The Ingebrigtsen aren't clean; 1.5&5. Here’s why:

In this day and age one must assume that every athlete who is competing at the highest level of their sport is using some type of "medical advantage" in order to compete on an even level with the others. That is unfortunate as most certainly there are some (even many) who are completely clean. It is also unfortunate (but a sign of the times) as it goes counter to how we should be approaching things- innocent until proven guilty. That is where professional sports is though- assume the guilt of all as what we have learned over the last few decades that most are involved in some form of medical alteration of their physiology in order to gain that edge.

As to your comment on "the experiment" by the Norwegian father being an unprecedented case that is not the reality. Take Richard Williams for example. He wrote a 78 page manifesto, while Venus was in the womb, claiming he was going to make his daughters (Serena had not even been conceived yet so figure that out) the best female tennis players in the world. He did exactly that. And what was Richard's experience with tennis? None. How did he do it? I'll leave that to you to investigate.

The one thing to be learned from all of this is it is next to impossible to keep up with a psychotic parent.

Good to see someone else has a brain. Of course they are dirty. It's truly hilarious they are getting away with it.

I'd wager big money the dirtiest Chinese and Russian women combined were cleaner than the Ingebrigtsens. And Europe will protect them from being caught.

The begrudgery in here his hilarious. Almost as bad as cycling fans. Anyone fast must be doping. This is what the "argument" boils down to. Why do you even follow the sport?

Brain??? "It's truly hilarious they are getting away with this". So there must be a reason. "... Europe will protect them from being caught". Getting away. The big coverup. The premise is that they are doped. And then the speculation, not very sophisticated, inspired by the brain, but without knowledge about Europe. All of the countries in the European Union? Well, Norway is'nt part of EU. Protected by whom and how??? Conspiracy theories are dangerous in all societies. No evidence, no knowledge, no facts. Brain??? So the media and the journalists are part of the coverup. The Ingebrigtsens are white, is that the reason? So here in Europe, well,actually here in Norway, that's how we do it? This Autumn when they are going to train in Africa together with the Manangoi brothers and Cheruiyot, will they be protected by Africa too. Both the whole of Africa and the whole of Europe stand behind them. Until now the former poor Ingebrigtsenfamily has not earned a lot of money, but if they race as good as now they will earn some. With your brain have you any idea? On these pages there are a lot of speculations and in the US conspiracytheories flourish. It dripples down from the top. Braindrain.

grammer and spelling wrote:

Coevett wrote:

and one guy Jakob who might go down as the GOAT of all time.

OP has the IQ of a snail.

Speaking of snail IQs, can you please tell us why you wrote the “greatest of all time of all time”?

LOL

Thank YOU!

ex-runner wrote:

Wikipedia lists 43 Moroccan individuals who have been found guilty in doping cases. Russia have 105. USA have 95.

Thank you

Yes but Russia and the US are across the board, mainly sprints, jumps, walks and throws. Virtually all the Moroccans are 1500-5,000m men, not to mention Moroccans that have failed under other nationalities and if memory serves me correctly this site is called Letsrun.

A strange Los Angeles father is said to have a different mindset than other Los Angeleans, and has a covered medical background claiming that he will make his daughter the best and has no experience with remote tennis training. "If European teenagers can do this, why can't my Los Angeleans?"

Not one, but TWO SISTERS to be one of the happiest and productive recipes of genes that can be demonstrated in other ways such as performance on performance. For all our daughters in a single person, the important person is to hit the lotus WHEN TIME TIME. Families who do this best can demonstrate that they include the genetic pool that is different from them (not sure if all parents in the world have tried all kinds of training for their small the best thing to do) the best way to get what you expect is that it's been tried twice! Daughters themselves have legs and ankles to protect the sports industry.

http://wtafiles.wtatennis.com/pdf/rankings/All_Career_Prize_Money.pdf

The Spanish NR holder Alemayehu Bezabeh ran 12:57.25 beating Moorcroft. Though Bezabeth is an imported Ethiopian, he was under the guidance of Operación Galgo, one of Spain's notorious doping rings.

