12 weeks to go in a Sub 2:20 Marathon Plan, how would you write it?

This was a great thread. Lots of support mixed with lots of honest assessment and lots of good advice from different perspectives. Most of all, a great outcome for the OP who put in a ton of work and whose posts should help remind all of us that even really talented runners feel uncertain and insecure, even when they've worked really hard. A great thread, made even greater by the outcome.

Congratulations, Evan:

https://twitter.com/Eli_Runs/status/938185703875211264

Congrats to the OP. As fellow runner who achieved their OTQ on Sunday, this thread has been an inspiration. Great advice on workouts and seeing Force put in some serious miles and monster workouts was motivating.

What's next for you Force? Are you planning a long break or get back into it? Are you going to target a spring marathon or do track/ shorter road races?

Best of luck whatever you plan!

Congrats!

While I knew that sub 2:19 wasn't going to be an easy thing bc it is a fast time, especially when not running professionally (aka you have to work), you really had one thing going for you that many here overlooked: Volume and consistency. You just have a great baseline of fitness right now.

Recover well!

Pikachu

Didn't see this thread before now but ti was a great read. Seems like there are many ways to skin a cat! I think that Evan's biggest thing was that he was doing very good and consistent workouts week after week. Other than near his half marathon he never got sick or missed workouts. He also was putting in HUGE volume that makes me feel like a wuss having rarely run over 90 mpw.

I hope to takeaway something from this thread before Boston in 2018 where I will try to PR despite the weather/course.

Evan, one thing I'd like to know is how much you were sleeping and working during this buildup. You couldn't have had much spare time!

Eli - Again, thank you!

FellowOTQ - Thanks, and congrats to you as well! I'm running Club XC this Saturday then just running easy until January 1. I'll do Shamrock Shuffle in March and considering Raleigh 10k on the track a few days after that as well. Goal for the spring is USA 25k in Grand Rapids. Then probably the same races during the summer/fall and CIM next year as well.

Pikachu - I always do appreciate your words and advice!

Reed - Thanks again for your spreadsheet. It helped knowing general strategy for each mile. Lets see...... Sleep wise my iPhone tells me I averaged 7hrs 17min of sleep the month leading up to the marathon. I'd say that's normal for the rest of the year too. I usually run in the morning at 6am with my roommate, then again on a break at work (3 or 4pm) or after work (6 or 8pm). I usually work 40-45 hours a week at the running store I manage so most days are run, work, run which I don't mind at all!

forcerunner wrote:

Reed - Thanks again for your spreadsheet. It helped knowing general strategy for each mile. Lets see...... Sleep wise my iPhone tells me I averaged 7hrs 17min of sleep the month leading up to the marathon. I'd say that's normal for the rest of the year too. I usually run in the morning at 6am with my roommate, then again on a break at work (3 or 4pm) or after work (6 or 8pm). I usually work 40-45 hours a week at the running store I manage so most days are run, work, run which I don't mind at all!

The spreadsheet isn't very useful compared to a pack of 30 guys running fast together. Pacing is only part of the equation!

Evan, I hope you don't mind me looking up your past results, but..... Are you the 4:34/9:52 HS'er from Columbus? Did you run in college?

jewbacca wrote:

Evan, I hope you don't mind me looking up your past results, but..... Are you the 4:34/9:52 HS'er from Columbus? Did you run in college?

Yep I've thrown out the anonymity here haha. I'm from Columbus and currently live and train here as well. I ran 1:59, 4:34, 9:43, and 15:54 (5k XC) for times in High School. I walked on to OSU when Robert Gary was the head coach in 2011. Got hurt that fall for XC and ran 27:00+ for 8k XC, ran a few weeks for indoor training then got hurt again and was failing academically. Took some time off running then turned around my grades and got healthy after like 2 months in the pool.

Gary left for Furman and I was still on the team that fall when the new coach (Brice Allen) came into the position. Ran just over 26:00 for 8k that fall and 32:12 for a 10k road race on Thanksgiving. Coach Allen cut me and said I was too slow for the program and that I should hang up my shoes. Took a few months of pouting then I got serious with training.

I discovered training stuff on Letsrun and read through the top sticky thread and all the links at least a 100 times. Came up with my own training plan from 2012 through 2015, then started working with my current coach/boss (Jim Jurcevich) in 2016.

Here is the progression since then with average weekly mileage for the year in parentheses:

2012 (45) - 15:30 5k, 26:02 8k, 32:12 10k

2013 (67) - 4:26 road mile, 15:04 5k, 25:48 8k, 31:51 10k

2014 (92) - 4:23 indoor mile, 8:45 3k, 14:57 5k, 25:30 8k, 31:24 10k, 69:06 HM

2015 (102) - 8:33 3k, 14:52 5k, 25:02 8k, 2:31:58 marathon

2016 (112) - 14:31 5k, 24:46 5mi, 30:47 10k, 67:32 HM

2017 (120 so far) - 14:27 5k, 24:12 5mi, 30:10 10k, 67:28 HM, 2:18:17 Marathon

can't believe you've managed to PR over many distances year after year. and your annual averages are insane. no wonder you've become so much better.

