Merkel admitted the Minsk accords were agreed to not to achieve peace but to give Ukraine and their bosses a chance to build up the Ukraine military.
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16
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carmine9 wrote:
Even the MSM is beginning to admit how badly things are going for Urkaine.
The dupes still cannot admit it
Everyone is well aware how terrible things are for Ukrainian civilians, and how they are being targeted by the Russian military. There is no "beginning to admit" -- the huge suffering of Ukrainians has been widely reported in Western media since the war began. (I doubt its being reported in Russian state media, though). You "argument" above seems to be a strawman type claim -- no one disputes the enormous humanitarian crisis in Ukraine that Russia is causing.
What you are also doing is confusing and conflating Russia's military failures -- retreats from Kiev, Kherson, Kharkiv, sinking of Moskva, etc. -- with Russia's targeting of Ukrainian civilians. When it comes to terrorizing Ukrainian women and children with missiles, rockets and bombs, no one disputes that Russia is "winning" and achieving that goal. But Russia's military failures are enormous and shocking. No one expected the Russian military to be so cowardly and useless. Your attempts to excuse the latter by raising the former are both obvious and disgusting.
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#10463
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Intel for the attack on Wagner group was bought from Russian soldiers! Apparently there’s animosity between regular Russian Army and Wagner group of mercenaries.70 -
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Turtleb wrote:
Three items on the war.
First shows that Merkel is not much smarter than Biden:
Merkel: But that also requires you to say what exactly the alternatives were at the time. I thought the initiation of NATO accession for Ukraine and Georgia discussed in 2008 was wrong. The countries neither had the necessary prerequisites for this, nor had the consequences of such a decision been fully considered, both with regard to Russia's actions against Georgia and Ukraine and to NATO and its rules of assistance. And the 2014 Minsk agreement was an attempt to give Ukraine time.
Putin, and many others, have taken this to mean NATO had no intention of honoring the Minsk agreement and were just gaining time to give Ukraine enough weapons to be able to break it. After this, good luck convincing countries that were on the fence that Russia is in the wrong. Also, good luck getting any kind of agreement in the future.
Second.
Not to let Merkel out stupid America, we've seen some rumblings (from Congressman for example) to give Ukraine long range weapons to hit Russia proper.
Putin has said two things from the very beginning: if Ukraine hits Russia proper they would regret it and if Ukraine does it with NATO supplied weapons it will hold NATO responsible. Ukraine hit the Kerch bridge and has since said good bye to the power grid.
If Ukraine uses a NATO supplied missile to hit, for example, Moscow (which they would if they could), what do you think the response would be. Maybe one missile into London
for every one into Moscow? One into the reflecting pool in DC? This is how you things ratchet up towards WWIII and armageddon.Third
Taiwan has about 6-8 years as an independent country. At that point China will have 1000 nuclear warheads.
If the US carries through with long range weapons to Ukraine above we are probably all dead, but if they don't, China has noted that if they have enough nukes Taiwan won't get the ability, and US won't, strike the mainland. Also noted from Ukraine is the US anti missile defense systems can't shoot down enough missiles to make a difference. China can turn Taiwan into smoking rubble.
Nice little renegade province you have there, be a shame if something happened to it.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!
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carmine9 wrote:
Because Jimmy adore is a lying idiot that couldn’t find Ukraine, Nigeria, Finland, or Holland on a map.
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You and the rest of the 1/2 dozen pro-Ukrainian fanatics on this thread are not interested in peace, you are seeking a Ukraine victory. If you sought peace, you would not argue hourly regarding which side is winning.
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Cold War Warrior 19 wrote:
You and the rest of the 1/2 dozen pro-Ukrainian fanatics on this thread are not interested in peace, you are seeking a Ukraine victory. If you sought peace, you would not argue hourly regarding which side is winning.
We don't have to argue about which side is winning - it's the side that didn't get routed as the fled Kharkiv and Kherson.
Of course we're seeking a Ukrainian victory; it's the best guarantee for long-term peace in the region. If Russia could completely collapse - much like the roof of this shopping center - even better. Especially if Putin hangs from the gallows in Red Square.
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Ukraine forces have been carrying out very effective long range precision attacks on RU force concentrations and command centers while maintaining the dug in battle lines in the East. The most significant strike occurred against the Wagner group command center in Kadiivka. while Russia has been able to take advantage of its mobilization and have inflicted heavy casualties on UA forces around Bakhmut, the UA precision strikes are starting to add up and could mean more breakthroughs for UA forces in the coming weeks.
