Nice problem to have but Cornell men have 33 guys in Top 10 in their events, with none in the mile, 3000, and 5000, and only three in the 800 & 1000. Some potential scorers will get left home so they can fill out a 4 x 800 and DMR, and will they not even enter the distance races.
Results from Princeton today:http://www.goprincetontigers.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=10600&ATCLID=209415503
I haven't been able to tell: have the New England results been posted on the tfrrs Ivy performance list yet?
kibitzer wrote:
I haven't been able to tell: have the New England results been posted on the tfrrs Ivy performance list yet?
No they have not. I looked through them earlier and there were not many performances that made a big impact within the top 10. The only really interesting one of note was that Dartmouth's Steve Mangan tried to go for sub-4 mile at the Harvard track, but came up 0.52 seconds short. It is a new season's best for him.
Results here:
http://usatfne.org/track/results/2014indoor.htmlbump
Thanks for the link, C/M. That mile list is crazy!
Dustin Brode of Harvard improved his season's best in the shot by more than two feet and is now over 60ft, and Ben Glauser improved his weight throw nearly a foot, to 64ft+; yet neither improved his position on the list (and Brode's best is still two meters behind Mozia's). It's a strange season when a 18.51 SP and 19.62 WT aren't headline performances! At least three of the throws at Heps (men's events and women's WT) will feature national-level performers.
Still: if I read fun.'s analysis correctly, Cornell's men only need to do a good job in the throws. They should be getting enough points elsewhere--the throws are not make-or-break for them this year. Princeton's guys, meanwhile, have done a fine job in the shot this month and now hold three of the top seven positions.
Harvard's men are ready to make some real noise at Heps. I'm sure Cornell would prefer that Columbia or Brown or Dartmouth collect a lot of middle-distance and distance points, but they'd probably be okay with Harvard doing it, too (anyone betting against Korolev?)--as long as Princeton doesn't! It'll be interesting to see whether anyone sets a solid pace in the three longer races this year, and takes some of the sting out of Princeton's and Harvard's (presumed) doublers/triplers.
There really weren't any major changes for the women, so when I did my fun.-style scoring projections, they did not really change. Then again, some of the points (particularly for the horizontal jumps, 200m, and 400m) are largely from outdoor performances, so it is really biased on outdoor potential. I guess I want to make sure I am doing this right...
Regarding side note #4 - look for Adam Bragg of Princeton to challenge the hep pv record set by Weiler.
List of men who's PB would have ranked them in top 15, but WILL NOT COMPETE at Heps because the did not run this indoor season
RNK | EVENT | MARK | SCHOOL | YR | NAME
03 | 500 | 1:03.20 | COR | JR | Admirand, Rutger
05 | 800 | 1:48.84 | COR | JR | Admirand, Rutger
11 | 1000 | 2:25.96 | COR | JR | Admirand, Rutger
11 | HEP | 4721 | COR | JR | Athanasopoulos, Nick
15 | LJ | 7.05m | COR | JR | Athanasopoulos, Nick
11 | PV | 4.80m | YAL | SR | Chandler, Paul
13 | TJ | 14.59m | COR | JR | Chew, Han Wei
13 | LJ | 7.08m | COR | JR | Chew, Han Wei
04 | 800 | 1:48.68 | COL | JR | Claflin, Connor
04 | 500 | 1:03.73 | COL | JR | Claflin, Connor
11 | 60 | 6.92 | PRI | JR | Egi, William
07 | 1000 | 2:24.99 | COL | SR | Jones, Byron
13 | 1609 | 4:03.79 | COL | SR | Jones, Byron
09 | 60 | 6.87 | HAR | SR | McCarthy, Connor
15 | 1609 | 4:04.70 | YAL | JR | McGowan, John
07 | HEP | 5066 | PRI | SR | Pelisek, Brad
06 | 1000 | 2:24.35 | COR | SR | Schilkowsky, John
10 | 3K | 8:06.54 | COR | SR | Schilkowsky, John
10 | 1609 | 4:02.92 | COR | SR | Schilkowsky, John
14 | 800 | 1:50.77 | COR | SR | Schilkowsky, John
02 | 60 | 6.79 | BRO | SR | Spooney, John
04 | 400 | 47.71 | BRO | SR | Spooney, John
15 | 800 | 1:51.07 | DAR | JR | Talbot, Silas
07 | 3K | 8:04.38 | PRI | SR | Vitez, Jonathan
10 | 5K | 14:09.37 | PRI | SR | Vitez, Jonathan
13 | HJ | 2.03m | DAR | JR | Yoder, Sam
RLJB wrote:
Regarding side note #4 - look for Adam Bragg of Princeton to challenge the hep pv record set by Weiler.
