HALL-2:08.24

Try an analogy:

You go to a tiny rural school with 6 guys on the XC team. The team is small but each year the guys are training harder, putting in more miles every summer. Then one year a guy from the big city moves to town. He's been a running stud at some 5000 student school that wins all kinds of hardware. Suddenly this guy sets a bunch of records at your little school.

You cheer for him to win and run fast.

But,

Do you think that he represents your school the same way that the kids who grew up in the town do? Do you think he indicates that the little school has suddenly become a powerhouse? Would he inspire you as a runner as much as one of those farm kids who got his morning runs in before milking the cows?

Of course not.

My point exactly.

Or look at it this way:

Why do we have national records in the first place? Isn't it racist that we celebrate the performance of Steve Scott when we should be thinking about El G and nobody else?

Did you also support the boycott in '80?

That's the spirit, regard the guy with suspicion as an outsider, even though he clearly desires to be a part of your community. After all, he's so different, with his pair of eyes and one nose and one mouth that breathe air into two lungs and through a single four-chambered heart to set a pair of legs moving. You're damn right you should let this guy inspire you, to get you thinking about things that are much bigger than you and your pissant country town. The kind of attitude that doesn't is shared by the same pathetic fat toads taking up stool space at the local tap in that dying town 20 years down the road, telling boring stories of glory days (with apologies to the Boss).

Also, don't put much stock into what malmo has to say about ethical issues.

Food For Thought wrote:

Bottom line...American culture did not affect KK or Lagat's formative years because they didn't live here. You might want to Google formative in case you don't know what that means.

Lagat and Khannouchi found their talent after they came to America.

Lagat was a solid NCAA athlete but not great. His best NCAA finish was 4th (twice) and winning the indoor mile once.

Khannouchi was an unknown 13:41 5k runner who labored in obscurity for 2 or 3 years washing dishes in Brooklyn before his breakthrough in 1997.

Tuone Udaina wrote:

Did you also support the boycott in '80?

Non sequitur.

FIFA doesn't allow players to "switch" nationality after they've represented a country at senior-level competition. By their rules, Lagat would not be allowed to represent the US internationally. Did Khannouchi ever represent Morocco in international competition?

Make sure you know what formative means before you spout off like you know what you are talking about.

Sorry angry boy, Lagat's and Khannouchi's formative years were those first three they landed in the USA.

Ah, no. Try again.

Just curious. I put less emphasis on the nationalistic aspect of the Olympics and more on the individual athlete. Bernard was in a tough spot, and I wouldn't throw out years of hard training simply because the citizenship window came at a shitty time.

bobby e. wrote:

FIFA doesn't allow players to "switch" nationality after they've represented a country at senior-level competition. By their rules, Lagat would not be allowed to represent the US internationally. Did Khannouchi ever represent Morocco in international competition?

Khannouchi competed at the World University games in 1991 and 1993. He was the Moroccan Junior XC champ in 1990 and 1991, but Morocco didn't send a team to Worlds, and he wasn't near good enough to qualify for the Senior team.

Provincialism Survives wrote:

That's the spirit, regard the guy with suspicion as an outsider, even though he clearly desires to be a part of your community. After all, he's so different, with his pair of eyes and one nose and one mouth that breathe air into two lungs and through a single four-chambered heart to set a pair of legs moving. You're damn right you should let this guy inspire you, to get you thinking about things that are much bigger than you and your pissant country town. The kind of attitude that doesn't is shared by the same pathetic fat toads taking up stool space at the local tap in that dying town 20 years down the road, telling boring stories of glory days (with apologies to the Boss).

Also, don't put much stock into what malmo has to say about ethical issues.

Go ahead and rewrite my little story. I said I'd cheer for the guy. I just said it's more inspiring when the success happens to someone who is actually from your community.

By your logic, Jackie Robinson should not have been inspiring to African Americans in 1947 because of his background but ONLY because of his ability. No, they should have been more inspired by Bob Elliot.

Tuone Udaina wrote:

Just curious. I put less emphasis on the nationalistic aspect of the Olympics and more on the individual athlete. Bernard was in a tough spot, and I wouldn't throw out years of hard training simply because the citizenship window came at a shitty time.

Kipketer did.

Tuone Udaina wrote:

Just curious. I put less emphasis on the nationalistic aspect of the Olympics and more on the individual athlete. Bernard was in a tough spot, and I wouldn't throw out years of hard training simply because the citizenship window came at a shitty time.

He could have easily waited six months, that way Kenya wins, the USA wins, and Lagat wins.

Excuse me, Lagat only needed to wait four months. He became a citizen on May 7, 2004.

I didn't rewrite a damn thing, I just extended your attitude of not embracing him as your own, just because he got to the party late. That is your attitude, whether you care to admit it or not. My logic is lost on you if you are making such ignorant leaps regarding Jackie Robinson. Who in your scenario has lived for generations as second-class citizens, the townspeople or the newcomer and his predecessors?

Keith Stone wrote:

PreRunner wrote:

If you don't count Khalid K's 2:07 and Abdi's 2:08

and Salazar's NYC 2:08:13 which was found to be short.

Today, Ryan Hall's 2:08:24 would be the true American Born New American Record!

Let's call it the WASP record and call it a day. I figure that's what people are looking for in an "American" record anyway.

Quote of the day!!! that's f***ing hillarious, the only problem is I think Hall might be catholic, although i'm not sure