Putin reeling as Wagner militia suffers 'significant' losses in devastating Ukraine strike (msn.com)
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GoodGollyMissLolly wrote:
Defcon 3 wrote:
The only thing that surprised Ukraine about the Russian army was how completely incompetent they were. The 70,000 dead Russian soldiers will never be surprised again. I hear vodka sales are way up in Russia as it’s the only way for all the families to cope with the fact the little Ivan’s face got blown off. All hail Putin!
Of course, and Ukraine is being supplied by U.S. advanced military technology as well as military intelligence. Ukraine seems to know every move the Russians make - where do think Ukraine is getting this intelligence from? They don't have any Billion dollar military satellites floating in space. Lol That's is all U.S technology being provided by the us. And look at the Billions of dollars Biden is throwing at Ukraine instead of spending that money on American needs.
Russia is not fighting Ukraine per se - it's a proxy war against NATO & the U.S. You naive MSM mongers seem to think Ukraine is fighting Russia on it's own merits. The Ukrainian military forces would have been annihilated months ago if it were not for the U.S. saving the day at the expense of the U.S. taxpayer!
NATO & the U.S. seem to have better conventional weapon technology & intelligence. Russia has the world's most advance nuclear weapon technology. This is what makes this so dangerous is that Putin could escalate this into a nuclear conflict using their hypersonic missile technology carrying tactical nukes at NATO/U.S. targets outside of Ukraine. Russia has 3 hypersonic missiles that NATO has little defense against; the Kinzhal, Avangard (HGV) & Tirskon. The Kinzhal & Tirskon can carry up to a 200 kt warhead & the Avangard up to a whopping 500 kt warhead. This is scary stuff folks - just a push button away from a mentally ill, desperate dictator.
If Putin feels back into a corner & believes he can no longer defeat the Ukraine military without NATO/U.S. support, then he could escalate this into a conflict with NATO. Desperate dictators take desperate measures when backed into corner they cannot get out of.
That's why I think it's imperative for the ambassadors of Ukraine, U.S. & Russia to get together & pursue a peace agreement & end this bloody conflict before it gets out of hand. And the leader of the free world, Biden, should lead the charge & get the adversaries together for peace negotiations. Wasn't it the great JFK who wasn't afraid to get on the phone & talk with the Soviet leader during the Cubin missile crises when all of his military cabinet advised against it? The world needs an end to this conflict not an escalation. The world leaders must talk peace!
14 -
Defcon 3 wrote:
GoodGollyMissLolly wrote:
The only thing that surprised Ukraine about the Russian army was how completely incompetent they were. The 70,000 dead Russian soldiers will never be surprised again. I hear vodka sales are way up in Russia as it’s the only way for all the families to cope with the fact the little Ivan’s face got blown off. All hail Putin!
Russia is not fighting Ukraine per se - it's a proxy war against NATO & the U.S. You naive MSM mongers seem to think Ukraine is fighting Russia on it's own merits. The Ukrainian military forces would have been annihilated months ago if it were not for the U.S. saving the day at the expense of the U.S. taxpayer!
Nope. More strawman garbage, like Carmine's above. Everyone knows the only way Ukraine can defend itself from the Russian invasion is with NATO supplies. America and its allies are fully aware and fully ready to help Ukraine defend itself against Russia. Everyone knows that. You have not made any point at all. None.
Which does not detract at all from the enormous sacrifices that Ukrainians are making to defend their country from Russian invasion and occupation. Ukrainians are willing to die by the thousands to defend their country from scumbags like yourself. Ukrainians don't want you people in their country, and they have not waivered from that position since day one.
Nutjob wrote:
NATO & the U.S. seem to have better conventional weapon technology & intelligence.Seem to? Really? You think?
Nutjob wrote:
Russia has the world's most advance nuclear weapon technology.No they don't. Not even close.
If Putin feels back into a corner & believes he can no longer defeat the Ukraine military without NATO/U.S. support, then he could escalate this into a conflict with NATO.Yes, he could do that. It will be the end of Russia as we know it, but he could do that. I guess we will all have to wait and see how insane and suicidal Russia is.
My guess is that Russia is far less likely to attack NATO now than they were a year ago, having more experience with the pathetic nature of the Russian military. The Russian military is a total failure, incapable of even conquering a weak neighbor that doesn't even have access to the most lethal NATO weapons. Attacking an actual NATO country or countries seems FAR beyond the capabilities of Russia now (or ever).
40 -
US and NATO are loving this war. They get to send Russia back to the Stone Age, remove Russia from the world economy, deplete the Russian military, ridicule and remove Putin, expand NATO, test military equipment in the battlefield, and eliminate Russia as an economic competitor without sending a single US or NATO soldier into battle. This is an awesome opportunity to ruin Russia. We need to stretch it out for another 5-10 years minimum.
