Pants don't stop farts and masks don't stop viruses.....
Pants don't stop farts and masks don't stop viruses.....
Review of the Medical Literature
Here are key anchor points to the extensive scientific literature that establishes that wearing surgical masks and respirators (e.g., "N95") does not reduce the risk of contracting a verified illness:
Jacobs, J. L. et al. (2009) "Use of surgical face masks to reduce the incidence of the common cold among health care workers in Japan: A randomized controlled trial", American Journal of Infection Control, Volume 37, Issue 5, 417 - 419.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19216002
N95-masked health-care workers (HCW) were significantly more likely to experience headaches. Face mask use in HCW was not demonstrated to provide benefit in terms of cold symptoms or getting colds.
Cowling, B. et al. (2010) "Face masks to prevent transmission of influenza virus: A systematic review", Epidemiology and Infection, 138(4), 449-456. doi:10.1017/S0950268809991658
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/epidemiology-and-infection/article/face
e-masks-to-prevent-transmission-of-influenza-virus-a-systematicreview/64D368496EBDE0AFCC6639CCC9D8BC05
None of the studies reviewed showed a benefit from wearing a mask, in either HCW or community members in households (H). See summary Tables 1 and 2 therein.
bin-Reza et al. (2012) "The use of masks and respirators to prevent transmission of influenza: a systematic review of the scientific evidence", Influenza and Other Respiratory Viruses 6(4), 257-267.
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/j.1750-2659.2011.00307.x
"There were 17 eligible studies. … None of the studies established a conclusive relationship between mask ⁄ respirator use and protection against influenza infection."
Smith, J.D. et al. (2016) "Effectiveness of N95 respirators versus surgical masks in protecting health care workers from acute respiratory infection: a systematic review and meta-analysis", CMAJ Mar 2016, cmaj.150835; DOI: 10.1503/cmaj.150835
https://www.cmaj.ca/content/188/8/567
"We identified 6 clinical studies ... In the meta-analysis of the clinical studies, we found no significant difference between N95 respirators and surgical masks in associated risk of (a) laboratory-confirmed respiratory infection, (b) influenza-like illness, or (c) reported work-place absenteeism."
Offeddu, V. et al. (2017) "Effectiveness of Masks and Respirators Against Respiratory Infections in Healthcare Workers: A Systematic Review and Meta-Analysis", Clinical Infectious Diseases, Volume 65, Issue 11, 1 December 2017, Pages 1934-1942,
https://doi.org/10.1093/cid/cix681
https://academic.oup.com/cid/article/65/11/1934/4068747
Radonovich, L.J. et al. (2019) "N95 Respirators vs Medical Masks for Preventing Influenza Among Health Care Personnel: A Randomized Clinical Trial", JAMA. 2019; 322(9): 824-833. doi:10.1001/jama.2019.11645
https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/fullarticle/2749214
"Among 2862 randomized participants, 2371 completed the study and accounted for 5180 HCW-seasons. … Among outpatient health care personnel, N95 respirators vs medical masks as worn by participants in this trial resulted in no significant difference in the incidence of laboratory-confirmed influenza."
Long, Y. et al. (2020) "Effectiveness of N95 respirators versus surgical masks against influenza: A systematic review and meta‐analysis", J Evid Based Med. 2020; 1‐ 9.
https://doi.org/10.1111/jebm.12381
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/epdf/10.1111/jebm.12381
"A total of six RCTs involving 9 171 participants were included. There were no statistically significant differences in preventing laboratory‐confirmed influenza, laboratory‐confirmed respiratory viral infections, laboratory‐confirmed respiratory infection and influenza-like illness using N95 respirators and surgical masks. Meta‐analysis indicated a protective effect of N95 respirators against laboratory‐confirmed bacterial colonization (RR = 0.58, 95% CI 0.43‐0.78). The use of N95 respirators compared with surgical masks is not associated with a lower risk of laboratory‐confirmed influenza."
PrZ wrote:
^^^ Many of you will respond to my above post refusing to believe anything of the studies I included, but won't admit that they're actually legit and true. Kind of like Americans who don't believe in global warming. Their self-righteousness doesn't allow them to understand the difference between scientific facts and their own stubborn opinions.
You just posted pure quackery. There isn't a single RCT study out there that suggests masks have any use for the general population and you know it.
Try thinking please and ask the following questions:
Do used and loaded masks become sources of enhanced transmission, for the wearer and others?
Do masks become collectors and retainers of pathogens that the mask wearer would otherwise avoid when breathing without a mask?
Are large droplets captured by a mask atomized or aerolized into breathable components?
Can virions escape an evaporating droplet stuck to a mask fiber?
