Modifying the Norwegian approach to lower mileage

Strava snoop with your answers! wrote:

Sirpoc is under no obligation. He already has covered this. He simply didn't bother uploading to Strava a lot of the time, because he had no followers. Maybe he will go back, maybe he won't it's spotty but there's enough on there. Same with his cycling training. It would be nice just to see day to day, but who is going to make him seriously go and plug a Garmin 520 in and force upload? He's done more than enough for everyone hear 10 times over. For running he bought a Daniel's book. Which he is very complimentary of. So we pretty much know how he trained anyway. We are all familiar I would guess with how that training looks.

For instance. We can see that from a November from running for most of the year, he ran a 19:20 parkrun. Remember, he ran the same course every time. The following July he ran 18:59. By October that year , so almost 12 months, he ran 18:55. That's less than 30 seconds improved, in almost a year and there are around 5-6 races in the space of 5 months all around 18:5x. This is all available also on power of 10. I know, because I'm a geek and I checked all of this out before.

What do you think he did, do this on purpose and ruin his race every time when nobody was watching or cared so that in 3-4 years time he could become a reluctant voice for hobby joggers to sell a story? Do you honestly think he deliberately ran 18:5x and then planned in the future I will run properly and run 15 flat and shock everyone? It seems to be what you are suggesting.

Or, more likely, you know, it's just what happened as told.

strava snoop is back again wrote:

roulette wheel1111 wrote:

sirpoc is honest...not sure where this is coming from? I like most of your post re: NSM but am just confused...did he actually do this?

There are tons of sirpoc activities from way back. Some going back to 2012. I even found his duathlon on there he has spoken about, from before he even ran properly. It's sporadic, but a lot of the cycling goes back a long way and even to before when automatic upload was a thing. You actually had to plug your Garmin in if you wanted Kudos :)

Running is also sporadic from when he started. He mentioned before he only really started uploading everything when people became interested. You can easily see many of his KOMs for cycling time trial courses and this is from over a decade ago now.

I really don't think you can be much more open with training that you can basically go on his Strava and see his whole training for the last few years training like this. He's also given us all his information like threshold, max HR, anything we want to analyse his training.

It's part of the reason this has been such an open forum.

south coast runna wrote:

roulette wheel1111 wrote:

sirpoc is honest...not sure where this is coming from? I like most of your post re: NSM but am just confused...did he actually do this?

I posted a while back. My claim to fame in the thread was how I used to beat sirpoc at the parkrun local to us. It didn't even cross my mind he was the same person from this thread. Again, all I can tell you is the results are out there and not only that, he was very average for a while. I mean it's not rocket science, his training was inconsistent, never really built any load. No wonder he didn't really improve. I'm sure many of us have experienced this. Unfortunately, now even training like this myself I'm still behind him again ha ha

It really is just about what consistency can do over a period of time. That's what NSM brings. People are totally underestimating how much years of being injury free and stacking load brings. Many people won't unlock anything like their potential until they do this.

Something Witty wrote:

BigMango wrote:

I read your post but I didn't agree with you. You seem to think that means I haven't read it. It is a discussion, right?

If Sirpoc would post his Strava activities prior to appearing on LetsRun that would be wonderful :) Would add a a ton of value to see this incredible progression when he implemented NSM. I can look at FOD runner's data and see his success and it's motivating but as exceptional as it is, it is realistic.

Happy it is working for you and I'm also enjoying NSM and as slow as I was when I started, I won't dropping my 5k time by a minute. Hoping for close to 2 minutes in the 10k but would be pleased with 1.5 minutes.

Let's say he did make that part up, or any part of his history (which I doubt) would that take away from how this method has helped literally thousands of runners to improve? Or is everyone part of this conspiracy?

full time living wrote:

I actually enjoy the YouTube scene. But I'm always surprised by how slow they are, many basically have unlimited time to train. Fenton still not breaking 30 on 16 hours a week split between running and cycling in recent times? It's the sort of load just about nobody with a normal job can manage. Let alone the recovery. Same with Bester.

This isn't a criticism. I'm just curious as to how some of these "full time" guys aren't better, considering the advantages they have.