He was on program under Spanish doping doctors in the country of Spain which is a little different than Mourhit & Ramzi, for example, who spent considerble time in Morocco on programs under the Moroccan doctors. So, I would say Spain (Operación Galgo) outperformed Moorcroft. And it must have been a good program Bezabeh was on; he improved from 13:10.10 to his PB of 12:57.25 in just one year! (2009/10).

Of course, when I talk about "scarcity of non-African examples" that would help establish precedence, and credibility, the conversation invariably snaps back to examples of African-born imports, helping make my point. During the height of the EPO era, in the 1990s, and 2000s, in times of no testing, or easy to beat testing, no Spaniard was unable to outperform Moorcroft. But in the ABP era, when testing got tougher, Spain imported an Ethiopian and finally was able to outperform Moorcroft. When this is the best example, it is hard for me to draw a strong correlation to doping, and not draw a strong correlation to the necessity of importing an East African.

It was posited earlier above that the argument is little more than that anyone fast must be doping. Yes, that is the correct argument. We are in an era of exceptional sporting achievement across the board where doping for the most part can't be detected. To suggest athletes are still clean is like believing ambitious businessmen wouldn't make use of money offered them and deposited in their accounts.

I wonder if the success of the Ingebritsens can be tied in any way to the phenomenal success of Norwegian cross country skiers? Obviously, cross country skiing is a huge part of Norwegian sports and as a country they are ideally located for success at it. Cross country skiing is about as close to distance running as you can get.

Maybe there is a large percentage of the Norwegian population that has the right genetics and training to be successful at track but is instead pouring that effort into XC skiing? Ben True was a Xc skier who ran on the side before deciding to focus on track while in college. Maybe some of their XC stars could have been medalists on the track?

Also, lots of doping in cross country skiing ;)

Yes, but not amongst Norwegian skiiers. Two instances. One misuse of asthmamedicin and the second lip moistness. Though a lot of doping: Finland, Austria etc.

Subway Surfers wrote:

ex-runner wrote:

Wikipedia lists 43 Moroccan individuals who have been found guilty in doping cases. Russia have 105. USA have 95.

Thank you

Yes but Russia and the US are across the board, mainly sprints, jumps, walks and throws. Virtually all the Moroccans are 1500-5,000m men, not to mention Moroccans that have failed under other nationalities and if memory serves me correctly this site is called Letsrun.

Poster claimed that Morocco had a state sponsored doping operation like Russia. I used facts to state that is incorrect. If anyone had organised doping operations it was Spain, do your own research. And statistics say perhaps the USA also. And Lance says the USA also.

Moroccan government wouldn't be able to organise a tea party. Instead there was a lack of testing but that was present across the world at the time.

Again. Filip is more rhan years older than Jakob. When Jakob started serious training at 12, Filip then 20 ran 3..38 at 1500 m. Get your facts straight. What you write is simply not true.

KaareV wrote:

Again. Filip is more rhan years older than Jakob. When Jakob started serious training at 12, Filip then 20 ran 3..38 at 1500 m. Get your facts straight. What you write is simply not true.

What you write is simply unintelligible.

Natural Talent wrote:

One strange Norwegian father that supposedly traits a different mentality then other Norwegians and has a covered medical background claims that he will make his sons the best with no prior experience related to distance running training. “If the African teenagers can do it why can’t my Norwegian ones”.

Can anyone provide more details about the father's medical background? Tried to find any information on what he did as a career before coaching his sons, and couldn't find anything. Would be interesting if he had a history as a doctor/pharmacist.

Do any of you realize that Norway is the top cross country skiing nation. XC skiing one of the most similar sports to running and has the highest V02 Max, so from a physiological perspective that aren't nearly as big of standouts in Norway as it appears. Also if one were to have proper training (developing as strong aerobic base, and adequate speed work) at a young age AND be disciplined enough to take recovery seriously then there is no reason he shouldn't run fast.

I'm not going to say they aren't doping but you don't just take a wack load of drugs and suddenly become fast! The human body adapts to stress (aka training and recovery) so he would still have to training alot to get fast.

In comparison to the American system of athletes changing coaches every 4 to 5 years, Jakob has a coach who knows and has known him personally his entire life. This can make a HUGE difference. Many NCAA athletes struggle to improve under the system which routinely overworks athletes who are also trying to get an education because they are STUDENTS. Also Jakob has 2 older brothers who were in many ways guinea pigs for training.