Anyone who has seen Adam vault this year will tell you he has yet to reach the limit of his potential. Expect his to put up a BIG mark this weekend.
RLJB wrote:
Regarding side note #4 - look for Adam Bragg of Princeton to challenge the hep pv record set by Weiler.
Yes - Bragg changed my thoughts on the men's pole vault at HYP when he attempted to break Weiler's meet record.
IVY FAN 2 wrote:
Nice problem to have but Cornell men have 33 guys in Top 10 in their events, with none in the mile, 3000, and 5000, and only three in the 800 & 1000. Some potential scorers will get left home so they can fill out a 4 x 800 and DMR, and will they not even enter the distance races.
You're right, Mike: a nice problem to have! But IIRC they (Cornell) had no distance entries at an indoor Heps a couple years back, too.
I'm sure their coaches will have a few tough choices to make, but if you factor in an injury or two among top-six guys, and hold out one or two heptathletes (who are top ten, but on a sparsely-populated list), it should be possible to fill in the relays.
I do regret that a couple of up-and-coming throwers probably won't get a chance to compete, though. I really think they'd have a shot at scoring. Unless Cornell decided to bag the DMR? Nah, they wouldn't do that...
Re choosing a squad of 33, I do remember that, at last spring's outdoor meet, only three of sixteen teams entered the max of 36 competitors--the two squads from Cornell, and the men (I believe it was) from Princeton. (The *host school* didn't take all the available spots--travel/lodging expense couldn't have been the objection there!)
Though a team like the Cornell men (*this* year) may have to make hard choices about whom to bring, I expect that the trend toward slimmer squads is likely to continue; and I think that this season's Ivy mile performance list gives a clue why.
As many have observed over the last few years, the Ivies have become truly national universities. They recruit nationally and internationally (for just one example, take a look at the Harvard roster--not your stereotypical bunch of New England Ivy kids:
http://www.gocrimson.com/sports/track/2013-14/roster
). And for many middle-class families, particularly those of male students, the Ivies now represent a better bottom-line college bill than even going to a state university on a full-tuition ride. This shows up in a performance list where a 4:04 mile doesn't put you among the top ten marks.
You can't bring in that level of talent without providing a chance for it to develop; and you can't do *that* unless you seek out other national-class competition. That means flights and/or multiple overnights during the season, and those cost money.
The Heps in earlier days (say, a generation back) was somewhat of a participation meet. The "good" kid could go and, even if he wasn't likely to score, would get competition that would help him progress as an athlete. I think that's somewhat less likely now. What's the benefit of entering a guy who's going to be completely outclassed by top-level performers? He'll mostly learn about losing (which comes easily enough, without lessons) and won't learn much to help him in the future--he won't lose "the right way," to use a coach's meme. (Plus there's the travel and lodging expense of going to Heps to consider--those spring trips to the Coast or down South are coming up...)
I'm not particularly nostalgic for the olden days, and I don't regret the League's continuing move toward quality. (I think the current Heps meets are fantastic!--well, except maybe for those 4:20 men's miles.) I just note that things have changed, and that choosing those 33 kids indoors and 36 out may not be too difficult for some/most? of the coaches.
Best of luck to all this weekend. GO BIG RED!
