We merged two threads on the same subject into 1. The original thread was entitled, "Mo Katie closes in 1:47.1 to run 3:36, winning euro team champs." We merged it with this thread which was started by LRC's Rojo.
A couple of facts to support Abdi Bile ran an amazing last 800 meters...
Thursday: 10:15AM - Won his opening round Heat in 3:38.05. Just getting up at 6a was brutal.
Friday: 3:35.67 Championship Record on Friday, to win his Semi-Final (granted, only the 2nd ever WC) .
Saturday was an off day.
Sunday September 6th - To me, more impressive that his 1:46 last 800, was from 500 meters to go to 100 meters to go. I ran 26.1-26.5 for each 200, or 52.7, and lost over a second to Abdi, running in the low 51 second range. And he won by 1.23 seconds over 3:47 miler JL Gonzalez from Spain.
A couple of facts to support Abdi Bile ran an amazing last 800 meters...
Thursday: 10:15AM - Won his opening round Heat in 3:38.05. Just getting up at 6a was brutal.
Friday: 3:35.67 Championship Record on Friday, to win his Semi-Final (granted, only the 2nd ever WC) .
Saturday was an off day.
Sunday September 6th - To me, more impressive that his 1:46 last 800, was from 500 meters to go to 100 meters to go. I ran 26.1-26.5 for each 200, or 52.7, and lost over a second to Abdi, running in the low 51 second range. And he won by 1.23 seconds over 3:47 miler JL Gonzalez from Spain.
- Someone answered Morceli to the question of who could beat Bile in that particular race, and that’s exactly what I thought. If we’re assuming the runner hits 700m at the same time as Bile, Morceli is the only guy I’m sure could have beaten him (with several other maybes).
Which performance of Morceli justifies this thought?
Both Cram and Gonzalez have run a sub 50 last lap in the European Cup earlier in the season - and both were completely destroyed by Bile. Bile must have been in WR shape on this day with UNIQUE finishing qualities (see also Jim Spivey's comment).
A couple of facts to support Abdi Bile ran an amazing last 800 meters...
Thursday: 10:15AM - Won his opening round Heat in 3:38.05. Just getting up at 6a was brutal.
Friday: 3:35.67 Championship Record on Friday, to win his Semi-Final (granted, only the 2nd ever WC) .
Saturday was an off day.
Sunday September 6th - To me, more impressive that his 1:46 last 800, was from 500 meters to go to 100 meters to go. I ran 26.1-26.5 for each 200, or 52.7, and lost over a second to Abdi, running in the low 51 second range. And he won by 1.23 seconds over 3:47 miler JL Gonzalez from Spain.
js
Bile's race was undoubtedly impressive but it should be borne in mind that it was more than two seconds slower at the finish than El G ran in Athens, who was only a fraction slower - 0.7secs - over the last 800m. He could conceivably have run 1:46-flat in a slower race, as Bile did.
Which performance of Morceli justifies this thought?
Both Cram and Gonzalez have run a sub 50 last lap in the European Cup earlier in the season - and both were completely destroyed by Bile. Bile must have been in WR shape on this day with UNIQUE finishing qualities (see also Jim Spivey's comment).
You can pretty much look at his World Titles in '91, '93 and '95. All pretty much 50 or 51 point last laps and pretty quick times. Under 1:50 for 800, and you have to think if he went hard from 800 or even 700 out and didn't save as much for the last lap running 53.5/52.5 was doable or close.
- Someone answered Morceli to the question of who could beat Bile in that particular race, and that’s exactly what I thought. If we’re assuming the runner hits 700m at the same time as Bile, Morceli is the only guy I’m sure could have beaten him (with several other maybes).
Which performance of Morceli justifies this thought?
Both Cram and Gonzalez have run a sub 50 last lap in the European Cup earlier in the season - and both were completely destroyed by Bile. Bile must have been in WR shape on this day with UNIQUE finishing qualities (see also Jim Spivey's comment).
His best times over the 1500 and the mile were significantly slower than Cram's records. Records over those distances require more than an ability to finish fast or run a fast last 800.
Which performance of Morceli justifies this thought?
Both Cram and Gonzalez have run a sub 50 last lap in the European Cup earlier in the season - and both were completely destroyed by Bile. Bile must have been in WR shape on this day with UNIQUE finishing qualities (see also Jim Spivey's comment).
You can pretty much look at his World Titles in '91, '93 and '95. All pretty much 50 or 51 point last laps and pretty quick times. Under 1:50 for 800, and you have to think if he went hard from 800 or even 700 out and didn't save as much for the last lap running 53.5/52.5 was doable or close.
I don't think he could have run the race the way Bile did - but we will never know.
- Someone answered Morceli to the question of who could beat Bile in that particular race, and that’s exactly what I thought. If we’re assuming the runner hits 700m at the same time as Bile, Morceli is the only guy I’m sure could have beaten him (with several other maybes).
Which performance of Morceli justifies this thought?
Both Cram and Gonzalez have run a sub 50 last lap in the European Cup earlier in the season - and both were completely destroyed by Bile. Bile must have been in WR shape on this day with UNIQUE finishing qualities (see also Jim Spivey's comment).
Cram in the ‘87 world championship race is hardly worth using for a comparison: he finished 8th in 3:41, and obviously wasn’t in top form. Bile did beat Gonzalez by 1.23 and Spivey by 2.02, which is obviously incredibly impressive. I do believe after all that there might only be one runner in history who would have beaten Bile in that race…
Really cool that Jim Spivey commented on the race. Thanks for that, Jim.
