Gressier 3:36.01 Ostrava, pb

Hahahans wrote:

"1) Obviously his rankings this year don't mean much since most top (african) guys don't/didn't run this year. Last year he would have been 8th in the 1500 m and 10th in the 5k. This year he is only 5th in the 10km road race from what i can tell and last year he would have been 8th in the 10000 m. Obviously U18 athletes rarely run the 10k, so the rankings don't mean much.

2) I didn't make any predictions about Ingebrigtsen when he was his age, but Jakob was much faster at the same age (3:39 in the 1500 m, 13:35 in the 5k), so i see no reason to think that this guy is remotely as talented as Jakob.

3) If you call sticking to the facts being biased, then i guess i am biased ...

It is a fact that in almost 3 decades no european-born guy has won a 5k/10k medal at world level, so for every young talent the probability of winning a medal is super small."

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I didn´t state that Joel was close to Jakob. On the contrary I stated "Joel was less than 5 seconds BEHIND Jakob in the 1500m".

I don´t think it is a shame to be behind Jakob since Jakob must be the best ever European teenager over the distances from 1500m to 10km.

Pajac wrote:

Ghost1 wrote:

In July almost solo 1500 in 3:48, one pacer ...for around 1200...good job.

Almost solo with a pacer for 1200 m?

One pacer is less than many Pacers and so it is close to being solo especially if that one pacer does not deliver the goods. That is what I meant even though it may sound like nonsense.

Ghost1 wrote:

You are right about that but Jacob is the exception that might prove this rule. He is an outlier when it comes to European runners on the world stage competing with African runners. The advantage of second to none preparation, technology, and a back up system, Norge Federation. .

Actually, they don't rely on help from the federation. Not before and not now. When Henrik decided to go all in for running, his father contacted the federation. He told them he had a son who was really talentful, and needed help with coaching. The federation didn't care, so he decided to coach him himself, without any experience. As years go by and after his sucsess, the federation like to think it is much because of their "help".

They are not involved in "olympiatoppen", as most other top norwegian athletes are. Before world champs in Doha, "olympiatoppen" wanted all the athletes to do a special "climatization" program there. But as always, team Ingebrigtsens followed their own path.

The recieve a little money, but just the latest years, and now they have sponsorships of course. It was in the early days they really needed help, when the family's economy was tough, due to the kids' activities!

Typical American wrote:

harlem river blues wrote:

He most definitely does not. And more importantly, he does not have any impressive global championship results.

ummm ever heard of Matt Centrowitz?

3:30 and 13:02

13 flat*

This is mine blowing when you consider that Norwegian cross country skiers, who only garner interest in the Nordic countries and a few others, receive massive sponsorship from the Norwegian Nordic Federation making the top players multi millionaires.

It is fortunate that most Norwegians even those with very modest jobs get around €5000-€6000 per month in salary, which is about double the rate of most European developed countries. With that kind of salary the Ingebrightsen family can afford to travel and to pay for the optimum training tools. What amazes me is that the father did not really have any previous past experience in distance running and yet made himself into a self-made guru for his sons. This all goes to show that sometimes one can do it without federation help.

Typo:” mine blowing” should read “mind blowing”

They are not involved in "olympiatoppen",

Can you explain the Norwegian system of olympiatoppen? I assume those are training camps for the top Norwegian athletes to prepare for the Olympics with all the help they receive from a team of trainers, physiotherapists, sport psychologists, biomechanics experts, and the whole 9 yards.

Ghost1 wrote:

McGorty and Fisher ran 3:37/3:36 in Time trial races if I’m not mistaken. Not criticizing those two athletes because they are very strong but I think those time trial races have a distinct advantage over regular races even though the regular races also have designated rabbits. A perfect example is the race that Kincaid ran when he achieved sub 13. I doubt that he will ever have the chance to do that again and once again not criticizing or dissing those American runners because they are very good in their own right but these time trial races have a distinct advantage.

I think that if Jimmy had had the opportunity to run in a type of time trial race like that, his present times would be around 334 and 1305, McDonald’s and KFC consumption calories included.

I mean, Gressier was nowhere near the front of either race where he ran 3:36, which essentially makes those time trials for him as well. He was hanging on to the pack in both races, using the guys that were in front of him. That's basically a time trial. The BTC guys didn't have an advantage, plus they ran those times a couple months ago. If they kept training and went to Europe, they could have run faster/been fitter. BTC guys and Italy's Crippa > Gressier.

You make some good points and only time will be the judge. I still have faith in JG even though I think he is less talented compared with the Italian Crippa. Where he makes up ground is in his mental strength which is almost 2nd to none. JG has an extremely high pain tolerance ability in training and in races. Many athletes have one or the other but not the two but JG has the two.

Oh yeah for sure. Jimmy has been super impressive this summer and I'm stoked to see how much faster he will go. Plus 3:36 and 27:43 on the roads suggests very impressive range.

« Oh yeah for sure. Jimmy has been super impressive this summer and I'm stoked to see how much faster he will go. Plus 3:36 and 27:43 on the roads suggests very impressive range. »

I cannot tell whether you’re being ironic or truthful with your above statement but hopefully it is the latter. I would be interested in your assessment about long-term potential comparison between jimmy and Julien Wanders@?