What are the dangers of bacterial growth on a used and loaded mask?
How do pathogen-laden droplets interact with environmental dust and aerosols captured on the mask?
What are long-term health effects such as headaches, arising from impeded breathing?
Are there negative social consequences to a masked society?
Are there negative psychological consequences to wearing a mask, as a fear-based behavioral modification?
What are the environmental consequences of mask manufacturing and disposal?
Do the masks shed fibers or substances that are harmful when inhaled?
streak wrote:
this and this wrote:
You must be a wizard. An expert in every field. A brilliant mind that has taken the time to study and research every topic for yourself. A genius. You must be able to solve any problem by yourself.
A rock star. A savant. A god. You question everything and have all the answers
Your easy run pace must be under 2:40/km and you do 100m strides under 11 seconds as you have mastered everything about running.
Please, great one, share your infinite wisdom with the world by telling us the meaning of life!
I understand this is apparently mind blowing to you, but some people are capable of thinking logically for themselves and making decisions that are not informed solely by an authority figure telling them what to do. I'm very sad for you that the idea of such a thing seems impossible. If it's any comfort, you're not alone in being so trusting and so helpless.
How many laws do you defy with your independent streak?
you must enter a username wrote:
I wanted to but was afraid it would make me look like weird.
I used public transport a lot last year (buses often packed full of filthy school children) and generally - and especially when I had a race coming up - I would be quite concerned with trying to avoid their germs. I had a race on the 15th of March and in the couple of weeks preceeding it I actually did occasionally cover my face with a scarf when on the bus when it was particularly crowded and there were people coughing. Not to avoid covid, as such, just illness in general.
My housemate also had an infectious stomach bug that he picked up doing a paediatric rotation; it had passed round amongst other students and two of the students I was with on my placement were also ill with colds/flus/possible covid at the time (one of them came in and told me 'I'm so ill').
My cousin is a paramedic and realized after wearing the mask full time at work this year that she's been sick many times in the past when she should have worn one.
I felt like I was surrounded by illness and no one cared about spreading it. I did, in fact, get a little ill before my race but it didn't stop me from getting a PR.
I'm glad now that masks are now seen as acceptable, and people are more aware of trying not to spread disease. It would be great, in my opinion, if we adopt the Eastern attitude of wearing masks when we have respiratory illness so as to reduce spreading it to other people.
Lol, does Putin moderate these boards? What a cluster of misinformation.
Allen53 wrote:
You just posted pure quackery. There isn't a single RCT study out there that suggests masks have any use for the general population and you know it.
Try thinking please and ask the following questions:
Do used and loaded masks become sources of enhanced transmission, for the wearer and others?
Do masks become collectors and retainers of pathogens that the mask wearer would otherwise avoid when breathing without a mask?
Are large droplets captured by a mask atomized or aerolized into breathable components?
Can virions escape an evaporating droplet stuck to a mask fiber?
What are the dangers of bacterial growth on a used and loaded mask?
How do pathogen-laden droplets interact with environmental dust and aerosols captured on the mask?
What are long-term health effects such as headaches, arising from impeded breathing?
Are there negative social consequences to a masked society?
Are there negative psychological consequences to wearing a mask, as a fear-based behavioral modification?
What are the environmental consequences of mask manufacturing and disposal?
Do the masks shed fibers or substances that are harmful when inhaled?
The thoughtful answers to all of your questions are that the CDC recommends social distancing, and wearing masks, when you cannot social distance, and practicing hand hygiene and disinfecting common surfaces, to slow the spread of the virus to levels that are manageable by the health care infrastructure. This is similar to most recommendations worldwide.
One model showed that even at low efficiency rates, if 80% of the public wear masks that are 60% efficient, this has enough beneficial impact on the re-infection rate to shrink the infection rates.
Here is a follow up questions for you:
How does the infection rate compare in countries where a significant minority fight for their freedom compare with countries that comply with easy to follow recommendations without all the tears?
Since the infections are worldwide, far beyond the politics of the USA, we can look at other countries and look for patterns of what works, and what fails. We see in countries that fight for their freedom to infect others is that the infection rates are high, and in countries that social distance, and wear masks, combined with personal hygiene and intelligent testing, they can and have re-opened their economies and schools safely.
You can also claim to be free thinking, and that we are the lemmings, but this idea that the government or main-stream media is lying to you seems to me to not be truly independent and free thought, but the product of years of conditioning.
what has changed? wrote:
veero wrote:
A lot of people were wearing masks prior to covid19 in Japan and China, especially during flu season. This was without any government orders or mandates.
