I do agree if he wins gold this year it becomes a lot more interesting but Kerr's record outside of the Worlds and Olympics isn't super impressive. Yes Worlds and Olympics are super super important but there are a lot more important races.
Not yet the best. But the same for Jakob as well. The word best is an unsuitable choice of vocabulary for all the athletes in this era. And for all the reasons already stated herewith on this thread.
When you say somebody is best, it means you are doing so from hindsight long after the end of their professional careers or at least near its twilight when they are in their 30s.
You can’t say somebody is best when they are still concurrently competing without clarifying that you are describing a certain limited time frame and selected races and competitors
I do agree if he wins gold this year it becomes a lot more interesting but Kerr's record outside of the Worlds and Olympics isn't super impressive. Yes Worlds and Olympics are super super important but there are a lot more important races.
Kerr is the expert on hindsight . If he runs well the race was very important but if he doesn't then it was just a race he was obliged to race or part of the bigger plan. My guess is that this is how most successful think but he choses to verbalise those thoughts ( wrongly in my humble opinion because he disrespects his competitors in doing so). Whereas others chose to internalise this thought process .
what is the fastest times of people from non-jacob races?
particularly those that he or a pacer led most the way? or actually any race.
does ANYONE have even a 329? in the non-Jacob race.
let that sink in
Yes between 2018-2021, Tim did what Jakob did every race and beat everyone but Elijah Manangoi. He ran under 3:30 and 3:29 and without wavelight. He also did frontrun a 3:29 ftw in Doha. The 1500 has leveled up and Jakob has taken full advantage of wavelight, superspikes and all his opportunities. But it’s not new what he’s doing, it’s just faster and then at 2000/3,000/2mile he’s really set amazing marks.
This post was edited 51 seconds after it was posted.
Kerr: “I’m trying to be the best 1500m runner of our era, and that means I need to have more titles than everyone else"
Also Kerr, last year: "I had raced enough for me and I wasn’t willing to go out and compete for those medals on an Olympic year. If I went out and won gold it wouldn’t meant too much to me this year if it didn’t follow the bigger goal."
If Jakob isn´t the clear no 1 in the 1500m at the moment, who is?
He has been no 1 in IAAF´s ranking for more than 2.5 years. And he was also ranked 1 this by LETSRUN and din´t AW do the same? And before he was no 2 for some years starting when he was still a teenager.
Kerr (who I guess is your favorite top miler?) is no 6 at the moment and have never been higher than no 3.
IMO, there isn't a clear number one, and that's OK. The need to rank is just barstool banter, it has no real meaning. Jakob does some things very well, but he has repeatedly failed to win the big race of the year in the 1500 since 2021. I remember years ago when Caroline Wozniacki managed to become WTA number one despite never winning a major up to that point. She was a consistent performer, getting to semis and finals but never winning. Was she really better than Serena or Clijsters at the time? No. Jakob is consistent through the season, but he's second best (or fourth best) when it really matters. So LRC and AW can rank him 1 if they like, that's fine, but is he favourite for the gold in Tokyo? Absolutely not. And if he isn't, then he's not a clear number one.
For the record, I root for several 1500 guys, but neither Kerr nor Ingebrigtsen, who are both monumental arseholes - it's very much the let_them_fight.gif for me when it comes to those two. I root for Wightman, Beamish, Tim C, Stonier, and increasingly, Hocker on the men's side. With a soft spot for Oli Hoare because he won me a lot of money when he took gold at the CWGs.
Jakob vs Yared 7-2 (Eugene 2023 and 2024, Oslo 2023, Rabat 2023, Budapest 2023, Monaco 2024, Brussels 2024 ------ Paris 2024, Zurich 2024) Jakobs biggest margin of victory against Yared: Monaco 2024 with +2.4 seconds Yareds biggest margin of victory again Jakob: Paris 2024 with +0.44 Seconds
Jakob vs Josh 9-3 ( World U20 Championships 2016, Doha 2019, Tokyo 2021, Oregon 2022, Lausanne 2022, Zurich 2022, Oslo 2023, Lausanne 2023, Zurich 2024, Budapest 2023, Eugene 2024, Paris 2024) Jakobs biggest margin of victory against Kerr: Lausanne 2022 with +3.23 seconds Kerrs biggest margin of victory against Jakob: Paris 2024 with +0.45 seconds
Jakob vs Cole 8-1 (Tokyo 2021, Eugene 2022, Eugene 2023, Budapest 2023, Eugene 2024, Lausanne 2024, Zurich 2024, Brussels 2024 - Paris 2024) Jakobs biggest margin of victory against Cole: Eugene 2023 with +3.35 seconds Coles biggest margin of victory against Jakob: Paris 2024 with +0.59 seconds
Outside of global championship golds, where all of the candidates for the best are tied, Jakob has the best placings in global championships he didn't win, fastest times, best performances on the circuit and non global championships, winning head to head record against the rest of the top candidates, ranked number one by IAAF...
