Males Win All Medals In New Non-Binary Category at 2022 USA Cyclocross National Championships

In my experience, those whispered conversations are happening about all aspects of critical social justice - people of all races whispering that they don't really buy all the junk about oppressed identities and privileged identities; LGB_Q people whispering about the depredations of the T segment of the rainbow; women whispering about how they think radical feminism is a bunch of bunk. Just generally, there is a lot of whispering pushing back on current-year ideologies that demand we treat people as an amalgam of their politically-endorsed identifiers rather than judging them as individuals. To quote "Without Limits," 'the breaking point will surely come soon.' The critical social justice types' preferred methods of fighting criticism -- shouting it down, shaming, canceling, refusing to argue on the merits, tarring people cheaply with one prejudicial -ism label or another and insisting the burden is on the target to prove it doesn't apply -- can only work for so long before they have ticked off enough people to start a counter-movement. The sooner people recognize how empty critical social justice philosophy is and how cheap and petty the techniques its promoters use to prop it up and smash opposing views, the sooner we'll be rid of all this. Godspeed that day.

But I have seen many opinion pieces that represent views like yours in New York Post, Washington Examiner, National Review, and Daily Mail among others.

There are also many web media that are eager to publish opinions like yours. In fact, those opinions have been copied and pasted on this board for years.

So why do you think you are silenced? Because NYT and Wapo do not publish your opinions?

"Do you favor or oppose allowing openly transgender men and women to serve in the military?

Men: 57% in favor, Women: 74% in favor.

Do you think transgender athletes -- [ROTATED: should be able to play on sports teams that match their current gender identity (or) should only be allowed to play on sports teams that match their birth gender]?

Play on teams that match gender identity: men 24%, women 42%.

Play on teams that match birth gender: men 72%, women 53%."

news.gallup.com

Mixed Views Among Americans on Transgender Issues

Justin McCarthy

While Americans support transgender military service, a majority believe birth gender, rather than gender identity, should govern participation in sports.

Open link

"In terms of policies governing public restrooms, do you think these policies should -- [ROTATED: require transgender individuals to use the restroom that corresponds with their birth gender (or should these policies) allow transgender individuals to use the restroom that corresponds with their gender identity]?

Men: Birth gender 61%, Gender Identity 35%.

Women: Birth gender 42%, Gender identity 53%."

news.gallup.com

In U.S., 71% Support Transgender People Serving in Military

Justin McCarthy

About seven in 10 Americans (71%) support allowing openly transgender men and women to serve in the military.

Open link

It was me you accused me of "trans bashing." Unfairly, I believe. At any rate, neither I nor GD are responsible for what other posters have said "on these threads."

No offense, but you come off thinking in very simplistic and rigid black-and-white terms. You seem to see yourself, your wife and your daughters as virtuous, morally good, superior people who hold the right views, and to write off everyone who holds different views as bigots and troglodytes. Moreover, you paint everyone who has different views to yours as one-dimensional boogey men/women who are all carbon copies of Marjorie Taylor Greene marching in lockstep.

BTW, few reasonable people are claiming that all "trans people" are "predators, hucketers, sociopaths, mentally ill, etc." But many well-informed people are pointing out that a lot of dodgy males today are claiming to "identify as" women and girls for a host of reasons, many of them nefarious.

One of those reasons is definitely because "identifying as" women is an easy way for male predators to get easy access to girls and women and a free pass to prey on and abuse them. When they get caught, these male predators are given special sympathy on social media by trans activists and their allies, the press hides their true identities and sex, they get kid glove treatment in court, they're given lighter sentences, they get special privileges and more lenient treatment in prison - and to cap it all off, they now get a chance to seek placement in or transfer to women's prisons where quite a few of them have already menaced, preyed on, raped, assaulted and impregnated female prisoners.

According to the UK's Ministry of Justice, in recent years between 42% and 58% of male convicts in prison in England and Wales who "identify" as women in any given year have been convicted of sex crimes against women and/or children. Compared to 16% of males in prison in E&W who don't claim to "identify as" women.

