double threshold is the most overrated thing in running

Ok so I only read the first 2 pages, but generally agree with whoever said that Bakken's blog is not an academic study. If you're interested in double thresholds, I'm sure you agree that more volume and more 'quality' volume is better for running performance. But I'm wholly unconvinced that the best way to get more quality work in is with a double thresholds vs larger workouts with more rest or adding a small interval session the next day etc.

Maybe double threshold is the holy grail of training, but i suspect there are many ways to structure training to get the same effect

The effectiveness of double threshold training, whether in running or indoor soccer, is subjective and varies among individuals. Incorporating high-intensity interval sessions can enhance endurance and performance, but results depend on personal preferences, goals, and coaching guidance. Balancing training components and seeking expert advice are key to optimizing performance in indoor soccer.

The whole point in 'doubling' them on a day is for the sake of getting the highest volume to highest rest ratio.

You really need to try to follow the thread here. He was trying to do 4-5 quality days a week. He decided for the sake of recovery, and the minimal impact on muscular system, you could group these workouts on the same day, thus aiding in both the recovery and the stimulus at the same time.

Just look at his old schedules, insane days where he was doing 14-16 x1k at threshold. Forget the simple fact that the workout is long, but just think of the requirements for fueling for that one session that are involved and the stress and impact you have to recover from.

So 14-16ks become 2 x 10k threshold sessions. You got 2-4k more threshold work, less overall stress, and the ability to keep some specific work in your weekly schedule with no sacrifice on your threshold development

Bowerman, OAC and Kipchoge do single thresholds that are 14-16k in volume. They seem to be doing just fine with one big threshold instead of double threshold.

Yes, the Bowerman squad is known for their longevity.

OAC has already started to adopt much of the Norwegian’ model, doublr thresholds will be coming.

Kipchoge is not a track athlete at this point so a little off topic.

Double thresholds, in the context here, is for maximizing 1500-10k adaptations. A lot of different considerations and different threshold adaptions when you’re talking about the marathon.

The funny thing about the whole premise is ppl look at something they’ve never done or never done effectively and conclude ‘this is overrated’ rather than look at the modality and go ‘oh, the traditional Long Run is overrated for 5k-10k guys’

Double threshold models are showing you that the traditional 15-20 mile long run in a 5k-10k focused program is probably superfluous vis a vis the adaptions you actually need to run 3-6 miles as fast as you can

Based on what?

Spelling mistake obviously, but I am scandi;)

Regarding same thing every week, they mostly do and most Norwegians do the same. Its normal now, but 10 years ago everyone had weeks of different workouts. But why? The advantage of same week same workouts is huge. Its so easier to hit your target intensity, combine workouts with others, perfect execution etc. But its interesting, there was soo much focus on trying to have so many different variations before. Its all simpler now, and people here are at a way higher level, also the sub-elites.

They use both in Norway, but the Pro is better. Plus shows lower values than Pro and is less stabile, can't handle cold etc and more often gives incorrect readings. Go with Pro 2 if you have the chance.

From someone whos seen "new" runners start with double t early, its not something you need to wait until you have maxed out your single milage. Doubles always win. Better, less injury prone, better recovery etc. In time you'll increase your performance faster that way. Ask Malmo.

OAC does not do double thresholds. Ritz was just interviewed by Citius mag and said so himself.

Kipchoge’s coach also coaches Faith Kipyegon, the world record holder and 15 and 5. She trains similarly to Kipchoge. No double thresholds. Faith is objectively a better runner than Jakob at this point in time given Faith‘A world records and gold medals. Again, not double thresholds. One big session. Neither Faith nor Kipchoge seem to have any issues with longevity using one big threshold session.

Pro 2 read higher than Plus. Pro 2 needs less blood volume and has individually wrapped strips.

Pro 2 is probably a good .5 mmol higher per reading than the Plus and that scales a little too.

Jakob showed 12.5 on his Pro 2 the other day. That's probably a 10.0 on a Lactate +

Not really, at higher lactate the Pro shows higher. Its not the same as with treshold.

So is that not what I just said?

Lactate Pro 2 readings > Lactate Plus readings

I think I saw a comment that indicated Zatopek did double thresholds. Since he was scarcely faster than Kipyegon today that pretty much shows it isn't threshold training that explains modern performances.

Using two of the greatest athletes ever, who would probably be spectacular under either system, as the basis for your argument is probably not the best way to argue against the idea that double thresholds should be implemented broadly (i.e., for those who would not be spectacular under either system).

Noticed i said ‘will be coming’. They are already working very closely with some Norwegians through their ON collaboration, using lactate testing, etc, my guess is DT will be the next logical step in some of their progressions

And of course you can get similar results without DT but the whole point of the system to create sustainable gain’s that are measurable and manageable year after year.

I would say being able to manage stress and staying healthy to actually toe the line is very underrated part of people’s development in running more generally.

Also, doesnt Fisher have a stress fracture? One break through year, next year on the shelf.

McGorty just coming back from injury.

Not sure how Ahmed is doing this year.

Jager, Solinsky, a long list of ppl that reached very high heights and could not sustain the fitness because of injuries.

High volume? What’s high volume for a 1500 runner?