malmo wrote:
Hunter seems to be right where you'd want to be in February.
Lol
malmo wrote:
Hunter seems to be right where you'd want to be in February.
Lol
te5n1k wrote:
Its hilarious to see people say "they are in this shape, but its only Jan, Feb, etc" there have been an abundance of world and national records falling recently because 2020 was not a normal year and 2021 won't be normal either. Opportunities to race are few and far between and most top athletes seem to be taking advantage of this so to make excuses for someones fitness based on the month is a problematic imo.
He ran an indoor PB. So he has never been in such good shape during the winter months...
Expect him to break his outdoor PBs
dxttfdtdr wrote:
te5n1k wrote:
Its hilarious to see people say "they are in this shape, but its only Jan, Feb, etc" there have been an abundance of world and national records falling recently because 2020 was not a normal year and 2021 won't be normal either. Opportunities to race are few and far between and most top athletes seem to be taking advantage of this so to make excuses for someones fitness based on the month is a problematic imo.
He ran an indoor PB. So he has never been in such good shape during the winter months...
Expect him to break his outdoor PBs
And also expect him to be outside of the US top 20 list for 1500 and 5,000
malmo wrote:
` wrote:
Who here is rejoicing? I've seen several comments with legitimate criticism of his training environment. Hopefully this race was a wake up call for him.
I've been around elite runners a lot more than you have and I don't see a problem nor do I think your "criticism" is legitimate. All it proves is anonymous trolls are able to spew their vapid opinions on the internet. Hunter seems to be right where you'd want to be in February.
This is called an appeal to authority, and it's even more pathetic when you're using YOURSELF as the authority. Even with all your experience, I find it crazy that you don't see Hunter's recent performances as concerning.
I've given numerous examples of how his training is not high level enough, and his training partners are holding him back. Do you really think that 5xmile workout that I posted was sufficient for someone of Hunter's caliber?
Face it malmo, Hunter was the great wunderkind of American distance running, but he has stagnated. There at least 5 other runners around his age that I would expect to be ahead of him at the Olympic Trials.
You've made your criticism - [b]repetitively[/b]. You don't need to keep chasing your tail on this, Hunter isn't going to wander over to this site, read this thread, and slap his head saying "by gosh, that Apostrophe fellow is right and it's clear that it's time I made a change!" I don't disagree with you but this is getting tedious and digressive.
Ghost of Jason Rexing's Trainers wrote:
You've made your criticism - repetitively[/b]. You don't need to keep chasing your tail on this, Hunter isn't going to wander over to this site, read this thread, and slap his head saying "by gosh, that Apostrophe fellow is right and it's clear that it's time I made a change!" I don't disagree with you but this is getting tedious and digressive.
So you're telling me to stop discussing running on a running forum??? No, I don't think I will stop. We're just having a discussion. If you think my points are untrue, tell me why. If you make good points and defeat my argument, then maybe I won't have to keep repeating my criticisms.
Nope, wasn't saying that at all. You're tired and played out but of course it's really not my problem if you want to chase your own tail. Have a nice day, hoss.
You have a weird twisted obsession with Hunter. You try to insult him while acting like he should be the top American. Every top high school runner is not the top 23 year old. He is very good but not world class. You have to get over him and face the fact that he is not destined to run 12:50 regardless of who coaches him. He probably made the best deal of all time based on where his times are today. Just admire him and his parents for overselling him to his sponsor. He is the ultimate deal maker.
I agree he looked awful. It wasn't just the time, it's that he looked uncomfortable from lap 1 while everyone else looked smooth. There's a minor hitch in his stride too that makes things look worse. I feel bad for him, because he seems like a nice guy that enjoys the team atmosphere he has with Tinman. And as others have pointed out, he should probably consider a change at some point.
He is happy with his contract. He is happy with his life. He is happy with his buddies. Only you are unhappy. I think it bothers you that a guy of his ability is able to be paid so much money to live like a free spirit. He doesn't want to change locations or change coaches. He does what he wants, when he wants. That is why he has so many fans. Everyone wants to be him. Just admire the guy. Like I said, nobody will ever be able to make a deal like he made based on being good high school distance runner.
Coach watching wrote:
He is happy with his contract. He is happy with his life. He is happy with his buddies. Only you are unhappy. I think it bothers you that a guy of his ability is able to be paid so much money to live like a free spirit. He doesn't want to change locations or change coaches. He does what he wants, when he wants. That is why he has so many fans. Everyone wants to be him. Just admire the guy. Like I said, nobody will ever be able to make a deal like he made based on being good high school distance runner.
Oh, so you know him personally, do you? He's told you all of this? He likes running 3:40 and getting dropped by B level american pros?
The amount of yes-men on this board, I tell ya. God forbid someone points out your hero is not running well. If I wanted to read about amazing deal-making, I'd go to a business forum. Unfortunately this is a running forum, where that doesn't matter.
` wrote:
Ghost of Jason Rexing's Trainers wrote:
Nope, wasn't saying that at all. You're tired and played out but of course it's really not my problem if you want to chase your own tail. Have a nice day, hoss.
No, it isn't really your problem. I hope Hunter never sees this, my god. Hopefully he has the sense to come to these conclusions on his own.
It's amazing to me how many Letsrun posters seem to think it's an insult for someone to post on Letsrun. LOL
Almost as amazing as the lack of self-awareness routinely on display here, but now I'm digressing and insulting my own dignity.