Sure, but my question is directed at Americans who did NOT wear masks previously and have now suddenly become judgey about others' mask wearing after they themselves spent decades spreading disease mask-free.
Again COVID is more deadly than the flu, a lot more deadly. Maybe not as deadly as we initially thought, but there is a big difference between COVID and other diseases.
you must enter a username wrote:
I wanted to but was afraid it would make me look like weird.
I used public transport a lot last year (buses often packed full of filthy school children) and generally - and especially when I had a race coming up - I would be quite concerned with trying to avoid their germs. I had a race on the 15th of March and in the couple of weeks preceeding it I actually did occasionally cover my face with a scarf when on the bus when it was particularly crowded and there were people coughing. Not to avoid covid, as such, just illness in general.
My housemate also had an infectious stomach bug that he picked up doing a paediatric rotation; it had passed round amongst other students and two of the students I was with on my placement were also ill with colds/flus/possible covid at the time (one of them came in and told me 'I'm so ill').
I felt like I was surrounded by illness and no one cared about spreading it. I did, in fact, get a little ill before my race but it didn't stop me from getting a PR.
I'm glad now that masks are now seen as acceptable, and people are more aware of trying not to spread disease. It would be great, in my opinion, if we adopt the Eastern attitude of wearing masks when we have respiratory illness so as to reduce spreading it to other people.
Did you take off your scarf mask for the race?
I am glad that you feel better than others and they are the "filthy" ones, but you are pristine.
No, never wore masks. but got flu shots. and yes infectious diseases did exist, but not one that nobody had built up any immunity to nor did anyone know the infection or death rates to. So yes, something changed and people adapted.
when did wearing a mask become such a burden? The worst issue is when I forget it in my car before going into the store and I have to walk back to my parking space.
A worldwide pandemic (a massively contagious viral disease) that that kills old people didn't exist before.
So I didn't wear a mask.
ken_russel wrote:
It's easier to pull off a psyop based on a plandemic created in a lab and chemtrailed into the atmosphere when you can boost the mass-psychological effect by causing many people to wear masks (that do absolutely nothing beneficial to completely avoid contact with whatever was put into the atmosphere to begin with). They help convince people that it must be legitimate based on a variety of phenomena from group-think to over-valuing "experts" and media and government sources, which are presumed to be owned/managed by benevolent, truthful people who care about humanity, and so forth. However, the psyop was only in the planning phase prior to this year, so they weren't ready to test the limits of what the public would tolerate. But the election year made it a now-or-never situation, so here we are.
Every person in a position of expertise or any kind of influence advising for the general public to wear masks, wash hands often, and keep distance is in on some massive plan to make everyone believe that their lives are in danger? That is so so many people to have in on a massive secret that we would have surely heard about it by now.
Assuming that it is true and huge amounts of medical professionals are out to get us, the worst they could do was have us stay inside for a few months and wear some masks? That seems like a ton of work for a meager payout.
Continuing with that assumption, all governmental employees and health professionals are in on this hoax and they have been planning for years for it to happen. They have the resources to manufacture enormous amounts of a new virus, and have the ability to control most of the American population to do stuff with their huge network of medical professionals.
And then they forgot that there was an election in November.
Either that or they didn't predict that it would be somewhat divisive and controversial. So they have never studied American history beyond a fifth grade level. Sounds about right.
I understand that nothing I say will get you to change your mind about the conspiracy theory. However, it was quite the low-hanging fruit and I enjoyed pointing out the obvious holes.
cornbread fed wrote:
ken_russel wrote:
It's easier to pull off a psyop based on a plandemic created in a lab and chemtrailed into the atmosphere when you can boost the mass-psychological effect by causing many people to wear masks (that do absolutely nothing beneficial to completely avoid contact with whatever was put into the atmosphere to begin with). They help convince people that it must be legitimate based on a variety of phenomena from group-think to over-valuing "experts" and media and government sources, which are presumed to be owned/managed by benevolent, truthful people who care about humanity, and so forth. However, the psyop was only in the planning phase prior to this year, so they weren't ready to test the limits of what the public would tolerate. But the election year made it a now-or-never situation, so here we are.
You are right that it is not a hoax, but you are not correct in saying "all" and definitely "all do not agree but there is a tremendous peer pressure campaign which has started with the media. Professionals will be chastised and even lose their jobs for expressing dissenting opinions. It is the definition of fascistic rule; truth declared through intimidation and fear, and it does not take a broad conspiracy to achieve this just the right people in the right places of power and voice....then the other professionals have not choice but to comply. Declaring a conspiracy could not happen because it requires a coordinated effort by too many is wholly a lie. You need very few people. This whole pandemic scare in the beginning was initial by the disgraced professor in the UK, Johns Hopkins' Bloomberg School of Public Health (in bed with Bllomberg and also Gates) and Harvard (in bed with Gates and a 2nd rate research institution looking for more credibility); then CNN, NYT, the Wash Post, and ABC did the rest of the public bullying with very few big names needed. It is wholly possible this is a orchestrated bit of chaos from a normal corona virus....and it is worth considering and discussing the possibility in order to work towards proper answers and worldwide recovery from this nonsensical year.