There's no argument for who's the best right now.
This post was edited 35 seconds after it was posted.
what is the fastest times of people from non-jacob races?
particularly those that he or a pacer led most the way? or actually any race.
does ANYONE have even a 329? in the non-Jacob race.
let that sink in
Yes between 2018-2021, Tim did what Jakob did every race and beat everyone but Elijah Manangoi. He ran under 3:30 and 3:29 and without wavelight. He also did frontrun a 3:29 ftw in Doha. The 1500 has leveled up and Jakob has taken full advantage of wavelight, superspikes and all his opportunities. But it’s not new what he’s doing, it’s just faster and then at 2000/3,000/2mile he’s really set amazing marks.
Jakob has certainly elevated the 1500 to an even higher level since, but yeah people tend to overlook how Tim started the whole thing.
I remember that 3:28 he ran in Monaco where the pacers took him out in a ridiculous 52.5. Jakob became a 3:28 guy as well in that race, although he ran sensibly even 55.5s the whole way. Impressively, Tim was still able to narrowly hold him off in the homestretch when he should've rigged up after that suicidal opening.
I still think that with decent pacers that day to the bell Tim runs a similar time to Jakob's 2023 Silesia race - 3:27 low.
This post was edited 1 minute after it was posted.
Yeah not sure what "Rojo" is supposed to do about this - arrange a court martial and get Kerr on the stand to explain his comments? Take it easy.
And furthermore, I don't know why you think this is something directly aimed at just Americans - I mean the guy he clearly dislikes the most and has had the most verbal sparring with is Jakob - not an American.
But that particular comment from him is f-ing lame. It just is. He is absolutely insinuating he's the victim of doping indiscretions and I'm not sure on what basis he is making those claims. "I can only accept the loss and move on" - yeah dude, bringing up that you aren't cheating and can't control what other camps are doing doesn't sound like you are accepting your loss and moving on at all, in fact that's the total opposite.
I am actually starting to find this guy insufferable.
Yeah I like the Jakob-Josh rivalry but lets not pretend that either of them are clean. Most of them are doing the same drugs so it ends up being an even playing field.
That’s a lie. Stop spreading falsehoods. Both are most definitely clean but I like the implications of your accusations. It certainly implies you also think Nuguse and Hocker are doping since it’s an even playing field. I’m not the first to think so on this chat forum.
Yes between 2018-2021, Tim did what Jakob did every race and beat everyone but Elijah Manangoi. He ran under 3:30 and 3:29 and without wavelight. He also did frontrun a 3:29 ftw in Doha. The 1500 has leveled up and Jakob has taken full advantage of wavelight, superspikes and all his opportunities. But it’s not new what he’s doing, it’s just faster and then at 2000/3,000/2mile he’s really set amazing marks.
Jakob has certainly elevated the 1500 to an even higher level since, but yeah people tend to overlook how Tim started the whole thing.
I remember that 3:28 he ran in Monaco where the pacers took him out in a ridiculous 52.5. Jakob became a 3:28 guy as well in that race, although he ran sensibly even 55.5s the whole way. Impressively, Tim was still able to narrowly hold him off in the homestretch when he should've rigged up after that suicidal opening.
I still think that with decent pacers that day to the bell Tim runs a similar time to Jakob's 2023 Silesia race - 3:27 low.
Yeah that 1500m was in 2020. I agree that Tim might have been able to run low 3:27 if Timothy Sein hadn´t started out that fast. I think Tim was at his peak in 2020. If Tim has been in the same shape in the Olympic final in Paris he would have won (at least if he had stayed behind Jakob as the other ncompetitors did; if Tim had been frontrunning Jakob would have won).
I, however, don´t know how impressive it was that Tim could hold Jakob off since the latter was still only 19 years old and far from his peak shape (which I don´t think he has reached yet). I think it was quite impressive that Jakob could run a 3:28 even though he ran most of the race alone (he didn´t close the gap to Tim before in the beginning of the last lap).
Not yet the best. But the same for Jakob as well. The word best is an unsuitable choice of vocabulary for all the athletes in this era. And for all the reasons already stated herewith on this thread.
