Adam State STUNNED, US #2 places 7th in south central region, WTF happened ?!?!

No matter what the level of competition, there will be real interest, and there can be some great battles. I mean, even D I, compared to the World Cross Country Championships, can be seen in the same light as D II, when compared to D I. A podunk high school state XC championship race in a small school division in a state that never produces elite high school runners can be incredibly interesting. D III can be a blast. D II can be a blast. Etc.

I remember when my D III college basketball team my senior year played a home NCAA D III tournament game. Visiting was my roommate's high school buddy, who went to Providence College. At the time Providence was big time college b-ball, with Marvin Barnes and, I think, Ernie DiGregorio. Final Four in '73, Sweet Sixteen in '74 (when they were 28-4. I specifically remember that as my roommate and I were cheering madly after seeing "great" play by our school, my roommate's Providence pal was rolling his eyes. To him, the level of the D III action was so pathetic compared to his school, yet there were many there who were just plain thrilled at the D III competition. We won, and it was big news to advance further in the tournament.

Later, a high school tournament, maybe the states, were held in the same arena. I remember seeing the short players who were not nearly as skilled as the D II players I'd just seen on the same court days earlier. But, no doubt, it was spirited competition, on its own level. Ditto D II and D III cross country.

I was there.

The first 500 meters was covered by snow-- runners went through this portion four times (4x500 = 2000 meters=1/5 of the race). Another section of the course was also snow-packed (about 250 meter. Again 4x = 1000meters + 2000m= 3000 meters of snow in a 10k). The fastest section of the course -- slightly downhill with three turns-- got slick as the race progressed).

Adams went out conservatively (as Strava splits confirm). This may have been the race plan and not unusual for Adams State at Regionals.

Going into lap 2 of the 2500 meter loop (and hitting the snowiest section of the course) there was no movement forward by Adams.

Three possible factors:

1. Poor race plan

2. Inappropriate shoes

3. A tough field of teams racing for their seasons to continue.

At 3000m I saw concern on the face of more than one Adams State runner. It did not look like fatigue...it was concern. Their fourth man was clearly looking for a "line" and traction (I saw him move several meters sideways to get into the tracks of the lead cart.)

Did Adams take qualifying for granted? Did they underestimate the field? Did they pick the wrong shoes?

All of the above.

There is absolutely no way they went partying. Anyone who has been round Adams & Damon know that would never happen.

Was it really that Conservative if they positive split? It seems moreso they didn't have it in their legs on the day. I'm not sure this could have been cured by a "better" race plan. If they had gone out more agressively, wouldn't they have just blown up harder?

No one with a brain did. Stanford has been unable to get the job done for well over a decade now. Smart money was never on Stanford. Not saying it was on NAU - but it definitely was not on Stanford.

That is crazy to say most of their runners haven't even peaked yet after a race like that

Coaching in this Central Region for several years here is what we have seen:

2018 @ Joplin - 1 guy under 30:00 - Gidieon Kimutai (freshman year) - 29:48 -1st

2019 @ Joplin - 2 guys under 30:00 - Gidieon Kimutai (sophomore) - 29:19 - 1st

2020 - COVID

2021 @ Joplin - 7 guys under 30:00

2022 @ Joplin - 18 guys under 30:00 - Gideon Kimutai (junior) - 29:09 - 1st

Exact same course - permanent XC Course...region teams/athletes are just getting better

Oh yeah - 2023 NCAA DII Nationals XC is at .......JOPLIN - Nov. 18, 2023

Do you think the longer season has played into why we are seeing faster times at this meet?

The Joplin course is still only 6 miles

Todd344 wheeled it and said the course was long. That means more than 10k, which is more than 6 miles.

Even crazier comparing current regional times from national times in previous years. Exact same course for nationals in 2012 and 2015.

2015 - winning time of 29:24 and only 8 guys under 30 minutes. It was 38 degrees and probably 20mph winds that day. Took 30:29 to be All-American.

2012 - winning time of 28:56 and 16 guys under 30 minutes. Around 58 degrees and 10mph winds. Took 30:24 to be All-American.

Regionals this past Saturday was about 33 degrees and 14mph winds, so a little colder but not as windy as 2015. Depth of D2 is a completely different animal today.

And the increase in depth has only been more dramatic on the women's side. Look back at all american times compared to today. It's a whole other ballpark.

I ran at the Central Regional Meet in 2018 and finished in the front-mid pack. I would have finished roughly 40 spots back had I ran the exact same time this year.

Anyone else think there will there be a drop off in times in two to three years when all of the COVID redshirts fall out of the system?

Super shoes have also probably played a factor, I think most regions are faster than they typically are this one just gets a lot more notice because the course is short. When nationals is at Joplin next year probably will have multiple sub 29s Vincent Kiprop ran 29:30s and was second at nationals. Its a shoes thing/ nice weather since I doubt outside the top guy these guys could run with Kiprop.

After seeing the 10 teams that got in. Can anyone figure out who the "next 10" in order could have been?

Let me get this straight. A historically dominate team with incredible coaching experience. From the mountains of Colorado. In the most important race of the season. Didn’t know what shoes to wear? Im sorry but in the words of our Geriatric President, malarkey.

Its more so they just weren’t as good as advertised. When it came to to put on the big boy pants they flopped.

How do super shoes and springy foam work in snow and grass?