10 -
Colin Bombo Harris wrote:
Defcon 3 wrote:
Russia is not fighting Ukraine per se - it's a proxy war against NATO & the U.S. You naive MSM mongers seem to think Ukraine is fighting Russia on it's own merits. The Ukrainian military forces would have been annihilated months ago if it were not for the U.S. saving the day at the expense of the U.S. taxpayer!
Nope. More strawman garbage, like Carmine's above. Everyone knows the only way Ukraine can defend itself from the Russian invasion is with NATO supplies. America and its allies are fully aware and fully ready to help Ukraine defend itself against Russia. Everyone knows that. You have not made any point at all. None.
Which does not detract at all from the enormous sacrifices that Ukrainians are making to defend their country from Russian invasion and occupation. Ukrainians are willing to die by the thousands to defend their country from scumbags like yourself. Ukrainians don't want you people in their country, and they have not waivered from that position since day one.
Nutjob wrote:
NATO & the U.S. seem to have better conventional weapon technology & intelligence.Seem to? Really? You think?
Nutjob wrote:
Russia has the world's most advance nuclear weapon technology.No they don't. Not even close.
If Putin feels back into a corner & believes he can no longer defeat the Ukraine military without NATO/U.S. support, then he could escalate this into a conflict with NATO.Yes, he could do that. It will be the end of Russia as we know it, but he could do that. I guess we will all have to wait and see how insane and suicidal Russia is.
My guess is that Russia is far less likely to attack NATO now than they were a year ago, having more experience with the pathetic nature of the Russian military. The Russian military is a total failure, incapable of even conquering a weak neighbor that doesn't even have access to the most lethal NATO weapons. Attacking an actual NATO country or countries seems FAR beyond the capabilities of Russia now (or ever).
What's with the name calling little immature brat! Calling me a "scumbag" you immature keyboard warrior punk! I haven't address anyone here disrespectfully or called anyone names. I'm merely expressing my opinion & concerns, and providing news reports & expert opinions who have the same concerns. Isn't that what this thread is for?
What cracks me up is you wouldn't be calling me names to my face. I've discuss this Russo-Ukrainian war many times with friends & acquaintances at my gym & some may disagree with me but none call me names to my face. You're just an immature punk who thinks he's an internet tough guy. Lol
And yes, Russia has more advanced nuclear weapon technology - go research it punk & do a school report on it. And if Putin uses tactical nukes you think "it will be the end of Russia as we know it?" Lol It would also be the end of the U.S. & Europe as we know it. It's called Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD). Go look it up & do another school report. That's why NATO wouldn't respond with strategic nuclear weapons or any nukes for they fact if Putin uses low-yield tactical nukes or even some EMP weapons in Ukraine further destroying the Ukrainian infrastructure. Biden doesn't want to go down in history as the President that started WW3 with Russia & consequently armageddon. The U.S. & NATO is scared sh*tless of the Russian Nuclear Arsenal.
03 -
Cold War Warrior 19 wrote:
You and the rest of the 1/2 dozen pro-Ukrainian fanatics on this thread are not interested in peace, you are seeking a Ukraine victory. If you sought peace, you would not argue hourly regarding which side is winning.
The hourly arguing about who is winning is perfectly rational.
The US is not particularly loyal, and Biden has already proven himself to be less so than other presidents (unless you are a black lesbian athlete who kneels for the anthem and so must have voted for him). As soon as it is clear Ukraine has lost the US will declare victory--see how many Russians were killed!--and stop writing checks.
What needs to be understood is that NATO (basically the US) has given all the military equipment it can without including stuff that will lead the way to WWIII--like long range missiles. Biden might do it anyway, but maybe he will look past his corn pop delusions and not do it.
The Soviet Union was preparing for a war in Europe with 10's of millions on each side that would go on for years. Russia apparently inherited those artillery shells. They probably have enough to level every building in Ukraine twice over. And the USSR always 'specialized' in missiles. Looks like, at the moment, Russia can outproduce all of NATO combined, despite any sanctions.
Ukraine's best option is to strike a deal now.
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obscurenaiarunner wrote:
Does anyone know anything about chris moreno? He coached at missouri valley and was "released". Any information would be helpful
the only deal RU would accept is for UKR to hand over crimea and the eastern annexed provinces.
Which is basically surrender. Esp because everyone expects RU to re-invade after some time to rebuild their armed forces. Why give RU the land it wants and time to re-arm?
But on the other hand if UKR keeps fighting, we're likely to still be following this war for five or six years.
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Turtleb wrote:
Cold War Warrior 19 wrote:
You and the rest of the 1/2 dozen pro-Ukrainian fanatics on this thread are not interested in peace, you are seeking a Ukraine victory. If you sought peace, you would not argue hourly regarding which side is winning.
