David Roche GOES HOME DEVASTATED from Western States

Ok I’ll bite.

- David charges a hefty amount for “personalized coaching” and there are dozens of his former athletes who have left due to injury or lack of any personalization. Commenting “huzzah!” after one workout and then “you are amazing” for the next is not personalized. He has hundreds of athletes, there is absolutely no way he can manage to coach them all. Especially considering the amount of time he spends promoting himself (see next point)

- David promotes himself as the best running coach out there. He’s never wrong. He sh!ts on other coaches, PT’s, MD’s, PhD’s, etc.. and promotes fringe practices that are either unproven, don’t work or are potentially unsafe. He also analyzes his viewers blood work for free. This is beyond ridiculous. I am an actual MD and this is insulting to my profession. His wife pretends to be a Doctor when she only graduated med school and never spent a day in her life treating patients.

- He promotes products from the Feed (his sponsor) shamelessly and relentlessly. He has a weird relationship with food and says he eats tons of calories and yet looks like a shriveled up skeleton. He promotes eating burgers and junk food and says it doesn’t matter what you eat when in fact this is a great way to get coronary artery disease.

- His “love everyone” bullsh!t is disgusting and fake. He is fueled by hate and spite and is completely self absorbed. He “loves you” if you join his patreon and give him kudos though. That much I’ll give him.

- He makes professional runners look douchey. Going on every podcast shouting your name until you’re blue in the face is off putting. Just shut up, train, be humble and do your talking on the trail.

- He’s 37 year old YouTube influencer. Enough said.

Don’t forget the insanely unhealthy things they promote. He was running days after the his bike accident where he was “thrown 100 feet”. Megan was riding her bike 14 days after a cesarean. They regularly do things so far out side of standard medical treatment because “their doctor” said it was ok and they listen to their bodies. when it really gets critical they trot out double doctor Megan to say what they are doing is ok and if you disagree you are a mysogonist.

Setting course records isn’t what is used to be. The new shoes make old times rather meaningless. If you want a laugh make Roche run Leadville in Anton’s minimalist shoes. You think Kilian is really 80 minutes more fit 14 years later in the twilight of his career? No.

Don't think we need another long anti-Roche thread but this first complaint isn't true. I've looked into his coaching and he is not taking on new clients. I get the impression that has been true for a while now.

The second one isn't true either. Hate him or not, he is a really successful coach in the ultra, trail and mountain worlds, which is his specialty. Just last week he had two runners, -- Christian Allen and Anna Gibson, win the Broken Arrow Ascent to make the US team for short trail. Think he had all 3 podium finishers at the US male mountain running champs last month. Also has coached Jess McClain to a lot of success lately, like 2:22 or thereabout at Boston.

I can't speak to the other stuff, but sounds like a lot of assumptions on your part. Basically an unhinged rant.

The only other thing I'll say is that on top of Leadville the guy won a Golden Ticket at Javelina, a 100-miler in 100 degree weather. Yeah it's flat, so it didn't translate to WSER, but you guys make it sound like he has no business being at WSER or running hard in hot weather. Farvard and Bouillard DNF'd yesterday and Peterman took almost 24 hours. Those guys are better than Roche. It happens. Walmsley and Kilian DNF'd their first times. Roche probably learns from this, gets another Golden Ticket and does better next time. Winning is a long shot for him but top 5 to top 10 is in play.

You guys can't separate your glee at Roche DNF'ing, or your dislike of his love-for-all comments, from a serious race analysis.

One more thing that just occurred to me. Roche beat Mogavero at Javelina by almost 10 minutes. Magavero was 4th yesterday, and was battling for 3rd to the last few miles with Kilian. So all this stuff about Roche intending to drop out or that his training is terrible is nuts. It works for him and works for the athletes he coaches, including Chris Myers who was 2nd.

Am I missing something with this thread? Seems like a good dude

I don’t have a dog in this fight but the intensity of dislike in some of these posts is really extraordinary. He clearly pushes buttons for some people.

I admire his transparency. He set an ambitious goal and didn’t make it. I’ll be pulling for him if he tries again.

I chalk it to the whiny letsrun forum trolls to be masters at hating. Y'all NEVER disappoint! SMFH!

All I am seing is opinions here. Mostly not facts. I personally(in my opinion) like seeing David in the sport. It has made things more fun and I am sure even the haters have latched on to a few things he promotes; fueling, carb #s, bi-carb, heat training, cross-training, ect.

It was actually more nauseating and self-serving than that. It was to the effect of:

"Part of being a good human is making smart decisions for your body."

The level of self delusion to think something like that, let alone say it aloud with a microphone is your face knowing thousands of people are listening, is a good summation of why they catch so much flak here and elsewhere (though mostly here).

