So Trump's defense will likely be the same as it was for Ukraine:
"I am broadly in charge of law enforcement in the USA. I believe there was election fraud in Georgia. I asked the GA sec state to look into it. How is that possibly a crime?"
And it will probably work as a defense, because we have given potus near limitless powers.
The problem is that this system fails when we elect a malodorous pervert.
This is how you know that Trump is insane:
"We won very substantially in Georgia. You even see it by rally size, frankly. We'd be getting 25-30,000 people a rally and the competition would get less than 100 people. And it never made sense."
https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/03/politics/trump-brad-raffensperger-phone-call-transcript/index.html
agip wrote:
johnny99 wrote:
Do you think Raffensperger's tax returns are getting audited as we speak?
seriously, witness protection program is more likely.
As much as we think Trump is a traitor and felon...the magas think the same of him.
They are already on twitter, talking about what a rat Raffensperger is.
I actually worry about him. Being ethical in this administration is both an amazingly brave and risky thing to do. After that call, the death threats will escalate and attacks on his residence are very likely. (Ask Nancy & Mitch about that)
We owe Raffensperger a great deal for standing firm to protect our democracy. It was both a cost and a burden for him (and his family) to do so.
johnny99 wrote:
This is how you know that Trump is insane:
"We won very substantially in Georgia. You even see it by rally size, frankly. We'd be getting 25-30,000 people a rally and the competition would get less than 100 people. And it never made sense."
https://www.cnn.com/2021/01/03/politics/trump-brad-raffensperger-phone-call-transcript/index.html
After listening to the whole thing I conclude trump is much more buffoon than insane or delusional. He is not even tricking himself because in his world facts are not relevant. The only thing this guy can gauge, and often badly, are positions of power. He thinks POTUS means absolute power and thus has treated the job that way.
In this call he thought he would simply strong-arm the SOS and force his wish to happen. You can tell he thinks one way or another the results will be overturned. To worsen the situation, he only has enablers around him giving him extra confidence in his stupidity. It’s like he’s talking past the SOS and doesn’t mind that he’s spewing endless BS to the SOS who understands the circumstances and process inside out.
He’s gotten by his whole life pushing people around without consequences so this is just another case of him not understanding that others also have power that can affect an outcome. Trump is a fkn incoherent idiot. “Frankly” it was painful and “sad” to listen to him for one hour.
Dan Kahneman wrote:
agip wrote:
seriously, witness protection program is more likely.
As much as we think Trump is a traitor and felon...the magas think the same of him.
They are already on twitter, talking about what a rat Raffensperger is.
I actually worry about him. Being ethical in this administration is both an amazingly brave and risky thing to do. After that call, the death threats will escalate and attacks on his residence are very likely. (Ask Nancy & Mitch about that)
We owe Raffensperger a great deal for standing firm to protect our democracy. It was both a cost and a burden for him (and his family) to do so.
Agreed and it’s further proof that our system is so frail that only Rs could actually have prevented trump from being installed as a dictator. Had those Trump appointed judges and select high ranking Rs in these swing states simply decided to put their loyalty to him (aka to corruption) over country trump would have been given a viable path. We need sweeping changes.
Throughout the entire call, whenever the SOS and his team would ask trump an easy question about the supposed facts he has or point to contradictions in his statements he would immediately talk over them and repeat that there is no way to come to any conclusion other than there was fraud.
This is who trump is and the Rs sat there every day for 4 years enabling him instead of doing their democratic duty.
Trollminator wrote:
Throughout the entire call, whenever the SOS and his team would ask trump an easy question about the supposed facts he has or point to contradictions in his statements he would immediately talk over them and repeat that there is no way to come to any conclusion other than there was fraud.
This is who trump is and the Rs sat there every day for 4 years enabling him instead of doing their democratic duty.
The other pattern on the call was the SOS and team kept pleading with trump to share the evidence or whatever support they have so they can take a look and trump kept getting angry and saying they should share it but they don’t need to because the facts are so “strong” so they should just find the votes. Fkn nuts
Trollminator wrote:
Throughout the entire call, whenever the SOS and his team would ask trump an easy question about the supposed facts he has or point to contradictions in his statements he would immediately talk over them and repeat that there is no way to come to any conclusion other than there was fraud.
This is who trump is and the Rs sat there every day for 4 years enabling him instead of doing their democratic duty.
Roger that, but they were drinking long and hard at the same well.
In simple terms, Trump lies to his base of disenfranchised in order to build a sizable Republican coalition suitable to win against the Dems who have been relegated to 'the elite meritocracy" his electorate hate so much. They don't love R's, they love Trump. So the R's placate Trump to maintain power, to which they were addicted. Now they can't afford to cut their ties with him, and as the lights come on, its revealed who they have been in bed with this whole time. And god, it ain't pretty. But how on earth can you shut that light back off at this late stage?
FYI both DC and GA are one party consent states. Perfectly legal for anyone on that cal to record.
https://twitter.com/sfpelosi/status/1345934737660002305?s=21
seattle prattle wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
Throughout the entire call, whenever the SOS and his team would ask trump an easy question about the supposed facts he has or point to contradictions in his statements he would immediately talk over them and repeat that there is no way to come to any conclusion other than there was fraud.
This is who trump is and the Rs sat there every day for 4 years enabling him instead of doing their democratic duty.
Roger that, but they were drinking long and hard at the same well.
In simple terms, Trump lies to his base of disenfranchised in order to build a sizable Republican coalition suitable to win against the Dems who have been relegated to 'the elite meritocracy" his electorate hate so much. They don't love R's, they love Trump. So the R's placate Trump to maintain power, to which they were addicted. Now they can't afford to cut their ties with him, and as the lights come on, its revealed who they have been in bed with this whole time. And god, it ain't pretty. But how on earth can you shut that light back off at this late stage?
