Official NXN thread

age wrote:

giffypop17 wrote:

??

I'm not really sure what you're trying to say here. I was strictly comparing with high school performances.

Webb

3:53,3:59i,8:45i,1:47, 4:06/1:52/:49 triple, 2nd at FL, etc.

Ritz

2 time FL champ, 13:44 5k, 8:41 2 mile, 3rd at World Junior XC

Fernandez

14:24 course record in Cali, 8:34/4:00 3200/1600 double, 8:34 2 mile national record, 3rd at FL

Virgin

13:50 at Detweiller, no FL/Kinney at the time, 8:41, something like 10 sub9s in one season

etc...

Wasn't Fernandez like two years younger than Lukas V. when he ran those times.

In fact, weren't all these guys younger?

Lukas will be 18 in January.

Fernandez turned 17 the November of his senior year.

I don't know if they were all younger, but I do know that he has already done more to change the potential landscape of running in the comming years than all those of the past. I think it is about the confidence that he did it his own way. It kind of reminds me of someone in the past.

We will see how that works in the future, but so far it's looking pretty good.

Agreed. I was simply saying he'd have to do those, instead of just the ones you listed, for me to consider him the greatest. It's very possible he could run Fernandez-like times, or Rupp-like 3k/5k times. But I agree that I don't think he'll be running 1:47 or 3:53.

Agreed about maybe being the greatest in IL history. All depends on the next 6 months or so. Greatest emissary of running in IL history? Not disagreeing, but that's such a vague, undefined statement that I'm not going to discuss it at all. And that one'll take another 15-20 years before we can really know.

Agreed. He'll either stamp his name as being among the best, of he'll claim a spot as the best. What will be interesting will to be see not only what things he succeeds and fails at, but what things he will attempt. Will he go for World JR XC seriously? Will he go for the 2mile record? Will he for sub4? Will go for the HS 5k record? AJR 5k record? Will he try to do all of the above? Will he do none, and focus on some triathlon stuff? It'll be fun to see.

But, regardless of his next 6 month results, I think he has the opportunity to be the greatest influence in running in the next 10 years.[/quote]

DaveW wrote:

I don't know if they were all younger, but I do know that he has already done more to change the potential landscape of running in the comming years than all those of the past.

Not sure about. The performances of Ritz and Webb, and to a lesser degree, Hall and Sage, following the weaker period of the '90s, and coinciding with the rise of the internet, was absolutely huge. I don't see Verzbicas having that impact, partially because there's less of an impact to be made (Ritz, Webb, Rupp, Derrick, Fernandez already have this young generation fired up).

I'm sure others from previous generations could say the same thing of others. Specifically Ryun and Lindgren making major international noise as high schoolers seems to stand out to me as something that changed the landscape for years to come.

Feel my Pain wrote:

Show some sympathy please. The Sneaky Jew Bastards at Nike pay the expenses of the HS coaches who can't get a college gig. The HS coaches kowtow to the Chinks who own Nike. It's the highlight of their sad, pathetic running careers.

Don't be an ass. The HS coaches who bring teams to this meet for the most part are much better coaches than the salesman (college coaches) who recruit kids to run for them at their respective colleges.

Agreed, but if they performed well, they would of been second well ahead of Saratoga today.

You clearly have great insight, but you do not have 20 years to figure it out ... they will crown Lukas before he has run his first real race.

As I said, Craig Virgin never ran a race with this pressure. CV came from corn fields and never had expectations because there was no money or Internet.

Lukas could be the next MJ, LJ, or Kim K's. But I don't think so.

I'm looking for him to do something special.

right now, Verzbicas rates as better than many of the Footlocker xc champions of the past, but he still has a long way to go to be one of the greatest hs distance runners, because he has to drop a lot of time in track.

In listening to the webcast, it was sad to hear the coach yelling at the girls to quit celebrating and wait for their last two girls to come in. It looks as if this coach waited for NTN to teach the girls about TEAM.

...they traditionally post after awards ceremony

mud and wind

he HS coaches who bring teams to this meet for the most part are much better coaches than the salesman (college coaches) who recruit kids to run for them at their respective colleges.

He is not even close to Ritz, Ryan, Webb, Sol, Teg, Meb and perhaps other true USA runners -- not because he doesn't have the same potential, but because it is a long road to realize that potential.

He has the same kind of promise that you saw in Jager, Derrick and Fernandez and perhaps even more. But that will be for another chapter a few years down the road.

Stauk at the Fat Farm wrote:

he HS coaches who bring teams to this meet for the most part are much better coaches than the salesman (college coaches) who recruit kids to run for them at their respective colleges.

Yeah sure. That's why HS coaches are stuck at the fat farm with the Catholic Priests and child molesters.

What the heck are you talking about? HS coaches develop talent, college coaches recruit talent. Still many Eff it up (Stanford just for starters, Oregon with only 5 finishers, come on, the Washington women), we could go on for days with this, but you get the picture.

With times today its hard for HS coaches who are teachers to even leave. Alot of times the $$ between coaching and teaching is too hard to pass up as many times it is a pay cut to the college level unless you at a place like Oregon, but lets be real, how many places are there like that that pay a significant amt for xc/tf?

So What FOO ? wrote:

Nice Chinese Shoe Faire in Portland today. Good job boys.

Thank you. Will you be watching and commenting from your living room next year as well?

Footlocker Forever wrote:

The announcers: Lukas V. didn't face a field of this caliber last year at Footlocker. Please. Footlocker Midwest Regional > NXN nationals.

Nice try, it was a little funny the first 99 times you posted that.

3rd at FLMW was 9th at NXN, 5th at FLMW was 18th at NXN, 6th at FLMW was 25th at NXN, 8th at FLMW was 29th at NXN.

29>8 in a bad way

Tons of great coaching is trapped in the high school ranks by the sad economic conditions of NCAA coaching. Would you rather live at the poverty level for years working your way up the ladder, moving around? Or would you rather get paid for what you're worth and create a nationally ranked program? I'm ten years in making $100,00 to teach and coach. How many collegiate coaches will ever make that?

Until the economics change, some of the country's best coaches will have absolutely no incentive to take drastic pay cuts.

I think that there is very little knowledge from these posters on what a college coach does. While recruiting a great roster is certainly the most important attribute, it is MUCH different coaching high school students than college students. The lifestyle and what motivates hs boys and girls is very different. To ignore this issue is foolish but hey, this is letsrun!