But then again, I guess these days you get less and less sub elites like the old days, doing normal jobs. Maybe life is just busier or these guys don't shout about it? There's nobody really out there in hobby land where I think "wow, that's impressive considering they also do X as a living and in those hours". In the old days, this just seemed more of a regular thing.

pollots wrote:

(Him) wrote:

BigMango what are you prattling on about? Maybe Sirpoc runs 15:00 with other plans… maybe he doesn’t. People respond differently to training, some get faster, some don’t. Sirpoc wasn’t responding to the level he wanted to with his running so he made his training plan, executed it, and he DID improve. And not only did he improve, but he and others also communicated a plan that’s new to the majority of us. Nobody made promises that an individual will get to 15 in 3 years. You have people get there with high mileage and others with low mileage. All on different plans. Whatever sirpoc’s “potential/ability” was is irrelevant; we’ve been presented in this thread with tools to help our running. And in this thread we’ve seen many people employ those tools to get faster

P.s. The quote is bolded from BigMango’s funniest moments in the stream of consciousness he posted

He also didn't go directly from cycling to running. Not sure where this myth came from mango. There was a 4 year gap where he did nothing. As far as I know. Literally nothing sport wise, apart his main hobby of darts.

I was a good cyclist, 4.5 w/kg FTP and even after just 6 months of quitting, I only managed a 24:34 after about 5 weeks of running. With 4 years of nothing, I doubt I would have broken 30 in the first month. Currently a low 17 runner training full vanilla. Got to about 19:30 with some generic Runna plans I wish in retrospect I hadn't done for my first 18 months in the sport. Still making good progress via NSM in the last 14 months.

It's almost impossible to compare people's starting point to where they got to, as you really don't know so many of the factors. My brother ran 23:22 after about 2 weeks (5 runs) of training with only playing badminton and 5 a side football 3 out of 7 days a week for his entire adult life fitness. He's running 6 days a week and 5 hours consistently and can't break 18 two years on after what looked like an incredible starting point. Some people just really respond straight away and peak early, others just can chip away for what seems like forever. Which one you are is luck of the draw.

sirpoc84 wrote:

drunken_watcher wrote:

Are you ruling out sub 2:20 just for this marathon or forever? Either way, all the best for the marathon

Probably forever. I'm 42 pretty soon. Time is also a factor. They'll be a time soon where even just holding times, means I'm still improving in the sense I'm holding off natural decline. That is obviously probably not right now, but I doubt that is far off, either.

The bike is helping a lot. It's meant my 10k the other week in pretty tough conditions was a really well ran race and up there with the better races I've done. I think 5-10k with vanilla running and the bike as a top up, I can still put up some really good times. Maybe even time trial a bit again, duathlon maybe.

If 2:24 is to be the best marathon I ever run, I'm pretty happy with that. It's not a distance I'll probably do again, unless I think it's worth it. It's such a big commitment.

Strava snoop with your answers! wrote:

BigMango wrote:

Just being real. THis has become idolization over reality. Sirpoc, please post your Strava data prior to July 2023 so we can learn from your progression after implementing NSM.

I still don't think he was stuck at 19 minutes. I think he wasn't raining consistently and ran 19 minutes. Big difference and I just want to see his data so I know what to expect.

Hey if you don't want more actual data that would help us all see his "actual" progression then up to you. If he was training 4 hours a week and running 19 vs now training 8 and running 15:+, wouldn't this help us all make better judgements.

Sirpoc is under no obligation. He already has covered this. He simply didn't bother uploading to Strava a lot of the time, because he had no followers. Maybe he will go back, maybe he won't it's spotty but there's enough on there. Same with his cycling training. It would be nice just to see day to day, but who is going to make him seriously go and plug a Garmin 520 in and force upload? He's done more than enough for everyone hear 10 times over. For running he bought a Daniel's book. Which he is very complimentary of. So we pretty much know how he trained anyway. We are all familiar I would guess with how that training looks.

For instance. We can see that from a November from running for most of the year, he ran a 19:20 parkrun. Remember, he ran the same course every time. The following July he ran 18:59. By October that year , so almost 12 months, he ran 18:55. That's less than 30 seconds improved, in almost a year and there are around 5-6 races in the space of 5 months all around 18:5x. This is all available also on power of 10. I know, because I'm a geek and I checked all of this out before.

What do you think he did, do this on purpose and ruin his race every time when nobody was watching or cared so that in 3-4 years time he could become a reluctant voice for hobby joggers to sell a story? Do you honestly think he deliberately ran 18:5x and then planned in the future I will run properly and run 15 flat and shock everyone? It seems to be what you are suggesting.

Or, more likely, you know, it's just what happened as told.