Yeah you can’t shut it back. This is game over for the GOP teaming up with trump. There has to be a split.
You figure that that's what Cruz and the others are up to - creating the appearance that they back Trump to appease his base and not lose them? Or at last hold onto as many as possible?
seattle prattle wrote:
You figure that that's what Cruz and the others are up to - creating the appearance that they back Trump to appease his base and not lose them? Or at last hold onto as many as possible?
Backing trump was a smooth and lucrative operation for the GOP while all Senators stayed in their lane. Cruz and the others, by publicly stating they will object the certification, broke ranks and Mitch effectively lost his ability to control the Senate majority. The House never mattered as much because they have minority.
Yes, it's all about power and positioning. Cruz and these other clowns decided on their own that trump is still the future of the party. They are going to run for POTUS and want to use trump's formula. Of course it's a losing strategy because none of them can establish themselves as alphas in the eyes of the base.
This is going to cause permanent damage to this sitting GOP Senate going into the next midterms and presidential elections, and if they lose the two GA seats we will see the party implode this year.
Trollminator wrote:
After listening to the whole thing I conclude trump is much more buffoon than insane or delusional. He is not even tricking himself because in his world facts are not relevant. The only thing this guy can gauge, and often badly, are positions of power. He thinks POTUS means absolute power and thus has treated the job that way.
Foxnews completely buried this story, no surprise there.
But what is the right's spin on this? How are they going to defend this? "I need you to find 11,780 votes"..... How is this not election fraud?
Trollminator wrote:
seattle prattle wrote:
You figure that that's what Cruz and the others are up to - creating the appearance that they back Trump to appease his base and not lose them? Or at last hold onto as many as possible?
Backing trump was a smooth and lucrative operation for the GOP while all Senators stayed in their lane. Cruz and the others, by publicly stating they will object the certification, broke ranks and Mitch effectively lost his ability to control the Senate majority. The House never mattered as much because they have minority.
Yes, it's all about power and positioning. Cruz and these other clowns decided on their own that trump is still the future of the party. They are going to run for POTUS and want to use trump's formula. Of course it's a losing strategy because none of them can establish themselves as alphas in the eyes of the base.
This is going to cause permanent damage to this sitting GOP Senate going into the next midterms and presidential elections, and if they lose the two GA seats we will see the party implode this year.
Yes, if the two Georgia seats are lost, that will send shockwaves through the republican party. The backing Trump and abdicating any ethical responsibility by elected republicans did give them power (hopefully short term). I believe Trump and the elected officials who lied, and who put personal interest well above country and duty were slime.
However, I mostly fault all the willfully ignorant Trump cult followers (we have seen a number of examples of them on this message board) who gave Trump his power. Those who to this day believe without any evidence that Trump had this race stolen, who believe Trump over real news reports, who bought the whole ridiculous nonsense that Trump has been selling for so long. Those who refuse to hold Trump accountable.
They opened the door to Trump's abuse and weakened our country. Our country is only as strong as our people.
welp wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
After listening to the whole thing I conclude trump is much more buffoon than insane or delusional. He is not even tricking himself because in his world facts are not relevant. The only thing this guy can gauge, and often badly, are positions of power. He thinks POTUS means absolute power and thus has treated the job that way.
Foxnews completely buried this story, no surprise there.
But what is the right's spin on this? How are they going to defend this? "I need you to find 11,780 votes"..... How is this not election fraud?
So far they are attacking the "leak" as criminal instead of addressing the crime within the call. Ring a bell?
Dan Kahneman wrote:
Trollminator wrote:
Backing trump was a smooth and lucrative operation for the GOP while all Senators stayed in their lane. Cruz and the others, by publicly stating they will object the certification, broke ranks and Mitch effectively lost his ability to control the Senate majority. The House never mattered as much because they have minority.
Yes, it's all about power and positioning. Cruz and these other clowns decided on their own that trump is still the future of the party. They are going to run for POTUS and want to use trump's formula. Of course it's a losing strategy because none of them can establish themselves as alphas in the eyes of the base.
This is going to cause permanent damage to this sitting GOP Senate going into the next midterms and presidential elections, and if they lose the two GA seats we will see the party implode this year.
Yes, if the two Georgia seats are lost, that will send shockwaves through the republican party. The backing Trump and abdicating any ethical responsibility by elected republicans did give them power (hopefully short term). I believe Trump and the elected officials who lied, and who put personal interest well above country and duty were slime.
However, I mostly fault all the willfully ignorant Trump cult followers (we have seen a number of examples of them on this message board) who gave Trump his power. Those who to this day believe without any evidence that Trump had this race stolen, who believe Trump over real news reports, who bought the whole ridiculous nonsense that Trump has been selling for so long. Those who refuse to hold Trump accountable.
They opened the door to Trump's abuse and weakened our country. Our country is only as strong as our people.
Definitely but I also think our system is weak for not effectively preventing people like trump from ever making it and the parties from enabling their guy even throughout criminality. People all over the world are susceptible to propaganda and disinformation and at the end of the day they do trust the word of the leaders, which unfortunately in this case has been trump. Without his chronic lying and the GOP enabling him not nearly as many voters would believe there was election fraud.
I’m past the point of loving this show. It was fun for awhile but so much damage to the country is being done.
Thank god it’s almost done.
Trumpers, so what is his defense here? Is he delusional or is he criminal?
I option wrote:
I’m past the point of loving this show. It was fun for awhile but so much damage to the country is being done.
Thank god it’s almost done.
It got really real when it was clear he wasn't interested in preventing americans from dying.