Like honestly, get the f&ck out of here. Trying to paint your decision to DNF as proof of moral superiority is disgusting. I'll take whatever moral fiber or "good human"-ness is running through Adam Peterman's veins, essentially hiking the second half of the race home to finish in 23 hours over whatever combination of human breast milk and charlatan snake oil piss is running through the Roches.

Or literally any other person who sacked the eff up and finished the race.

Where did you read that Kilian DNF'd is first WS? In fact we was third in is first try. Just go watch the movie "Unbreakable"

Basically a lot of Letsrun posters can’t stand his gay affect due to their homophobia. They create reasons to dislike him, but really it’s just the way he talks and acts.

Western States 100 DNF! A beautiful, memorable sh*tshow

Western States 100 DNF. I tried really, really hard. It wasn’t enough.

Enough melodrama. I went all in with a pair of jacks when I needed a full house. It’s the normal ultra story of hydration mistakes causing issues that I couldn’t troubleshoot fast enough, blah blah blah. Mostly, I just didn’t have it. That compounded with unfounded health fears that I need to work through with a psychologist and possibly an exorcist.

The next day, I’m totally ok! Conceptually, I’m embarrassed on Instagram. In real life, Leo and Ollie are proud of me. “DADA RUN FAST.” Ok, buddy, you didn’t see me from Michigan Bluff to Foresthill.

And most interestingly to me, in real life at the race, the amazing people in this community seemed proud of me. I DNF’d at Foresthill and walked a half mile through the crowds so I could thank everyone for being there. I cried three times yesterday: first, up the Escarpment at 5 AM for the joy of seeing what seemed like thousands of people. Second, at the mile 34 aid station when I thought it was THE PERFECT DAY and I got a big cheer, before things went south so suddenly. Third, at Foresthill when a little girl came up and gave me a bracelet with my name on it, her mom saying that I inspire her.

Well, let’s end this journey with my final dose of maybe-too-real inspiration for her. You’re doing to fail in life. A lot. Success is basically progressively failing on bigger and bigger stages. But take the stage. The world needs your voice, even if it’s embarrassing when it cracks at exactly the wrong time. The people who matter will be proud of you no matter what.

@drmeganroche you are my hero 🧡 @run.doctor and @alexkingruns and Will Conner and @corinne_shalvoyage are the best support team in the world. Director @codybare_ is a great friend and I can’t wait to see what he does next.

And to everyone—thank you for being here as I tried to tell a real story. Your story matters. Your goals matter. You don’t need to be a champion.

You just need to be you 💙♥️💜

You're right. It has been years since I saw "Unbreakable" and my vague memory is of Kilian lying down exhausted after leading fairly late into the race. Forgot he got up and finished. He's an all-time great and I was rooting for him more than I was rooting for Roche. He's also way better than Roche, which I don't think is a controversial statement. As best as I can tell, Roche says the same.

The point stands that lots of really good runners struggle at WSER, especially the first one, and Roche's DNF isn't some badge of shame like this thread makes it out to be. His social media explanation says he thinks he blew it on hydration and just didn't have it. Fair enough. He got it right in those temperatures at Javelina, so I assume he thought his protocol from that race would translate. It also doesn't look to me like he's making "delusional" excuses like some were saying he would.

Lmfao you are just as disingenuous as roche. No wonder you’re defending him.

Killian never DNFed Western States. Gutted out a third place finish (just like yesterday) despite a tough race bis first year.

Yes, Jim DNFed after making a wrong turn at mile 92. Just slightly different from dropping at 40 like Roche did.

Another big difference? Neither of those guys blabbered about how they were going to “shock the world” on podcasts and YouTube videos for over half a year leading up to the race.

Another? Absolutely zero chance Roche has the grit to come back and redeem himself next year. This will be a one and done for him. Someone will likely break his Leadville record this year and people will barely remember him in a few years.

This is the problem for you guys

What’s the problem?

also “you guys” is a problematic moniker as it implies that everyone here is in a male identifying body

expect a major talent uptick next year in Nescac recruiting based on uncertainty and dislocation at the top academic D1s. it will have waterfall effect downstream - less spots at Stanford ND Georgetown UVA UNC UMich (all T25 academcially) will mean more talent at ivies, then more pushed down to nescac - fewer spots at top squeezes kids down the chain. Guarantee more 4:15 rising seniors and upcoming NXN qualifiers are talking with nescacs this summer..Nescac tries to do pre-reads over summer and grab the kids early. A great path imo - and much wasted talent just chasing that “D1 commit” post on insta, followed up by middling collegiate career, when a nescac D3 experience would be such a better fit for many..

whoops sorry all - landed in the wrong post :)