Every person in a position of expertise or any kind of influence advising for the general public to wear masks, wash hands often, and keep distance is in on some massive plan to make everyone believe that their lives are in danger? That is so so many people to have in on a massive secret that we would have surely heard about it by now.
Assuming that it is true and huge amounts of medical professionals are out to get us, the worst they could do was have us stay inside for a few months and wear some masks? That seems like a ton of work for a meager payout.
Continuing with that assumption, all governmental employees and health professionals are in on this hoax and they have been planning for years for it to happen. They have the resources to manufacture enormous amounts of a new virus, and have the ability to control most of the American population to do stuff with their huge network of medical professionals.
And then they forgot that there was an election in November.
Either that or they didn't predict that it would be somewhat divisive and controversial. So they have never studied American history beyond a fifth grade level. Sounds about right.
I understand that nothing I say will get you to change your mind about the conspiracy theory. However, it was quite the low-hanging fruit and I enjoyed pointing out the obvious holes.
cornbread fed wrote:
ken_russel wrote:
It's easier to pull off a psyop based on a plandemic created in a lab and chemtrailed into the atmosphere when you can boost the mass-psychological effect by causing many people to wear masks (that do absolutely nothing beneficial to completely avoid contact with whatever was put into the atmosphere to begin with). They help convince people that it must be legitimate based on a variety of phenomena from group-think to over-valuing "experts" and media and government sources, which are presumed to be owned/managed by benevolent, truthful people who care about humanity, and so forth. However, the psyop was only in the planning phase prior to this year, so they weren't ready to test the limits of what the public would tolerate. But the election year made it a now-or-never situation, so here we are.
Every person in a position of expertise or any kind of influence advising for the general public to wear masks, wash hands often, and keep distance is in on some massive plan to make everyone believe that their lives are in danger? That is so so many people to have in on a massive secret that we would have surely heard about it by now.
Assuming that it is true and huge amounts of medical professionals are out to get us, the worst they could do was have us stay inside for a few months and wear some masks? That seems like a ton of work for a meager payout.
Continuing with that assumption, all governmental employees and health professionals are in on this hoax and they have been planning for years for it to happen. They have the resources to manufacture enormous amounts of a new virus, and have the ability to control most of the American population to do stuff with their huge network of medical professionals.
And then they forgot that there was an election in November.
Either that or they didn't predict that it would be somewhat divisive and controversial. So they have never studied American history beyond a fifth grade level. Sounds about right.
I understand that nothing I say will get you to change your mind about the conspiracy theory. However, it was quite the low-hanging fruit and I enjoyed pointing out the obvious holes.
You are right that it is not a hoax, but you are not correct in saying "all" and definitely "all do not agree but there is a tremendous peer pressure campaign which has started with the media. Professionals will be chastised and even lose their jobs for expressing dissenting opinions. It is the definition of fascistic rule; truth declared through intimidation and fear, and it does not take a broad conspiracy to achieve this just the right people in the right places of power and voice....then the other professionals have not choice but to comply. Declaring a conspiracy could not happen because it requires a coordinated effort by too many is wholly a lie. You need very few people. This whole pandemic scare in the beginning was initial by the disgraced professor in the UK, Johns Hopkins' Bloomberg School of Public Health (in bed with Bllomberg and also Gates) and Harvard (in bed with Gates and a 2nd rate research institution looking for more credibility); then CNN, NYT, the Wash Post, and ABC did the rest of the public bullying with very few big names needed. It is wholly possible this is a orchestrated bit of chaos from a normal corona virus....and it is worth considering and discussing the possibility in order to work towards proper answers and worldwide recovery from this nonsensical year.
i didn't have the possibility of having a disease with no symptoms that could hurt someone else.
But i was guilty as hell for coming to work and the gym with really bad colds. So ya i should have worn a mask back then.
lots of push on masks but not on gloves..
why are covid denial threads allowed to flourish, but threads calling out the deniers are deleted?
ga ga gai pan wrote:
why are covid denial threads allowed to flourish, but threads calling out the deniers are deleted?
Cry some more, go on.
I'm sorry these changes have you feeling terribly confused and hurt.
All covid deniers: