in 2013 was a perfect illustration of what the fanboys cannot understand. A group of 5 went through 3000m in 7:41, which is 12:48 pace ( a perfect pace for Galen to run fast). Galen could not keep up with them and so it had NOTHING to do with the race. Galen could NOT do it. The fanboys say it was the pace. Galen could NOT keep up at the pace the fanboys say was perfect.
Thats a lot of explanation for a moot point. So what he couldnt keep up?
"All that for a drop of blood"
-Thanos after Iron Man tries, unsuccessfully, to injure Thanos.
Bullet_Proof wrote:
NOPe wrote:
The Monaco 5000m in 2013 was a perfect illustration of what the fanboys cannot understand. A group of 5 went through 3000m in 7:41, which is 12:48 pace ( a perfect pace for Galen to run fast). Galen could not keep up with them and so it had NOTHING to do with the race. Galen could NOT do it. The fanboys say it was the pace. Galen could NOT keep up at the pace the fanboys say was perfect.
Thats a lot of explanation for a moot point. So what he couldnt keep up?
"All that for a drop of blood"
-Thanos after Iron Man tries, unsuccessfully, to injure Thanos.
So I don't buy the argument that Galen Rupp could have run much faster if he had been in faster races. He was in plenty of races to improve upon his PR, and he didn't win any of them.
asmither wrote:
Bullet_Proof wrote:
Thats a lot of explanation for a moot point. So what he couldnt keep up?
"All that for a drop of blood"
-Thanos after Iron Man tries, unsuccessfully, to injure Thanos.
So I don't buy the argument that Galen Rupp could have run much faster if he had been in faster races. He was in plenty of races to improve upon his PR, and he didn't win any of them.
I don't what happened in those 5000's but 26:44 is a phenomenal time and if he had instead run a 5000 that night he would been under 12:50. His splits were 13:25/13:19 with a big negative split at the end that made the 2nd half close to 13:12 in quality. Do you really believe he would have run 12:59 without the 13:25 warm-up?
Some of you simply have little understanding of the sport. Canova understands this. Let us take Paul Tanui, obviously a better 10000m runner than Galen Rupp. Tanui has 3 WC bronze medals and 1 Olympic silver medal, all at 10000m. Tanui has run 26:49 but he ran 26:50 in a WC race. Clearly he is better than Galen at 10000m. Paul has run many 5000m races and his best is 12:58. This is not surprising. What is surprising is how little many of you grasp about the sport.
By your logic, Jakob's max is 13:02. He can never go below that. Let's see.
SDSU Aztec wrote:
asmither wrote:
So I don't buy the argument that Galen Rupp could have run much faster if he had been in faster races. He was in plenty of races to improve upon his PR, and he didn't win any of them.
I don't what happened in those 5000's but 26:44 is a phenomenal time and if he had instead run a 5000 that night he would been under 12:50. His splits were 13:25/13:19 with a big negative split at the end that made the 2nd half close to 13:12 in quality. Do you really believe he would have run 12:59 without the 13:25 warm-up?
I’m positive he wouldn’t have run 12:49.
you joker wrote:
By your logic, Jakob's max is 13:02. He can never go below that. Let's see.
You are not very bright and you epically fail logic.
NOPe wrote:
Some of you simply have little understanding of the sport. Canova understands this. Let us take Paul Tanui, obviously a better 10000m runner than Galen Rupp. Tanui has 3 WC bronze medals and 1 Olympic silver medal, all at 10000m. Tanui has run 26:49 but he ran 26:50 in a WC race. Clearly he is better than Galen at 10000m. Paul has run many 5000m races and his best is 12:58. This is not surprising. What is surprising is how little many of you grasp about the sport.
A tell tale sign that someone is losing a debate is when they change the subject. Instead of arguing the main point, jakob's 13:02 to Galen's 12:58, nope changes the subject and talks about another runner, tanui.
Nope, we have a good enough understanding of the sport to know that Ingebrigstein is a talented young runner with a lot of potential, but still hasn't proven himself to the extent that Galen Rupp has over the last 10 years. He doesn't have the same record in terms of olympic medals, national championship wins, college domination, scalping of top runners like Kenenisa Bekele and Bernard Lagat, world marathon major win, and an elusive 26:44 10000m time.
Bullet_Proof wrote:
NOPe wrote:
Some of you simply have little understanding of the sport. Canova understands this. Let us take Paul Tanui, obviously a better 10000m runner than Galen Rupp. Tanui has 3 WC bronze medals and 1 Olympic silver medal, all at 10000m. Tanui has run 26:49 but he ran 26:50 in a WC race. Clearly he is better than Galen at 10000m. Paul has run many 5000m races and his best is 12:58. This is not surprising. What is surprising is how little many of you grasp about the sport.
A tell tale sign that someone is losing a debate is when they change the subject. Instead of arguing the main point, jakob's 13:02 to Galen's 12:58, nope changes the subject and talks about another runner, tanui.
Nope, we have a good enough understanding of the sport to know that Ingebrigstein is a talented young runner with a lot of potential, but still hasn't proven himself to the extent that Galen Rupp has over the last 10 years. He doesn't have the same record in terms of olympic medals, national championship wins, college domination, scalping of top runners like Kenenisa Bekele and Bernard Lagat, world marathon major win, and an elusive 26:44 10000m time.
Ummmmmmm. Jakob was 8 years old 10 years ago so yes Galen had the better decade. That was never the argument. The thread is about the fact that Jakob is the better runner of the two, at age 18 running a 5000m race that a prime Galen would have been struggling to match. Jakob is a better runner now than Galen ever was and his father is a better coach than Alberto. Your head appears to be bullet proof.