Cook and Valby's training vs Tuohy's mileage

8:53.89 to 8:54.20 - Why are you acting like a fully healthy Valby running 0.31 seconds faster against an injured Tuohy is something great?

Valby clearly had more speed training with her compared to Tuohy who was hammered with mileage, track is not the same as cross country, you do different training for track so that you run faster, Valby had that. She had 2 months of track training going into that race. Tuohy had none.

This 3k pr "who is faster" has been discussed so much on other threads and is not super relevant to the training discussion.

But since you are bringing out 'fax', here are a few more:

Valby's race was on an OT. She also interviewed about her Feb race and credited a solid block of training for her success.

Tuohy set the U20 record in her Dec race. Her Coaches shut her down after because of the injury, then she got covid and the flu, and she didn't train again until just before ACCs.

There was no pro pacer in the race, just an NC state runner.

Ceili McCabe won the race in 8:52, posting a faster 3k time than either Tuohy or Valby that season

None of this really matters because those PRs are a thing of the past.

Will also point out that the BU race was tactical compared to Valby's time trial.

Anna Camp.

She wasn't the pacer.

I did not recall Anna Camp leading that race, she sat and kicked. It was very tactical with many lead changes. The pacer was a college runner.

Dominique Clairmonte, NC state runner, was pacing.

And, as idk said, it was a tactical race. McCabe out kicked everyone in the last 100m to win.

Anna Camp got right behind Clairmonte and when she pulled off Camp led the rest of the race up until 300 to go when Tuohy passed her. It was a paced race. It was not tactical.

Camp was a competitor. Clairmont was pacing the race.

Every race is a paced race, a time trial is paced, a tactical race is paced. A time trial cannot be tactical. A tactical race can't be a time trial.

Camp is a kicker. She doesn't normally lead an entire race.

The 5000 also had two pacers and one of them Annie Rodenfels actually won the race.

Yes... And the announcers called out that Rodenfels was pacing and then decided to stay in the race. Notice that Did Not happen in the 3k race... because camp Bennet was not a pacer. She ran the race and placed 3rd.

It is known and has been talked about elsewhere on these boards that clairmonte paced the 3k.

When is everyone going to realize that there are many ways to get results. One is not better than another, although one method may be better than another for a particular athlete. If there was one magic formula, there would be no need for coaches. Time will tell who is better. That's why they run the races. These debates are fun though, aren't they?

The announcers did not call out Clairmonte either. If Camp was in it to win it she would have let Tuohy do part of the work instead of dragging her around.

Some may recall Lucas Verbicas. He was a great high school xc runner a few years back. He claimed he only ran 30 miles per week but bicycled and swam a great deal. His primary interest was triathlon. I don't know the truth but his success at triathlon would suggest he must have been doing a lot on the bike and in the pool.

Yes they did call out Clairmont and the "work she put in" when she stepped off. Who knows what camps race strategy was? That is all conjecture.

Parker Valby may currently have the faster 3000, but I think head to head I would put my money on the other runner who seems faster at both 1500 and 5000.

A lot of the mileage numbers being thrown around is a bit off....

''When it comes to training, Verzbicas certainly does a lot more than most top-tier high school runners. During the high school cross country season last fall, he ran between 40 and 50 miles per week, but he also added several hours of cycling workouts during the week and swam for two hours five nights a week. (His stepfather worked with Sandburg coach John O'Malley to develop Verzbicas' workouts in the fall.)
Out of season while working out with his tri team, he averages 16 to 18 hours of training and racing per week during the school year, and 20 to 22 hours each week during holiday breaks and summer months, often logging triple sessions. In addition to running, that usually means 100 to 125 miles on his bike and 25,000 yards in the pool.''

- Runner's World, May 2010, so a few months after his first footlocker win.

Yes, and even if one will be clearly better we don't really know if it is superior talent or superior training. I don't believe that alternative/cross training is a silver bullet. Runners and coaches have known for decades that low impact sports like swimming and cycling train considerable more (basic aerobic conditioning). I am pretty sure that in the last 50 years many runners have tried additional alternative training to gain an edge or reduce injuries. It seems to work only within limits but probably for some better than for others.

We see this also from triathletes or others. Recall the Norwegian skier Johaug running a 31:32 10k last year, this was the 11th best mark in Europe. In the German indoor CS in early 2021 a triathlete came 2nd in the women's 3000m with 8:57, admittedly that was a weak field and pandemic, so a few of the best were not running and some others not at their best but these are very respectable times.