Modifying the Norwegian approach to lower mileage

Tarvy wrote:

• Training 1 easy endurance run 45-60 minutes

• Training 2 threshold training 6-10×3 minutes, 1 minute break

• Training 3 easy endurance run 45-60 minutes

• Training 4 2x (6-10x 30 seconds), rest 30 seconds, set rest 2 minutes

• Training 5 easy endurance run 45-60 minutes

• Training 6 subthreshold training 3-5×6 minutes, break 2 minutes

• Training 7 easy endurance run 45-60 minutes

Just look at the training philosophy of Grete Koens (it has already been discussed here several times) to see how far performance can go with just two 30-minute threshold sessions per week and one sprint session. It is almost equivalent to NSM, if not even easier. Her elite athletes do not do more threshold volume, only more easy volume. The structure she outlines on her blog describes something close to NSM for an amateur athlete.

Max performance wrote:

R.Bre wrote:

I know a runner who was coached by the wizard, got him injured multple times, left him, and now coached by a ordinary club coach and got even faster.

I know that is a lie.

Max performance wrote:

You should not mix different paces in the same workout. They are then counterproductive to each purpose.

Max performance wrote:

sans-culottes wrote:

Perfectly applicable to mid distance runners in this thread. Your legs feel more sore than normal after doing 2x6x200m for the first time? Introduce it more gradually, like

10' sub-T, 4x200, 10' sub T

10' sub T, 6x200, 5' sub T

etc

You should not mix different paces in the same workout. They are then counterproductive to each purpose.

r0zina wrote:

Scandinavian runner wrote:

The list of people that get injured after breaking PBs with NSM is actually concerning to me.

Does this include all the racing distances or is it specific to the marathon? I ask, because the only injury reports I've seen in this thread are related to the marathon.

Marathon is quite an interesting distance. The longest run most plans suggest is 30 km. One of the relatively recent studies found a link between injury risk and the length of your longest run in the past 30 days. There they suggest that the injury risk greatly increases when you increase the long run by more than 10 %. For the marathon race you basically increase it by 40 % (going from 30 km to 42 km). So if that study is correct, the marathon is by itself very injury prone to just about anyone.

runnersareclueless wrote:

If only there were a way of measuring this nebulous "muscle tone" . . .

Scandinavian runner wrote:

Sorry, forgot to say that my concerns is marathon specific. I see tons and tons of people that break PBs after PBs using NSM on half marathons and below without any injury issues.

Scandinavian runner wrote:

runnersareclueless wrote:

If only there were a way of measuring this nebulous "muscle tone" . . .

Coggan,

You'll find the answer on Pubmed among the more than 10,000 article search results on "muscle tone" and "muscle tonus".

sans-culottes wrote:

Max performance wrote:

You should not mix different paces in the same workout. They are then counterproductive to each purpose.

You are never working systems in isolation so I don't buy this argument

Max performance wrote:

sans-culottes wrote:

Perfectly applicable to mid distance runners in this thread. Your legs feel more sore than normal after doing 2x6x200m for the first time? Introduce it more gradually, like

10' sub-T, 4x200, 10' sub T

10' sub T, 6x200, 5' sub T

etc

You should not mix different paces in the same workout. They are then counterproductive to each purpose.

Something Witty wrote:

Max performance wrote:

You should not mix different paces in the same workout. They are then counterproductive to each purpose.

Give Renato Canova a call and tell him he's doing it all wrong

Isadora wrote:

Something Witty wrote:

Give Renato Canova a call and tell him he's doing it all wrong

Renato doesn't mix different purposes in workouts. Wrong again :)

NZ_Runner1 wrote:

I keep it vestibular wrote:

I'm pretty skeptical about Bakkens discussion of muscle tone. Book is arriving tomorrow so I'm looking forward to reading up on it & may very well be proven wrong. He's the only person I've heard mention muscle tone theories related to running.

I've tried palpating every now & then after/before workouts the last couple weeks. Nothing. Are people feeling/noticing a difference in their tone?

Yes, it gives me woo woo pseudoscience vibes. I'm failing to see anyone else give it much weight, it but it appears to be at the center of everything Bakken.

My muscles feel the same everyday.

lexel wrote:

Hard2Find wrote:

If I'm going to be doing ad hoc projects for you, I might as well give ChatNB's website some traffic...

Link:modeltheruncom.wpcomstaging.com/2026/0...

Thank you very much.

As discussed (so this is for this thread), with the high correlating formula LTv = %LT *VO2max/CR (CR ... cost of running), one problem is to integrate vlamax here. %LT inversely correlates with vlamax, but it is not identically. That leads further to the possibility that vlamax is indeed not real and an auxiliary variable. Coggan called the concept of vlamax 'bogus concept' onces, maybe he was right :)

briguy wrote:

Not sure if this has already been posted here but here you go:

Tweet:x.com/stevemagness/status/203645516871...

briguy wrote:

Not sure if this has already been posted here but here you go:

Tweet:x.com/stevemagness/status/203645516871...