Insult his running all you want. He is at his peak whether you believe it or not. I am not sure what you see in his form that makes you think he has so much upside. But in terms of him being happy, you are free to watch videos of him and you are free to follow him on social media to hear it from him, not from me. If he was unhappy with his current arrangement, he would change it. He has more money than you will eve have. The guy is the ultimate man's man.
Coach watching wrote:
Insult his running all you want. He is at his peak whether you believe it or not. I am not sure what you see in his form that makes you think he has so much upside. But in terms of him being happy, you are free to watch videos of him and you are free to follow him on social media to hear it from him, not from me. If he was unhappy with his current arrangement, he would change it. He has more money than you will eve have. The guy is the ultimate man's man.
This is his peak? And I'm the one insulting him???
"He has more money than you will eve have"
How much do you think he's making?
I would say that he is earning $200k per year with contract, social media, rent, and clothing sales. His parents seem to be doing very well also so he will never have any problems. And yes, this is his peak. IT is complimentary to someone to state that they achieved their potential. It is insulting to state that someone never realized their potential. I am complimenting him while you continue to try to tear him down. Sorry buddy, you will never be him. He is living the ultimate runner's dream life while you may have a crappy job.
I bet everyone defending Drew's 3:40 in this thread has spent at least $500 on Tinman gear in the past 12 months.
I hate to break it to you, but you wasted your money.
Coach watching wrote:
I would say that he is earning $200k per year with contract, social media, rent, and clothing sales. His parents seem to be doing very well also so he will never have any problems. And yes, this is his peak. IT is complimentary to someone to state that they achieved their potential. It is insulting to state that someone never realized their potential. I am complimenting him while you continue to try to tear him down. Sorry buddy, you will never be him. He is living the ultimate runner's dream life while you may have a crappy job.
I don't think Hunter has reached his peak. I think he will run faster. You are insulting him. It is not complimentarily to say that someone peaked at 23. If you told Hunter that he's peaked, he would be very offended, I guarantee it.
LateRunnerPhil wrote:
I don't understand why people are so surprised here. At the end of his HS career, Hunter had to make a choice - either accept a lot of money, chasing his dream or go to college, knowing that he probably will never win any NCAA title, live a poor life and be offered maybe 1/10 of what he got in his post-HS deal. For me, that's an easy choice - take the money and live the dream life.
One reason he was so good in HS was that he received very good training compared to the rest of the high schoolers. Most HS coaches are not very good coaches, think we can all agree on that. The good training he received from Tinman (and his parents, but which were also influenced by Tinman) allowed him to be better in HS than similarly talented runners. He probably never had the talent to become an Olympic champion, it's the training that made him so good.
Often people compared him to Grant Fisher here, who is roughly similar age and Hunter beat quite a few times during HS. What people fail to understand is that Fisher ran a MAXIMUM of 50 mpw in HS, and his coach assigned him no speed work until the track season of his senior year in HS. They stated this in multiple interviews. Meanwhile, Hunter did tons of CV and threshold training, which are highly effective, on 70-75 mpw as a senior. In HS, they ran similar times with the respective types of training. It should be a no-brainer to guess who will be better down the road, regardless of what career (early pro, college, etc.) being chosen.
No, Hunter would not be a 3:30 runner now had he chosen NCAA. And Fisher wouldn't have stagnated would he have gone pro after HS. Each runners development is individual, Hunter was likely overvalued by sponsors after HS because they didn't understand that his training was just better than other similarly talented HS kids, and he was never the ultra super talent that has an actual shot at winning Olympic medals.
Also, Hunter seems to be extremely prone to injury. He was never injured in HS, because the training load was not at an elite level yet. He is certainly very talented, but injury-resistance is just as big of importance. Think about Solinsky, maybe he didn't have the fastest 1500/Mile times in HS, but he could pound 100+ mile weeks at sub 6 pace year after year. Hunters training load increased after HS, and it seems his breaking point is very low compared to other elite runners.
This ^
And also, Hunter can't change gears quickly enough. Other than the other shortcomings that are not evident beyond the high school level, this will be the final big one.
Has anyone actually asked Drew Hunter what he wants to accomplish?
If he wants to spend his 20s and maybe also his 30s living the life of a pro athlete, without much pressure, living and training with friends, with a coach he obviously likes and respects, then his choices and his current situation are a total success.
If he dreams or dreamed of American records, Olympic teams, winning important races against the best in the world, then it's not with easy 5xmile workouts that he is going to get there and yes, he should look for a more competent coach.
But maybe he is happy and just wants to run and enjoy his time as a pro athlete.
sssssss00 wrote:
Has anyone actually asked Drew Hunter what he wants to accomplish?
If he wants to spend his 20s and maybe also his 30s living the life of a pro athlete, without much pressure, living and training with friends, with a coach he obviously likes and respects, then his choices and his current situation are a total success.
If he dreams or dreamed of American records, Olympic teams, winning important races against the best in the world, then it's not with easy 5xmile workouts that he is going to get there and yes, he should look for a more competent coach.
But maybe he is happy and just wants to run and enjoy his time as a pro athlete.
//////
Tom Schwartz/Tinman is a fine coach ... maybe if there is any blame, it needs to be shouldered by Drew Hunter.
I wish that entire group all the best this year and beyond. Drew is, as Malmo stated, just fine for February; he is 23+ and halfway through his 9 yr contract with adidas for what it’s worth. It’s not really what everyone wants to hear but I’d worry more about where he is @ 27.
You’re welcome to criticize all you want; it just sounds like many of your opinions are tinged with bitterness and jealously. I’m sure the group Tinman/Drew and the entire group are well aware of the need to make improvements and preform at the right time and place.