Just for the lulz I had a stab at making another snapshot of the men's Ivy performance list. Almost nothing changed, except Cornell improved its "prediction" in the individual track events by several points, so I won't bother posting the final tally. The snapshots have so many drawbacks anyway--nobody's going to try doubling 400/500 or 800/1000, for instance.
What really help are the actual analyses from folks like fun. and C/M. We may get those, once final declarations have been made. I hope so. OTOH they take time and effort to make--more than most seem to realize--so if we *can* get those, we should definitely count ourselves lucky and maybe show a little gratitude.
It's gonna be a great meet, I'm sure about that. I just hope Leverone has enough bleachers--last year at Harvard you had to step outside to change your mind!
Good luck, everybody. Safe travels.
I plan on waiting until the start lists are released on Friday when I post my final predictions/projections/something fun to look at.
fun. wrote:
I plan on waiting until the start lists are released on Friday when I post my final predictions/projections/something fun to look at.
I will not be available beginning tomorrow to do such an update. I can try to copy over the marks and placements that I have in my excel file so that if someone wants to update it, they are more than welcome to do so.
C/M Runner wrote:
fun. wrote:I plan on waiting until the start lists are released on Friday when I post my final predictions/projections/something fun to look at.
I will not be available beginning tomorrow to do such an update. I can try to copy over the marks and placements that I have in my excel file so that if someone wants to update it, they are more than welcome to do so.
Thanks, both. Sorry, Mary, I'm not gonna be able to update your work--I hope someone else will, but in any case thanks again!
Well, in case someone wants to update them... I only did top 8 in each event.
Event | Rank | Name | School | Mark | Points
60 | 1 | Iheukwumere, Marvellous | Columbia | 7.46 | 10
60 | 2 | Barbian, Danielle | Harvard | 7.48 | 8
60 | 3 | Collinsworth, Ashley | Harvard | 7.58 | 6
60 | 4 | Whitehorn, Kaitlin | Dartmouth | 7.6 | 4
60 | 5 | Gribbin, Mollie | Dartmouth | 7.64 | 2
60 | 6 | Piper , Gabrielle | Penn | 7.64 | 1
60 | 7 | Ali, Lydia | Penn | 7.65 | 0
60 | 8 | Jones, Adrian | Cornell | 7.66 | 0
200 | 1 | Iheukwumere, Marvellous | Columbia | 23.54 | 10
200 | 2 | Bong , Heather | Penn | 23.92 | 8
200 | 3 | Parker, Jaycee | Columbia | 24.04 | 6
200 | 4 | Woodford, Katie | Cornell | 24.15 | 4
200 | 5 | Airewele, Ebolutalese | Cornell | 24.29 | 2
200 | 6 | Scott, Gabrielle | Harvard | 24.32 | 1
200 | 7 | Meech, Jennifer | Dartmouth | 24.34 | 0