I shouldn’t have said I’m sure that peak Morceli would have beaten Bile that day, but I suspect he would. This performance is pretty good:
Men's 1500m final at the 1993 Stuttgart World Championships.RESULTS:1. Noureddine Morceli (ALG) 3:34.242. Fermín Cacho (ESP) 3:35.563. Abdi Bile (SOM) 3:35.9...
Closes a 3:34.24 race with a 50.62 last lap. Has anybody in history matched that?—I don’t think so. He beats Cacho by 1.32 and Bile by 1.72. Spivey was also in that race - it would be interesting to hear his take on this.
^Another World Championships, another dominant win for Morceli, this time putting 2 full seconds on 2nd place. This time he split 51.54 in a 3:32.84 race, and I don’t think he had yet reached his prime.
Arguably his most dominant World Championship win:
Closes in 51.28 in a 3:33.73 race, but that doesn’t do it justice: he jogs across the line after absolutely obliterating peak Niyongabo and a young El Guerrouj.
Plus you can watch both of his 1995 3:27s if you need further illustration of his dominance at that point.
So, a 3:27.37/3:44.39 runner who could reliably close 3:32-3:34 races in 50.5-51.5 and dominated 4 World Championship or Olympic 1500s, who went 38-0 in outdoor 1500/mile finals from September ‘92 until September ‘96 (he didn’t lose indoors or in heats either) would have given Bile a hard time in the 1987 World Championship. Maybe he couldn’t have beaten him if they’d hit 700m stride-for-stride, but I think the most likely scenario is that Morceli is nearer the front at that point and Bile never gets past him.
Run by the Somali world champion, Abdi Bile Abdi, this channel shares inspiring highlights from tracks and playgrounds all across Minnesota. Our videos provide tips and inspiration for runners of all backgrounds and different...
Which performance of Morceli justifies this thought?
Both Cram and Gonzalez have run a sub 50 last lap in the European Cup earlier in the season - and both were completely destroyed by Bile. Bile must have been in WR shape on this day with UNIQUE finishing qualities (see also Jim Spivey's comment).
Cram in the ‘87 world championship race is hardly worth using for a comparison: he finished 8th in 3:41, and obviously wasn’t in top form.
Cram has won in 3:31.43 two weeks before in Zürich. He still led at 1340m while running close to his limit. Then he was passed by Bile who run with incredible ease.
Cram in the ‘87 world championship race is hardly worth using for a comparison: he finished 8th in 3:41, and obviously wasn’t in top form.
Cram has won in 3:31.43 two weeks before in Zürich. He still led at 1340m while running close to his limit. Then he was passed by Bile who run with incredible ease.
Stephen Cram, (born 14 October 1960) is a British retired track and field athlete. Along with fellow Britons Sebastian Coe and Steve Ovett, he was one of the world's dominant middle distance runners during the 1980s. Nickname...
Open the “Athletics career” tab and scroll down to the paragraph that begins “In 1987”. Even the commentators of the World Championship final (one of whom is Frank Shorter) seem aware that it’s not Cram at his best.
The simple fact that Cram finished in 8th, a second behind Michael Hillardt, is proof that beating him in that race is not like beating 1985 Cram.
Cram has won in 3:31.43 two weeks before in Zürich. He still led at 1340m while running close to his limit. Then he was passed by Bile who run with incredible ease.
Open the “Athletics career” tab and scroll down to the paragraph that begins “In 1987”. Even the commentators of the World Championship final (one of whom is Frank Shorter) seem aware that it’s not Cram at his best.
The simple fact that Cram finished in 8th, a second behind Michael Hillardt, is proof that beating him in that race is not like beating 1985 Cram.
He was not as good as in 85 and in 86, but for sure he was also not just the 8th best runner in the 87 final.
He wanted to defend his world title, and when realizing the unbelievable strength of Bile he lost his dedication and concentration. He maybe was the 3rd best athlete on this day.
Bile was just untouchable and I can't see Morceli even at his best would have beaten him. But you can differ, no problem.
You gotta believe the majority running that fast are stretching the rules at minimum,. Steroids are easy, Pretty much just have to avoid being caught with the container. Microdose and stay below limits. Then brag how you can train like an animal and not get hurt.
I was on a livestream provided by Dutch TV. Laros got boxed in second lap and had an awful lot of work to do between 700m and 100m, more often than not having to leave lane 1. Despite of this he closed in 1.47.
He was not very happy in his interview on Dutch TV, neither with his tactical mistakes, nor with the result.
Laros was visibly disgusted. He walked toward the tunnel while the first two finishers were celebrating.
And he was rightfully annoyed at himself. This is the second time in a few races that he not only allowed himself to get boxed amidst a slow pace, but boxed well back in the pack. As I was watching it I was thinking this is like a replay of Hengelo.
Laros did a better job this time of sensing and extricating. But he's got to avoid that predicament in the first place. No margin for error against these fields.
The allathletics site is easily the best source for track and field videos. I'm surprised so many posters here had trouble finding the race. With any event they cover, there will be live views supplemented by separate videos of each event posted throughout the day. Check the "Replays" link for those videos. The only videos that sometimes take a while to show up are the full session replays.
Why am I not shocked that an American runner turned coach thinks only the finishing stretch matters? That's the same regulating crap I've watched all my life.
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