The Soviet Union was preparing for a war in Europe with 10's of millions on each side that would go on for years. Russia apparently inherited those artillery shells. They probably have enough to level every building in Ukraine twice over. And the USSR always 'specialized' in missiles. Looks like, at the moment, Russia can outproduce all of NATO combined, despite any sanctions.
Ukraine's best option is to strike a deal now.
But, you forgot that the USSR is also an insanely corrupt sh*thole, so only like 10% of those missiles work and the only people who know how to build more have been mobilized, so are now dead in a field somewhere in Ukraine, which is why Russia is now buying drones from Iran.
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Defcon 3 wrote:
What's with the name calling little immature brat! Calling me a "scumbag" you immature keyboard warrior punk! I haven't address anyone here disrespectfully or called anyone names. I'm merely expressing my opinion & concerns, and providing news reports & expert opinions who have the same concerns. Isn't that what this thread is for?
What cracks me up is you wouldn't be calling me names to my face. I've discuss this Russo-Ukrainian war many times with friends & acquaintances at my gym & some may disagree with me but none call me names to my face. You're just an immature punk who thinks he's an internet tough guy. Lol
And yes, Russia has more advanced nuclear weapon technology - go research it punk & do a school report on it. And if Putin uses tactical nukes you think "it will be the end of Russia as we know it?" Lol It would also be the end of the U.S. & Europe as we know it. It's called Mutually Assured Destruction (MAD). Go look it up & do another school report. That's why NATO wouldn't respond with strategic nuclear weapons or any nukes for they fact if Putin uses low-yield tactical nukes or even some EMP weapons in Ukraine further destroying the Ukrainian infrastructure. Biden doesn't want to go down in history as the President that started WW3 with Russia & consequently armageddon. The U.S. & NATO is scared sh*tless of the Russian Nuclear Arsenal.
I would happily call you names to your face, because you must be an absolute p*ssy to live your live in fear of Russia and WW3.
Putin isn't going to use a tactical nuke in Ukraine, because he knows the NATO would respond by using more than 2% of their capability to crush the Russia. Like, picture the Kremlin as it a smoldering crater with Putin's putrid corpse rotting at the bottom. Putin doesn't want go down as the loser that started WW3 any more than Biden does; mostly because Putin craves power and being the leader of Russia post-nuclear apocalypse means there's nobody to stroke his delicate ego.
00 -
Defcon 3 wrote:
GoodGollyMissLolly wrote:
The only thing that surprised Ukraine about the Russian army was how completely incompetent they were. The 70,000 dead Russian soldiers will never be surprised again. I hear vodka sales are way up in Russia as it’s the only way for all the families to cope with the fact the little Ivan’s face got blown off. All hail Putin!
Of course, and Ukraine is being supplied by U.S. advanced military technology as well as military intelligence. Ukraine seems to know every move the Russians make - where do think Ukraine is getting this intelligence from? They don't have any Billion dollar military satellites floating in space. Lol That's is all U.S technology being provided by the us. And look at the Billions of dollars Biden is throwing at Ukraine instead of spending that money on American needs.
Russia is not fighting Ukraine per se - it's a proxy war against NATO & the U.S. You naive MSM mongers seem to think Ukraine is fighting Russia on it's own merits. The Ukrainian military forces would have been annihilated months ago if it were not for the U.S. saving the day at the expense of the U.S. taxpayer!
NATO & the U.S. seem to have better conventional weapon technology & intelligence. Russia has the world's most advance nuclear weapon technology. This is what makes this so dangerous is that Putin could escalate this into a nuclear conflict using their hypersonic missile technology carrying tactical nukes at NATO/U.S. targets outside of Ukraine. Russia has 3 hypersonic missiles that NATO has little defense against; the Kinzhal, Avangard (HGV) & Tirskon. The Kinzhal & Tirskon can carry up to a 200 kt warhead & the Avangard up to a whopping 500 kt warhead. This is scary stuff folks - just a push button away from a mentally ill, desperate dictator.
If Putin feels back into a corner & believes he can no longer defeat the Ukraine military without NATO/U.S. support, then he could escalate this into a conflict with NATO. Desperate dictators take desperate measures when backed into corner they cannot get out of.
That's why I think it's imperative for the ambassadors of Ukraine, U.S. & Russia to get together & pursue a peace agreement & end this bloody conflict before it gets out of hand. And the leader of the free world, Biden, should lead the charge & get the adversaries together for peace negotiations. Wasn't it the great JFK who wasn't afraid to get on the phone & talk with the Soviet leader during the Cubin missile crises when all of his military cabinet advised against it? The world needs an end to this conflict not an escalation. The world leaders must talk peace!
00 -
carmine9 wrote:
Look at the down votes from the crew that does not want facts that contradicts the propaganda!
01
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