200 | 8 | Akpaete, Udeme | Cornell | 24.35 | 0
400 | 1 | Akpaete, Udeme | Cornell | 54.02 | 10
400 | 2 | Barowski, Cecilia | Princeton | 54.17 | 8
400 | 3 | Kolliesuah, Zena | Cornell | 54.19 | 6
400 | 4 | Scott, Gabrielle | Harvard | 54.48 | 4
400 | 5 | Airewele, Ebolutalese | Cornell | 54.64 | 2
400 | 6 | Krumpoch, Megan | Dartmouth | 54.92 | 1
400 | 7 | Parker, Jaycee | Columbia | 55.01 | 0
400 | 8 | Miller, Jade | Harvard | 55.15 | 0
800 | 1 | Veidis, Erika | Harvard | 2:04.69 | 10
800 | 2 | Barowski, Cecilia | Princeton | 2:06.26 | 8
800 | 3 | Krumpoch, Megan | Dartmouth | 2:06.31 | 6
800 | 4 | Bills, Trina | Columbia | 2:07.04 | 4
800 | 5 | O'Neil, Kacie | Princeton | 2:07.06 | 2
800 | 6 | Lloyd, Lauren | Cornell | 2:07.18 | 1
800 | 7 | Donovan, Margaret | Dartmouth | 2:07.68 | 0
800 | 8 | Wilkinson, Elyse | Cornell | 2:07.76 | 0
Mile | 1 | D'Agostino, Abbey | Dartmouth | 4:28.31 | 10
Mile | 2 | Renfer, Molly | Harvard | 4:40.35 | 8
Mile | 3 | Shearer, Emily | Cornell | 4:41.02 | 6
Mile | 4 | Neer, Waverly | Columbia | 4:41.92 | 4
Mile | 5 | Walsh, Lindsay | Dartmouth | 4:43.41 | 2
Mile | 6 | Vailas, Arianna | Dartmouth | 4:45.00 | 1
Mile | 7 | Carey, Anne | Columbia | 4:47.22 | 0
Mile | 8 | Sorna, Rachel | Cornell | 4:47.32 | 0
3km | 1 | D'Agostino, Abbey | Dartmouth | 8:51.91 | 10
3km | 2 | Neer, Waverly | Columbia | 9:08.72 | 8
3km | 3 | Sorna, Rachel | Cornell | 9:12.97 | 6
3km | 4 | Giordano, Dana | Dartmouth | 9:16.78 | 4
3km | 5 | de La Bruyere, Emily | Princeton | 9:26.62 | 2
3km | 6 | Caldwell, Heidi | Brown | 9:28.48 | 1
3km | 7 | Chapman, Melissa | Yale | 9:29.05 | 0
3km | 8 | Kelly, Morgan | Harvard | 9:29.49 | 0
5km | 1 | D'Agostino, Abbey | Dartmouth | 15:11.35 | 10
5km | 2 | Sorna, Rachel | Cornell | 15:53.76 | 8
5km | 3 | Neer, Waverly | Columbia | 16:01.36 | 6
5km | 4 | Caldwell, Heidi | Brown | 16:06.00 | 4
5km | 5 | Curham, Megan | Princeton | 16:20.08 | 2
5km | 6 | Chapman, Melissa | Yale | 16:22.89 | 1
5km | 7 | Kellner, Caroline | Cornell | 16:23.34 | 0
5km | 8 | Williams, Caroline | Columbia | 16:27.87 | 0
HH | 1 | Franklin, Autumne | Harvard | 8.43 | 10
HH | 2 | Piper , Gabrielle | Penn | 8.49 | 8
HH | 3 | Modesett, Jackie | Harvard | 8.58 | 6
HH | 4 | Chijioke, Iris | Columbia | 8.66 | 4
HH | 5 | DeLoach, Jordan | Brown | 8.69 | 2
HH | 6 | Miller, Jade | Harvard | 8.7 | 1
HH | 7 | Amick-Alexis, Mina | Cornell | 8.73 | 0
HH | 8 | Piper , Gabrielle | Penn | 8.74 | 0
HJ | 1 | Whitehorn, Kaitlin | Dartmouth | 1.79m | 10
HJ | 2 | Morgan, Taylor | Princeton | 1.75m | 7
HJ | 3 | Nizdil, Raegan | Harvard | 1.75m | 7
HJ | 4 | Dunchack, Janae | Dartmouth | 1.73m | 2.33
HJ | 4 | Giebelhaus, Ann | Harvard | 1.73m | 2.33
HJ | 4 | Kennedy, Theresa | Princeton | 1.73m | 2.33