In the USA, the federal Bureau of Prisons reports that in any given year in the past several years, between 42% and 50% of males who "identify as" women in federal custody have convictions for federal sex crimes - compared to 11% of males in federal custody who do not claim an opposite-sex gender identity. (Federal sex crimes are the most serious ones involving aggravating factors like years of abuse against many victims as in the Epstein case, organized crime, torture, kidnapping, especially cruel murder, sex trafficking across state lines and national borders, and the making, possession and distribution of film and digital imagery showing children being sexually abused. )

How do you account for these statistics provided by the UK and US national governments? Seems to me they can only mean that either males in prison who "identify as" women are much more likely than other males to commit and be convicted of sex crimes, or males who commit and have convictions for sex crimes serving prison stretches are much more likely than other males in prison to claim to "identify as" women. Or a combination of both.

Instead of shooting and maligning the messengers here, maybe it's time to consider for a moment the possibility that there's an ugly underbelly and myriad harmful aspects you didn't notice before to the push for male incursion into female sports and spaces that you and your family are championing.

You're absolutely right. It is baffling to watch as a totalitarian, anti-intellectual movement calling itself progressive takes over our knowledge-producing institutions. Critical social justice does the very things it accuses society and dissenters of doing: promoting racism, sexism, ethnocentricism, etc. People who support basic liberal social principles are then tarred as all manner of bigot, as you mentioned, by a bunch of secular religious zealots.

I'm confident that people know something is afoot. It's much more difficult to explain why and how it is happening because so much of the language and argumentation used by the illiberal social justice crowd is manipulative and meant to shame people into submission. People think you're a conspiracy theorist if you tell them that entire departments at universities treat a handful of academic books as religious texts and launder tomes of research through the lens of these ideologies--that worse yet, these ideas have corrupted professional organizations such as medicine, law, and the psychology-related disciplines, making it difficult to disentangle actual knowledge from postmodern scripture. Social media spread these noxious ideas like wildfire, and now here we all are.

Ask anybody who works in one of these knowledge-producing institutions who has not imbibed the Flavor Aid. This stuff is happening, and it's scary.

Are we talkin’ about cyclocross?

Not running, but cyclocross?

Instead of providing evidence of your claim like I asked, you've merely posted a link to a press release from the trans activist propaganda factory the Williams Institute at UCLA about a supposed "study" the Williams Institute claims its researchers have done, yet which oddly has never been published and whose findings have never been released.

AFAIK, the press release is the only information about this study that the Williams Institute has made public so far. Funny that.

The press release says: Transgender people are over four times more likely than cisgender people to experience violent victimization, including rape, sexual assault, and aggravated or simple assault, according to a new study by the Williams Institute at UCLA School of Law. In addition, households with a transgender person had higher rates of property victimization than cisgender households.

Researchers analyzed pooled data from the 2017 and 2018 National Crime Victimization Survey, the first comprehensive and nationally representative criminal victimization data to include information on the gender identity and sex assigned at birth of respondents.

What the press release fails to mention is that the National Crime Victimization Survey is an annual US DOJ project involving 49-150,000 USA households in which all the residents age 12 and up are asked a series of stock questions meant to determine and tally their self-reported experiences of "victimization" in the past year. Each reported incident of victimization is counted separately.

This methodology has long been criticized because there is no way to verify any of the information about experiences of alleged victimization gathered because the survey is totally reliant on the respondents' self-reports.

Moreover, since everyone in the household age 12 and up is interviewed but not in confidence from the other members of their households, and everyone's self-reports of victimization are all given equal weight, this methodology most likely yields seriously skewed results. Women and children being abused by other household members are likely not to report their experiences honestly for fear of retaliation by their live-in abusers. Plus, 12 year-olds and teenagers are likely to have a different view of what counts as victimization than more seasoned adults.

On the other hand, many abusive, manipulative people have Cluster B personality traits such as narcissism and see themselves as perpetual victims; as a result, they are likely exaggerate and even invent experiences of their own victimization. At the same time, many people who identify as trans see themselves as perennial victims too and they believe most everyone else in the world, including their family members, hate them, deny their existence, are out to get them and want them to be ostracized, discriminated against, deprived of all rights and even want them dead. On top of that, people whose entire sense of self is based on denying and lying about their sex tend to lie about a lot of other stuff too.

Results showed that both transgender women and men had higher rates of violent victimization than their cisgender counterparts, but there were no differences between transgender men and women.