The question is...have you told your collegiate coach Allen about your OTQ? I would rub that in his face SO HARD

Followed the race while you ran. Cheering you from afar on the internet. Glad you reached this goal. What is your next move?

Igy

forcerunner wrote:

Here is the progression since then with average weekly mileage for the year in parentheses:

2012 (45) - 15:30 5k, 26:02 8k, 32:12 10k

2013 (67) - 4:26 road mile, 15:04 5k, 25:48 8k, 31:51 10k

2014 (92) - 4:23 indoor mile, 8:45 3k, 14:57 5k, 25:30 8k, 31:24 10k, 69:06 HM

2015 (102) - 8:33 3k, 14:52 5k, 25:02 8k, 2:31:58 marathon

2016 (112) - 14:31 5k, 24:46 5mi, 30:47 10k, 67:32 HM

2017 (120 so far) - 14:27 5k, 24:12 5mi, 30:10 10k, 67:28 HM, 2:18:17 Marathon

Wow. Just wow. I knew you are consistent but still didn't realize that you ran 120 -freakin'- MPW AVERAGE this year. That is quite some feat. As a guy who always juggled work + college + running and now working a pretty intense job and running and not having been great in HS like you I absolutely love those underdog stories whenever I hear them. If you just stay at 120 you will develop even further. I don't know how much sense a significant increase in mileage makes but obviously you know your body very well and are rolling right now. I am a bit older and found it easier to not double every day bc of recovery and I do more longish runs (like 12 - 16 miles). BUT: Just food for thought, I really dont want to give any "advice" bc you're just on a roll and every runner is an experiment of one IMHO. Just that: I'll always love to read your stuff, just keep running, dude!

Pikachu

Are you as petty as me - petty enough to have someone snap a picture of you at the Olympic Trials starting line and then mailing it (old school hard copy by US mail) to coach Allen with a note "Thanks for the advice!"? Based on your posts, I suspect you're above that, but it's what I would do.

Smoove wrote:

Are you as petty as me - petty enough to have someone snap a picture of you at the Olympic Trials starting line and then mailing it (old school hard copy by US mail) to coach Allen with a note "Thanks for the advice!"? Based on your posts, I suspect you're above that, but it's what I would do.

This makes me sad.

Absolutely amazing thread on several levels. Thanks for all who shared. The OP absolutely killed it. Thanks to all who shared. There is a ton of great information in this thread. Thanks.

Sounds like getting cut was a good good thing in the long run. Nothing like a little pure hate to fuel years of 100mpw!

reed - I do attribute lots of my improvement to racing a lot over whatever distance I can. That racing mindset needs to be tapped into more often than not I've found. It helps keep me pointing towards something new each month too. You know I thought about it, but it's better for me to keep my mouth shut. I wouldn't rub it in anyones face, just let them know about it.

Igy - Thanks so much! I really do appreciate all the helpful posts. I'm going to take some downtime till the start of the new year then gear up for a spring racing block ending with the US 25k in May.

Pikachu - It's been a while since the Road Racing thread days hasn't it? That's something I was questioning myself too. I think I'm at a good place with training and I can work on making the specific efforts more specific instead of just blindly increasing mileage. 120 is a real sweet spot for week to week for me, but I do like the occasional 130-150 week here and there as well as a taper week for races.

Smoove - I'd probably lean towards the latter option haha. First thing is making it to 2020 healthy on the start line.

Masterblaster13 - Thanks for reading!

Why the move to use a coach? Seems like you had a good thing going on your own. Not doubting the decision, just curious.

forcerunner wrote:

Here is the progression since then with average weekly mileage for the year in parentheses:

2012 (45) - 15:30 5k, 26:02 8k, 32:12 10k

2013 (67) - 4:26 road mile, 15:04 5k, 25:48 8k, 31:51 10k

2014 (92) - 4:23 indoor mile, 8:45 3k, 14:57 5k, 25:30 8k, 31:24 10k, 69:06 HM

2015 (102) - 8:33 3k, 14:52 5k, 25:02 8k, 2:31:58 marathon

2016 (112) - 14:31 5k, 24:46 5mi, 30:47 10k, 67:32 HM

2017 (120 so far) - 14:27 5k, 24:12 5mi, 30:10 10k, 67:28 HM, 2:18:17 Marathon

Incredible. Interesting that you had such huge gains in 2016, compared to fairly moderate improvements 2013-2015. Why do you think that 2016 was so good?