HJ | 7 | Jancewicz, Noel | Penn | 1.72m |
HJ | 8 | Akande, Morayo | Brown | 1.70m |
PV | 1 | Anderson, Samantha | Princeton | 3.90m | 10
PV | 2 | Urciuoli, Emily | Yale | 3.75m | 8
PV | 3 | Centanaro, Gardenia | Columbia | 3.74m | 6
PV | 4 | Harris, Allison | Princeton | 3.71m | 4
PV | 5 | Hamscher, Brooke | Penn | 3.60m | 0.6
PV | 5 | Plesons, Marina | Dartmouth | 3.60m | 0.6
PV | 5 | Bartholomew, Alexis | Cornell | 3.60m | 0.6
PV | 5 | Brown, Stephanie | Dartmouth | 3.60m | 0.6
PV | 5 | Bishop, Eve | Cornell | 3.60m | 0.6
LJ | 1 | Parnell, Anjelique | Cornell | 6.10m | 10
LJ | 2 | Crimmins, Brienna | Brown | 5.97m | 8
LJ | 3 | Holmes, Hillary | Cornell | 5.97m | 6
LJ | 4 | Eke, Nadia | Columbia | 5.89m | 4
LJ | 5 | Gribbin, Mollie | Dartmouth | 5.84m | 2
LJ | 6 | Corley, Dominique | Cornell | 5.83m | 1
LJ | 7 | Berger, Gillian | Penn | 5.75m | 0
LJ | 8 | Parent, Teresa | Yale | 5.74m | 0
TJ | 1 | Eke, Nadia | Columbia | 13.32m | 10
TJ | 2 | Oliver, Imani | Princeton | 12.87m | 8
TJ | 3 | Jordan, Alisha | Yale | 12.30m | 6
TJ | 4 | Sonaike, Addy | Columbia | 12.25m | 4
TJ | 5 | Williams, Anna | Columbia | 12.20m | 2
TJ | 6 | Gribbin, Mollie | Dartmouth | 12.15m | 1
TJ | 7 | Holmes, Hillary | Cornell | 11.99m | 0
TJ | 8 | Holmes, Hillary | Cornell | 11.95m | 0
SP | 1 | Okwelogu, Nikki | Harvard | 15.02m | 10
SP | 2 | Darpolar, Josephine | Brown | 14.91m | 8
SP | 3 | Buhr, Victoria | Brown | 14.52m | 6
SP | 4 | Picciallo, Theresa | Penn | 14.47m | 4
SP | 5 | Berg, Emmaline | Dartmouth | 14.39m | 2
SP | 6 | Ekechukwu, Adabelle | Harvard | 14.34m | 1
SP | 7 | Johnson, Alysha | Harvard | 14.32m | 0
SP | 8 | Eason, Jessica | Brown | 13.98m | 0
WT | 1 | Ekechukwu, Adabelle | Harvard | 20.83m | 10
WT | 2 | Ratcliffe, Julia | Princeton | 19.78m | 8
WT | 3 | Darpolar, Josephine | Brown | 17.42m | 6
WT | 4 | DuPont, Taylor | Harvard | 17.05m | 4
WT | 5 | Koronios, Joanna | Columbia | 16.85m | 2
WT | 6 | Liebowitz, Cathy | Dartmouth | 16.63m | 1
WT | 7 | Wilson, Karleh | Yale | 16.53m | 0
WT | 8 | Buhr, Victoria | Brown | 16.47m | 0
Multi | 1 | Dunchack, Janae | Dartmouth | 3940 | 10
Multi | 2 | Holmes, Hillary | Cornell | 3745 | 8
Multi | 3 | Snajder, Amanda | Yale | 3658 | 6
Multi | 4 | Hansen, Madison | Harvard | 3590 | 4
Multi | 5 | Kennedy, Theresa | Princeton | 3556 | 2
Multi | 6 | Morgan, Taylor | Princeton | 3510 | 1
Multi | 7 | McKenna, Elizabeth | Princeton | 3505 | 0
Multi | 8 | Nunez, Hannah | Harvard | 3483 | 0
Is Cecelia Barowski running for Princeton? She's not listed on TFRRS, not listed on Princeton's Roster, and ran unattached in December...
Grrr...
Anyone know whether final declarations/heats have been posted? I made it up to Hanover (brrr, by the way) but haven't been able to find that info anywhere.