One of my favorites is that he told me “his kids were leaving Oregon (Josh was committed there after Jaxson transferred in) because they’re bringing in Virginia Tech’s coach, Ben Thomas. He doesn’t know how to coach and makes his mid-d guys run cross country.” The next year or so, Hocker and Teare were tearing up the NCAA under Thomas.
If a runner commits to a school under a certain coach, the runner has every right to pull his commitment if that coach leaves.
Hocker and Teare tearing things up has nothing to do with the Hoeys. Hocker and Teare are 1500-5k guys. XC is appropriate for them. Hocker was literally the national XC champ in high school. College XC isn't as appropriate for 800 guys.
Josh seems kinda manic. You develop the best by training smart and not getting injured.
There is a reason why one of the best middle distance guys in the modern era has been Jakob Ingebrigtsen. Also his downfall was most likely training too much even though he seems to be very particular with his intensity.
Also Almgren finally got one season where he could train healthy the whole year and he immediately managed to snag a bronze.
There’s something we’re all overlooking here, ITS THE DAD! He’s super controlling of everything! Multiple ex coaches have come out on this! I mean the guy literally built a 400m track in their backyard.
Hoey makes a lot of decisions about his training himself. I remember that it was reported that he did a high intensity workout before DL final even though it wasn't in his program.
Doing more because you lack confidence or because of mental unstability is a common problem and I don't think it has much to do with his dad. Ofc he got half of his genes from his dad who is apparently also extremely intense (and mentally unbalanced) guy.
Josh should leave pops! Move to Australia to work with Justin, enjoy the southern summer and the euro summer. Swim in that beautiful water on the easy days. Relax, the people don’t even wear shoes! Think of the freedom this kid could enjoy. Have some training partners
Leave PA, leave the country and keep running fast!
I have little doubt it’s more of his father’s meddling. In fact, no doubt at all.
On the flip side, all these doping accusations, and yet no one mentions the bizarre story of a runner who disappears for three years, starts running in March, reels off a 1:44 in his first race, then a couple of 1:43s, them a PR 1:42.16 at Nats. Completely natural. Sure. The people who accuse Hoey while believing the Brazier BS story are pathetic. They really are.
I always wondered why there was never a thread dedicated to Brazier’s all too miraculous sudden recovery and improvement, capped with a PR. This thread probably wasn’t the right place to bring that up, but I can understand why a few of you did. Hoey catches the heat while Brazier gets to smile and give the aw shucks routine common to a lot of other less than honest characters in the sport. Puzzling. Anyway, maybe you guys should create a thread, and as a side note ask why Lutkenhaus was attacked by so many while Brazier wasn’t.
I'm interested to see what now happens, and there's actually an athlete going the exact opposition direction now who could be interesting too. That is Eric Holt, who seems to have a very similar mindset/approach to Hoey (Holt's approach comes from his feeling as an underdog, and from a family/HS coach with more of a football mentality). While Holt on the Coffee Club podcast said he is making it his mission to dial back his intensity (in practice & the gym) while trusting his training, it seems Hoey is going the exact opposite way. So we'll see. I think Hoey is the bigger talent, but I could see Holt making a major step forward while Hoey regresses during the season.
Holts dad seems like to have a mentality that’s so toxic for a runner. Was shocked to hear it.
yeah one of those parents who is both a blessing and a curse: inspires a drive to succeed as an underdog but also kind of f**ks you in the head a bit for life.
honestly now that i think of it, Hoey's probably got a similar thing going on but its from a white collar background rather than Holt's blue collar one. an interesting comparison between the two.
both a tad psycho.
This post was edited 2 minutes after it was posted.
I think Hoey has the right to control his own career. After all it is his career, not Rinaldi's. Rinaldi works for him, he doesn't work for Rinaldi. Athletics careers are short and Hoey is not that young for an 800 runner. Remember, he "waited" years for his career to start before being coached by Rinaldi without anything to show for it. He doesn't want to hear "be patient" from Rinaldi. I think he knows his time is now.