When you say somebody is best, it means you are doing so from hindsight long after the end of their professional careers or at least near its twilight when they are in their 30s.
You can’t say somebody is best when they are still concurrently competing without clarifying that you are describing a certain limited time frame and selected races and competitors
So Bolt is a 9-second man, not a 9.58 runner? Your claim isn't comparable because 12:35-flat isn't the record and no one but Cheptegei has run sub-12:36. The fractions of a second aren't an issue in the 5k record, because no one is near Cheptegei's time; they are in the 1500 record, where several runners have beaten 3:27. Only one is a true "3:26 man".
If some runner is a 3:26 1500m man (or a 12:40 5000m guy or...) doesn't depend on what others habe achieved and what the WR is but only on the PB of the runner in question.
Hard to believe this has to be explained.
So El G and Ingebrigtsen are both "3:26 men"? I wondered what the difference is between them.
Actually you are quite the timid person. You failed to highlight the most important quote of them all which shows Josh’s suspicion of Hocker, Nugise and Kessler doping.
”I’m not cheating, but I can’t control what the other camps are doing. I can only accept the result ( my loss to Hocker) and move on.”
Rojo you have lots to answer to us Americans today as a British athlete has clearly fired a shot at American camps clearly implying even if subtly that ‘he can’t control what the other camps are doing’ ( that means if the other camps are doping secretly he can do nothing about it), and that is the evidence of him knowing something is up with Hocker and the other 2 teammates.
Americans are awakened today after trumps victory. We will search every nook and cranny and test every piece of ‘fact’ to the fullest. Josh has spoken his mind, let those dirty Americans be banned for life.
Yeah not sure what "Rojo" is supposed to do about this - arrange a court martial and get Kerr on the stand to explain his comments? Take it easy.
And furthermore, I don't know why you think this is something directly aimed at just Americans - I mean the guy he clearly dislikes the most and has had the most verbal sparring with is Jakob - not an American.
But that particular comment from him is f-ing lame. It just is. He is absolutely insinuating he's the victim of doping indiscretions and I'm not sure on what basis he is making those claims. "I can only accept the loss and move on" - yeah dude, bringing up that you aren't cheating and can't control what other camps are doing doesn't sound like you are accepting your loss and moving on at all, in fact that's the total opposite.
I am actually starting to find this guy insufferable.
He's implying what many have suggested here, that American athletes are juicing to the gills. It's a dirty sport. He's probably right.
Such an overrated runner, why do we keep talking about him
He is overrated but we like him because he is perfectly clean of drugs. He subtly aired his displeasure at the American camp of Hocker, Nuguse and Kessler, trolling them as ‘I can’t control what the other camps are doing’ and prefaces the meaning of this sentence with ‘since I’m not cheating’.
That Josh prefaced the latter statement above with the former very clearly implies that he was referring to cheating in the other camps.
He is furious I tell you at Hocker, but he is masking it expertly in the name of diplomatic relations on the track.
So that’s that.
Hocker is just as suspicious as anyone else viewed that way. Another Katir, in all likelihood.
Yeah not sure what "Rojo" is supposed to do about this - arrange a court martial and get Kerr on the stand to explain his comments? Take it easy.
And furthermore, I don't know why you think this is something directly aimed at just Americans - I mean the guy he clearly dislikes the most and has had the most verbal sparring with is Jakob - not an American.
But that particular comment from him is f-ing lame. It just is. He is absolutely insinuating he's the victim of doping indiscretions and I'm not sure on what basis he is making those claims. "I can only accept the loss and move on" - yeah dude, bringing up that you aren't cheating and can't control what other camps are doing doesn't sound like you are accepting your loss and moving on at all, in fact that's the total opposite.
I am actually starting to find this guy insufferable.
Yeah I like the Jakob-Josh rivalry but lets not pretend that either of them are clean. Most of them are doing the same drugs so it ends up being an even playing field.
Outside of global championship golds, where all of the candidates for the best are tied, Jakob has the best placings in global championships he didn't win, fastest times, best performances on the circuit and non global championships, winning head to head record against the rest of the top candidates, ranked number one by IAAF...
There's no argument for who's the best right now.
The "best" win the big races; the ones that matter. Ingebrigtsen hasn't done so since 2021. Triumphs in the biggest arenas are how all the great champions are remembered: a moment of glory, not a year of consistency. No one would remember Billy Mills were it not for a day in Tokyo '64. This is what Ingebrigtsen has been unable to do over his main distance for several years.
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