Holding back is what gives kids a chance. A 4 year old, especially boy, is going to struggle to sit through an entire day of kindergarten teaching. And being forced to start off school already behind and not ready to learn just because of some meaningless track records is crazy. There are always going to be older and younger kids in a grade but letting parents decide if their child is emotionally ready for school is the best option we have.
I am not following. You want 5 age groups atHS meets? That woukd take 5 times as long. And if we use that method, Cook isn't too old because she is born the same year as every high schooler who turned 18 last fall so you are way off base there.
No, no, sorry. Just for age based competition. Not HS.
HS competition should be as is but with an upper limit.
I'm not the one complaining about 19 year-olds setting HS records. I don't necessarily have a problem with it but as long as parents can hold their kids back this will happen. If people don't like it then we need to change the rules.
All of the apologists for 19 year old high school athletes are grasping at straws. 19 years old is OLD for high school,. End of story.
And no one is unfairly picking on Ms Cook. Remember the non-stop threads about King Ches and his age? Remember all the stuff about Lukas V being "too old!" ? Yup. And Verzbicas knew it was such a bad look that he skipped a year of high school and set his records in his third year of HS, what could have been his junior year. Imagine the outrage if he came back for a nineteen-year-old senior year, after running 8:29 ? Of course.
I had a teammate that ran 4:11 MILE [in the late eighties when that actually meant something] in high school and he started the first few months of his senior year as a 16 year old. Graduated at 17.
Franklyn Sanchez ran his 849 indoor 2-mile when he was supposedly still 16 [ i say supposedly only because he he was an immigrant and because it seems so unbelievable]. He was a senior.
German Fernandez of course ran his historic double when he was 17. Was he still 16 when he set the cross country record? [Or maybe just turned 17]
I was always one of the oldest in my class and repeated kindergarten and I started my senior year at 17 and turned 18 in the late fall. My two kids started late and are definitely close to being the oldest in their grades and neither one will touch 19, or even that close, during their senior years.
So...... being 19 is old and unnecessary. what's next, 20 year old seniors??
German was as anomalous as Cook. That’s why these threads always end up being dumb. Some posters inevitably come in and act like it’s weird to turn 18 early in senior year of high school when it is in fact extremely common. Cook’s age is not common, but if she was 4 months younger it would not be. German was not common but if he was 3 months older he would be. That’s the truth.
Cook's times are actually valuable because very few fast high schoolers make it to 19 without falling apart.
That said, I'm a male, and I turned 19 halfway through my sophomore year of college. By then, I'd already redshirted a year, and ran a season of XC at a D1. One year out of college I was even faster.
She probably started school late or got held back for whatever reason. There was a chick at our high school who was like 20 - 21 it was pretty weird she was much an adult woman with her own car and everything
Did any of you actually look up her age?? She literally JUST turned 19 about a week ago. There are a good number of HS athletes with April/spring bdays who’s parents hold them back from starting kindergarten every yearz
Turning 19 in the spring of your senior year is not that overly uncommon.
1. She is old for the grade. Not just months, like at the old end of the normal Senior spectrum, but an entire year older. So, a bit more than a year older than average or closer to 2 (1-3/4?) years older than the young end of the spectrum. This seems to be fact.
2. Although unheard of decades ago, this is not really uncommon now. Many posters have weighed in with their ages, and I am consistent with many from long ago. I was not yet 17-1/2 at graduation. Back then, parents did what they were told. If your birthday is here, you are in this grade. This has changed. Saying this different ways, most of the Board seems in agreement.
3. There doesn't seem to be any rules broken. There probably are, actually. Were the times in question run on a track with a curb or with bricks on the curves? Has she ever passed a drug test? I don't know how much T&FN as a record-keeper cares about this, but nothing counts for USATF or WA purposes without both of these. But back to the point: As far as age, no law or rule seems to be offended.
And that #3 is what interests me. Everyone older than some age seems to know that there has been a tradition of starting 1st Grade at some standard age. There still was a spectrum of ages - a 364-day spead, I suppose. Many or most turned 18 after graduation, some around this time of year, a few earlier. However:
Redshirting Kindergarten has become popular, so we now see Seniors at our heroine's age. One of the Boy's sub-4s a few years ago was significantly older than 19.
There also has always been a tradition of starting college in late summer or early fall the year of graduatiion. No law or rule required this, but decades ago, most students were probably 18 already on the first day of school, but the youngest 1/3 or maybe more turned 18 during college. In RWTB there is an 18th birthday mini-party mentioned. So what happens now?
The subject of this thread will be starting at close to 19-1/2 and doing a first track season at 20, at least for the Championship Meet. That means 23 for Senior Track, likely 24 given how common injuries are in the NCAA (do about half redshirt a season at some point?)
We know what happens when a runner from BYU is in this situation. Flamed on the Board. Vitriolic posts flew from keyboards in the wake of Mantz's last XC title. Outrage and furor filled the air. There ought to be law!
With older kidnergartners than decades ago, we will be seeing older college Seniors. Even older-yet if they redshirt. Older even still for those that don't follow the tradition of starting college soon after high school. It seems as though Mantz was the youngest on the podium this last time, so it's already happening.
Will the angry mob be just as offended when this young lady picks up NCAA titles as old as (possibly older than) Mantz was at the time of his last? Will all of you think it's just fine and point out that no NCAA rule is being broken? That's not the reaction most of you gave to Mantz.
1. She is old for the grade. Not just months, like at the old end of the normal Senior spectrum, but an entire year older. So, a bit more than a year older than average or closer to 2 (1-3/4?) years older than the young end of the spectrum. This seems to be fact.
I stopped after you got your first "fact" egregiously wrong.
It really isn't that complicated, it is because her parents decided to have a child in 2003. 2003 plus 19 is 2022. In regards to why she is a senior, it is likely because she was struggling with something in her growth educationally as a young child, and so her parents decided to hold her back. It seems that them taking care of their child has really upset you. Either that or she is faster than you, and it is difficult for you with your masculinity.
How old was old man Mantz? It can't be too long under one of these kids who goes to kindergarten at six ends up on LDS mission and is a 30 year old college "kid" with a bald spot and two children. You know it's going to happen. Probably in five years or less.
Natalie Cook is a phenomenal athlete at any age but why is a 19year old still in HS?
I turned 19 in October of my sophomore year in college. I didn’t know anyone in HS that was 19.
Turned 19 in December of my sophomore year in college.
Today, in nearly every state in the union you would have turned 19 in the fall of your Freshman year instead. Unless your parents take you to the school district and have you take special testing, you are not starting unless kindergarten unless you are 5.
No matter where the cutoff is set there will always be kids who are nearly 1 year older than the other kids, plus any kid who was held back by parents or the school would be older still.
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