But a few lines later, the press release says:

Transgender women and men had higher rates of violent victimization (86.1 and 107.5 per 1,000 people, respectively) than cisgender women and men (23.7 and 19.8 per 1,000 people, respectively).

So in actuality, females who identify as trans reported a considerably higher rate of "violent victimization" than males who identify as trans. Sounds like a clear sex difference to me.

This doesn't support the contention that you made earlier, and you've made on other threads, that trans-identified males like Molly Cameron, Lia Thomas, Emily Bridges, Caitlyn Jenner and the two males who placed in the top 5 in the Women's Elite Cyclocross - including the one who can be seen on videotape violently bashing his bike into a female rider - suffer far higher rates of violence than everyone else, including all females, and as a result these strapping males must be regarded as "the most vulnerable in society."

Back to the press release:

One in four transgender women who were victimized thought the incident was a hate crime compared to less than one in ten cisgender women.

Maybe this is because there is no jurisdiction on earth where hate crime laws count misogyny or being of the female sex as grounds for hate crime charges. According to all the laws on the books, a hate crime can only be committed based on animus towards a person or group based on factors like race, ethnicity, sexual orientation and gender identity.

If a serial killer abducts, beats, rapes, tortures and kills women because he has a deep-seated hatred of women like many serial killers and serial rapists do, he still can't be accused of hate crimes against his female victims. But if someone beats, rapes or kills a trans-identified person out of animus towards transgender people, he can be charged with hate crime. Because in today's world, males who claim to be women are protected in law against hate crimes due to their claimed gender identities, but female people who actually are women are not protected against hate crimes committed against us due to our sex.

In 2017-2018, transgender households had higher rates of property victimization (214.1 per 1,000 households) than cisgender households (108 per 1,000 households).

Property victimization can include robbery, burglary, car theft, bike theft, vandalism, and damage to household grounds or property as well as residents' personal property on the premises or elsewhere. So if someone nicks a respondent's lunch at school or work, keys their car at the mall or train station, scribbles or draws rude pictures on their notebook at school - all that sort thing presumably could count as victimization at least in the survey respondents' eyes. Similarly, when household members lift money out of each other's wallets or "borrow" clothes from one another without permission, those could count as property victimization too..

So anyways, I don't think the link your provided amounts to convincing evidence that backs up your claim that "trans women are the victims of violence at a rate that is 4 x the rate" of violence experienced by the female people you denigrate as "cis."

When you write, “BTW, few reasonable people are claiming that all "trans people" are "predators, hucketers, sociopaths, mentally ill, etc." But many well-informed people are pointing out that a lot of dodgy males today are claiming to "identify as" women and girls for a host of reasons, many of them nefarious.”

It reads to me just like….

“When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. […] They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people”

I realize you don’t see the connection and I’m sure I can’t convince you otherwise.

But yes, I do think your position on the inclusion/exclusion of trans people is lacking in virtue.

Some more data.

cdc.gov

Transgender Identity and Experiences of Violence Victimization ...

CDCMMWR

Population-based survey data from 10 state and nine urban school districts found that an average of 1.8% of high school students identify as transgender. Transgender students were more likely ...

Open link

I’ll obtain the Williams Institute study and forward it if you’d care to read it. I agree, it should be peer reviewed and published.

I think at this point we are both pretty fixed in our positions and not going to be convinced otherwise, and so I’ll give it a rest.

FYI Molly is now competing in the women's division in races that don't restrict her from doing so. This is what she posted about competing in SBT GRVL last year and this year. SBT GRVL also had a non-binary division this year.

Last Year

This Year

Wise Old Man is saying that it's generous of you to say some trans people are predators, but not all. Your post was in reply to a statement that some men are predators, but not all.

Once again, marginalized groups can do no wrong. To point out that some of them may not be wholly innocent is, as often said, "literally violence".

You could end this entire debate by providing sources for these statistics.

This one is straight up trolling us all.