Hoey wants to dope. Probably hinted at that when saying her wanted to make things more intense. Rinaldi decided it wasn’t a fit for him without needing to directly ask if Josh was going to use peds. Give credit to hoey for not doing behind Rinaldis back, getting popped and tarnishing rinaldi’s rep.
Most people will probably disagree with this. And to be fair, it might not be true but it shouldn’t be considered a crazy idea. Josh probably saw the thread about ISU’s B team doping and was like F this, everybody’s doing it. Time to level the playing field
Many athletes make the huge mistake of parting ways with a coach that has taken them to amazing highs.
I hope for his sake he hasn't made the wrong decision. Look at Dafne Schippers & Dina Asher Smith; Schippers dropped the coach (Bart Bennema) who took her from a heptathlete to 21.63 & World Champion, when she just missed Olympic gold. After than she never broke 22 seconds again. Rana Reider destroyed her career, over-working her in the weights room, and her back was fecked. She moved back to Reider but he just couldn't coach her again, her body was just too fragile, so she went to Wigert Thunnissen in 2021. She then effectively became a 11.2- 11.3 woman.
Asher-Smith left the coach that also took her to a World Championship title and sub 22 (& World bronze 2 years later), thinking she needed someone else to take her to the next level for Olympic medals. Like Schippers, she never ran sub 22 again & her 100s have gotten progressively slower.
Exactly. Th entire thing was predictable. The arrogance of entitlement does not change easily. The names that the family has churned through. I’m sure the father has something to do with it. The jump in performance was huge and Rinaldi deserves credit. Perhaps they thought he got too much? His explanation makes sense with what seems to be the Hoey mentality. I’m sure they think they can copy what they did with Rinaldi, but just add more and make it harder. More is always better when somebody is there to build you your own track and foot all the bills.
Hoey wants to dope. Probably hinted at that when saying her wanted to make things more intense. Rinaldi decided it wasn’t a fit for him without needing to directly ask if Josh was going to use peds. Give credit to hoey for not doing behind Rinaldis back, getting popped and tarnishing rinaldi’s rep.
Most people will probably disagree with this. And to be fair, it might not be true but it shouldn’t be considered a crazy idea. Josh probably saw the thread about ISU’s B team doping and was like F this, everybody’s doing it. Time to level the playing field
he improved five seconds in a year and you want to give him credit for not doping? lol
I think Hoey has the right to control his own career. After all it is his career, not Rinaldi's. Rinaldi works for him, he doesn't work for Rinaldi. Athletics careers are short and Hoey is not that young for an 800 runner. Remember, he "waited" years for his career to start before being coached by Rinaldi without anything to show for it. He doesn't want to hear "be patient" from Rinaldi. I think he knows his time is now.
Of course he has the right. And at some level, I respect his drive.
But this is just stupid. All of our greatest attributes are our greatest weaknesses.
There is a fine line in sports. Urban Meyer was a genius in the NCAA, a laughing stock within 3 months of the NFL.
I think the post about it being part of his personality is correct. It's an insecuirty. In running, less is sometimes more and more is sometimes less.
I personally think Hoey needed at least a full month off after the season. Nothing but jogging and he wants to go back to workouts?
Mix in a healthy dose of wealth and entitlement and exercise dysfunction and this is what you get. I'm sure many of us can relate to recovery being the hardest part of training. I often ran easy runs and workouts too hard. This was very common in the 90s when I was coming up. I improved dramatically in the early 2000s simply by running a bit more easy mileage and easier workouts. I was working less hard than before and running much faster. And enjoying the racing a lot more. I'd fall back into my bad patterns occasionally and that's why I needed a coach. When you're fit it's so easy to run hard...too hard. It feels good for a while and you think you're making progress. More is better! In running that's not necessarily true. All that intense speed will totally fry you. Go ask Webb and any other number of burned out runners from the 90s.
This seems like a blame the coach for the poor end to the season, then go on a rant about how you could train yourself better....pretty much feels like the end of Josh Hoey if one bad ending to a singular season is all it takes to create this reaction.