Ghost1 wrote:

« Oh yeah for sure. Jimmy has been super impressive this summer and I'm stoked to see how much faster he will go. Plus 3:36 and 27:43 on the roads suggests very impressive range. »

I cannot tell whether you’re being ironic or truthful with your above statement but hopefully it is the latter. I would be interested in your assessment about long-term potential comparison between jimmy and Julien Wanders@?

Haha what? I was being serious haha, me comparing him to the BTC guys isn't saying he isn't talented or anything. I was just responding to the previous argument about time trialing.

I think him and Wanders is a tougher comparison given their different event focuses and experience. Wanders seems to be much more of a road guy and his European half marathon record at such a young age suggests a lot of marathon potential in the future. He also seems to be very inconsistent on the track and feels much more at home on the roads. Jimmy seems to have much more track speed and hasn't even run a half yet (I don't see that happening for another couple years with his 1500 improvements). I think we'll see Jimmy run a marathon at some point but the two have very different progressions. I believe that Jimmy will knock another couple seconds off of his 1500 PR in coming years and will certainly get closer to the low 13 minute mark in the 5k. Wanders could get to the low 13 minute range eventually too since he's only 24, but I think him having any major threat on the world stage would be at 10k or above; most likely above (can't see him being competitive in any sort of tactical track race). Seems like Jimmy only rarely runs a 10k too. But again, they're both young and are very different athletes with different skill sets and it'll take some time before we see them truly focusing on the same distances.

Also Jimmy has run 8:24 for the steeple and will most certainly knock some good sized chunks off of that in the future. Wanders definitely isn't athletic enough for that.

PrZ wrote:

Also Jimmy has run 8:24 for the steeple and will most certainly knock some good sized chunks off of that in the future. Wanders definitely isn't athletic enough for that.

Yes Wanders is more of a true ectomorph as he has less muscle tone which may make it difficult for him to be successful at some of the lower track distance is like 1500 m, 3000 steeple, etc...

800 Metres 1:51.57 Stadion Schützenmatte, Basel (SUI) 24 AUG 2019 982

1000 Metres 2:36.15 Lausanne (SUI) 04 MAY 2013 755

1500 Metres 3:39.30 Bern (SUI) 03 AUG 2019 1116

3000 Metres 7:43.62 Luzern (SUI) 09 JUL 2019 1154

5000 Metres 13:13.84 Stade Olympique de la Pontaise, Lausanne (SUI) 05 JUL 2019 1159

10,000 Metres 27:17.29 Hengelo (NED) 17 JUL 2019 NR 1199

5 Kilometres 13:29 Monaco (MON) 17 FEB 2019 AR, NR 1125

8 Kilometres 22:28 Bulle (SUI) 17 NOV 2018 0

10 Kilometres 27:13 Valencia (ESP) 12 JAN 2020 AR, NR 1216

Half Marathon 59:13 Ras Al Khaimah (UAE) 08 FEB 2019 AR, NR 1226

However, Julien has superior pb’s compared to Jimmy in most track events. for example, his 10,000 m track PB of 2717 is super impressive and equivalent to about 1308 which is still faster than what Jimmy would’ve ran. we can see that Julian is limited at 1500 m with his best time 339 and I’m not sure that he can improve much on that, probably not.

Everything is related. it is probably unlikely that unless Julien can run 3:35 for 1500 m he would not be a contender at 5000 m or 10,000 m in a championship race and this is the case for Julian. I think JG definitely has better fast twitch fibers for truck races. Julian, though has potential to be an Olympic marathon medalist although that event is particularly notorious for predictions in Olympic years. There are so many variables which can change the outcomes of races and next year will be no exception with probable heat and humidity present in Japan during the summer.

JG definitely has better fast twitch fibers for truck races.

Sorry for the typo, it should read “ JG definitely has better fast twitch fibers for track races.”

“There are so many variables which can change the outcomes of races and next year will be no exception with probable heat and humidity present in Japan during the summer.”

And as Julien Wanders spends most of his time training in Iten, located at around 2800 m above sea level, with a basically temperate climate I am doubtful that he would relish racing in hot and humid conditions in Japan but of course that goes for most of his competitors as well. I am not sure how adaptable he would be to hot and humid conditions or racing although his extreme ectomorphic physique would provide a certain advantage compared to stockier athletes. This is all theoretical though.

I like Foppen between all these guys. Seems more level headed and don't listen to no hip hop rapcrap. Only thing that's off-putting about Gressier and Wanders.

underwhelmed wrote:

I like Foppen between all these guys. Seems more level headed and don't listen to no hip hop rapcrap. Only thing that's off-putting about Gressier and Wanders.

You’re right, both jimmy and Julien spend a lot of time listening to hip-hop and rap. For Jimmy one can understand that perfectly as he was brought up in social housing in the north of France where there was a little opportunity for exposure to culture and sophistication. On the other hand, it is ironic that Julien has veered towards the same kind of music because he was brought up in a classic bourgeois household and both of his parents were classical musicians with one of the most famous orchestras in Geneva, Switzerland. Jimmy is pure prole in background where Julien comes from a patrician background and will never have to worry about paying the rent when his athletic career is over. He is solid Swiss upper middle class.