"
themollycameron
SBT
was such an uplifting experience and the racing was 🔥 across
categories. This is only the second time in many, many years that I've
been able to stand on a women's podium and I'm deeply humbled to have
shared it with one of the world's top riders @tiffanycromwell and one of the most talented up and coming riders in @marjie_bemis.
Tiffany
was riding incredibly on the day and looked on form to win the whole
overall and beat all the dudes. She dropped me like a rock (i finished
over 20mins down!!) en route to 7th overall. Marjie finished just 27
seconds down to me and 10 minutes ahead of 4th place doing a legendary
ride. I was struggling with the altitude a lot and I just could not hang
in the lead group with Tiffany any more around mile 65. Did what I
could with the cards I was dealt.
I know that seeing a
transgender woman (particularly a woman that does NOT pass) on a podium
at a high profile event will elicit mixed feelings, raise questions +
negative reactions so I'll say: I'm always available to have a
conversation.
However inclusion means getting used to seeing
people in races/events that challenge cisgendered, body size,
body-ability and racial typical norms y'all are used to seeing. It might
be uncomfortable for ya!
Transgender and non-binary athletes are playing by the rules, just like everyone else.
WE EXIST, GET FAMILIAR.
Now
queue-up the: "transgender women are dominating women's sports" "stolen
opportunities" "you are a man" and "fairness in sport" comments."

I don't see any statistics quoted but if you interact with any women at all you'd know that everything written there is true. It doesn't take a study to validate it.

I think you vastly overestimate people's willingness to accept evidence and to judge situations or claims accordingly.

Good luck getting that "study" out of the Williams Institute. When I and a number of other people emailed requests to see it, our inquiries fell on deaf ears.

But if you do manage to wrangle that "study" out of the Williams Institute, please post the text on LRC. You've made the claim on LRC that healthy, physically fit males who say they "identify as" women suffer rates of violence far, far exceeding any and all other demographic groups so many times that I am sure others would be interested in seeing any actual evidence you can muster.

You've also claimed on LRC on multiple occasions that despite their male size, stature, strength, speed, muscularity, explosiveness, bone thickness & sturdiness, lungs & hearts, tendons, genetics, imperviousness to pregnancy & all the vulnerabilities that come with pregnancy, etc, able-bodied, physically fit adolescent and adult males who say they "identify as" women/girls - including all the big strapping ones with demonstrated athletic ability like Lia Thomas and Caitlyn Jenner and all the ones who look like a million other bog-standard men like Molly Cameron - are somehow by far "the most vulnerable (group) in society." I am sure other LRC posters and readers would be interested in seeing any actual evidence backing up that preposterous claim too.

Oh, c'mon.

Your new link to what you say is "more data" is to another survey in which teenage respondents who self-identified as transgender at the time of the survey self-reported how much violence, victimization, bullying and suicide risk they felt they had experienced in the past year.

Specifically, the "data" you site come from the way students who self-identified as transgender answered a 2017 anonymous survey of teenagers in grades 9-12 who at that time were attending schools in "10 states and nine urban school districts in the US." The states were: Colorado, Delaware, Hawaii, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Michigan, Rhode Island, Vermont, Wisconsin. The urban school districts were Boston, Broward County, Cleveland, Detroit, District of Columbia, Los Angeles, New York City, San Diego, San Francisco. Hardly seems like a representative sampling of US schools to me.

This survey, in which students responded to a questionnaire in booklet form, found:

Transgender students [or more accurately, students in grades 9-12 who reported on the anonymous survey that they "identified as" transgender in 2017] were more likely than were cisgender students to report violence victimization, substance use, and suicide risk, and, although generally more likely to report sexual risk behaviors, were also more likely to report having been tested for human immunodeficiency virus.

Other findings of what these students reported:

A higher percentage of transgender students also reported lifetime use of all substances except marijuana than did cisgender male and cisgender female students; marijuana use was more prevalent among transgender students than among cisgender male students only. A higher proportion of transgender students reported all suicide risk outcomes than did cisgender students.

Transgender students were more likely than cisgender students to report first sexual intercourse before age 13 years, sexual intercourse with four or more persons than were cisgender students, and [to report using] no method to prevent pregnancy at last sexual intercourse.

Transgender students were more likely than were cisgender females to have ever had sex (43.1% versus 33.2%) and to have drunk alcohol or used drugs before their last sexual intercourse (30.0% versus 17.9%).

Transgender students were more likely than were cisgender males to report no condom use during their last sexual intercourse (63.8% versus 37.6%). Transgender students were less likely than cisgender males and cisgender females to have not ever been tested for HIV (70.0% versus 87.4% and 86.9%, respectively).

As with the earlier "study" from the Williams Institute that relied solely on information self-reported by respondents to surveys, there is no way to verify any of the claims made by any of these teenage HS students about the victimization, bullying, sexual violence, drug use, HIV testing and such they say they experienced

Similarly, there is no way to verify the veracity of what these teenagers claimed about the amount of suicide ideation, attempts and risk they reported. However, since youngsters who "identify as" transgender are unfortunately constantly told they will end up committing suicide if they don't do everything they can to "transition" and pronto - and many "gender therapists," trans activists and organizations that promote child and teen "transition" actively encourage, coach and instruct sex/gender confused youngsters to threaten to kill themselves in order to get the "affirmation," "validation," pronoun use, hormonal interventions and surgeries they desire and demand - I'd take these self-reports with a grain of salt.

A much more reliable indicator of actual suicide risk in youth comes from ER and medical records documenting how many kids have required medical treatment for suicide attempts and received or sought psychiatric help for suicidal ideation and urges. Using these sources of information, teens who "identify as" transgender don't seem to be at increased risk of attempting suicide - though worryingly, in the past several years there has been a huge spike in the number of teenage girls who have been seen in American ERs for attempting to take their own lives.

Another much more reliable way to assess which groups actually commit and thus are at greatest risk for suicide in the US is to look at findings of medical examiners/coroners and other government authorities who by law must investigate every death that might be a suicide, homicide or accident and make a determination of the cause and manner of death, then state it on death certificates and report the information to state health authorities, who in turn pass on the information on to national bodies like the National Violent Death Reporting System and the CDC.

most of them are just gay.

In your last post you called me and everyone else who has a different view to yours carbon copies of Marjorie Taylor Greene. Now you're likening me Donald Trump. Sheesh.

You're so convinced of your own virtue and righteousness that it completely escapes you that some readers think you're the one who comes off as a bigot here. Your go-to response to anyone who disagrees with you is always to reduce us to one-dimensional stereotypes, call us insulting names, and demean us by saying we're just like this or that right-wing ideologue you find particularly reprehensible.

Also, for the umpeenth time: no one is objecting to including "trans people" in society, to recognizing their humanity, and to treating them with the same decency afforded everyone else.

I and others are objecting to the new ethos and new polices that allow any and all males to use gender identity claims - spurious claims as well as sincere ones - to intrude into the hard-won sports, spaces and services that were established to provide the female half of the population with fairness, safety, dignity, privacy, comfort, peace of mind and an equal chance to participate as fully in society as males - including in the many realms from which males saw fit to historically exclude us, such as voting, many areas of education, government office holding, numerous jobs and professions, property ownership, various banking and financial services, road running, Little League and most school sports.

I and others are also objecting to the way gender identity ideology is being used to justify the creation of new mixed-sex categories and sporting events that favor males and give males extra chances to shine and win whilst putting females at a competitive disadvantage - and in the case of many sports like hockey and rugby, putting females at greater risk of serious injury and even death.

Huh? The vast majority of males who "identify as" women are sexually attracted to females. Only a minority of males who adopt a transgender identity - about 20%, perhaps less today - are homosexual.

Many of the world's most prominent "transwomen" - Jan Morris, Rene Richards, Caitlyn Jenner, Rachel Levine, Jennifer Pritzker, Marci Bowers, Martine Rothblatt, Amy Schneider, Jennifer Finney-Boylan, Zoey Tur, Debbie Hayton, Jane Fae, Andrea Long Chu, Grace Lavery, Lia Thomas, June Eastwood, Linsey Hecox - are heterosexual males. Many/most of these males now want to be regarded as lesbians and quite a few malign bona fide lesbians (the female kind) as exclusionary, transphobic bigots and "genital fetishists" for not wanting to date or sleep with them. Many of the older ones previously were or currently are married or partnered with (female) women and are fathers.

A higher percentage of females who "identify as" men/boys appear to be sexually attracted to members of their own sex (females). However, amongst the younger generations of adolescent and young adult females who are declaring themselves to be boys/men at rates that are exponentially huge compared to only a decade ago, an increasing number are heterosexual and call themselves gay men. Echoing what male trans-identified so-called lesbians or "transbians" have been saying about real lesbians for decades, many heterosexual trans-identified females today say gay men are exclusionary, transphobic bigots and "genital fetishists" for not wanting to have sex with them.