NEW Atlantic Region XC *2009* thread

alright. I was told recently that the course at williams is nasty and often 30-60 seconds slow. don't know if its right. but I do understand where you are coming from. doesn't mean i'm not waiting to see them rip it up at a race with regional competition.

Moses is tough to beat IF we are including one-lappers in this discussion. Obviously the Kosgei argument assumes that we are talking mid-distance and distance runners only.

Last years new England regional times are as meaningful as our Atlantic regions times, it was a mudfest. No your facts. Those guys broke 26 on a muddy rainy day, Calvin Lee couldn't on a perfect day.

NYU is 4th because all the upstate coaches are the ones who vote, and arent capable of looking at anything that isnt right in front of them. They all saw SLU in person early in the season, beat people at small shit meets.

SLU got their butt's kicked at Paul Short, NYU was right with Williams on WIlliams home course. Williams is fourth in the national poll, NYU fourth in regional poll?? These are the same coaches who kept voting Geneseo ahead of NYU the last 2 years.[/quote]

That's not the upstate coaches fault. If you're right, then the downstate coaches need to get off their duffs and contribute. 11-14 coaches vote every week. There are 50+ schools in the Atlantic Region. Shame on the 35 or so coaches who can't take 5 minutes to vote.

I also note that there are only 3 teams in the country that have both men's and women's teams ranked in the top 10: Williams, LaCrosse and Geneseo. Props to Geneseo which takes way too much grief from some of the boneheads on this "Let's Rage Rag."[quote]jerseyslowpoke wrote:

You should "know" your facts. New England regionals was actually not that muddy or rainy, I know because I was there last year. Also, one person (Kosgei broke 26, not "those guys"). In addition, NYU guys ran low 26s late September, not in middle of November when guys are rested and ready to go. Give credit where its due. NYU guys are somehow always underrated in this board. They were last year, and they proved everyone wrong by winning the Oberlin meet and placing 2nd at Regionals. They would have placed close to top 5 if it werent for all the mishaps at Nationals by their 3rd 4th 5th guys. NYU has a history of performing well late season last few years- they are for real.

whaaaat wrote:

NYU is 4th because all the upstate coaches are the ones who vote, and arent capable of looking at anything that isnt right in front of them. They all saw SLU in person early in the season, beat people at small shit meets.

SLU got their butt's kicked at Paul Short, NYU was right with Williams on WIlliams home course. Williams is fourth in the national poll, NYU fourth in regional poll?? These are the same coaches who kept voting Geneseo ahead of NYU the last 2 years.

This also contradicts the fact that TCNJ has been ranked much higher than they deserved.

CNJ has not actually performed well last few years at the end of season

TCNJ hasn't been a good team in the past few years. They were horrible last year and the year before, were lucky to get into nationals as a team. Granted they have had their fair share of injuries, but that is cross country or any sport for that matter and you have to be able to deal with that if you are a good team. Take a look at 2001. They graduated almost their whole varsity team from 2000 (Donovan, Molski, etc) and friggin won regionals in 2001 with a Frosh Guerriero, a 800m runner Zodda and Randal, who I never heard of. Don't see that happening anytime soon.

Yeah you were at new england regionals last year. You're nyu's biggest fan. What were you doing there? Give me a break you're one of their C squad runners who wore purple at SLU last November.

Message:

Yeah you were at new england regionals last year. You're nyu's biggest fan. What were you doing there? Give me a break you're one of their C squad runners who wore purple at SLU last November.

I am on this board because I am a fan of D3, and I am here to provide an accurate portrayal of what happened, not your assumptions on what happened. What was I doing out at Williams? I was cheering for my team for I am an alum. What were you doing? Cheering on your team trying to fight for the 5th-6th spot at regionals? (what this thread seems to care about the most). I got to know a few of NYU runners a couple years back and they are great bunch of guys. I am making their team heard a little bit.

As a former runner for NE region, I know how difficult the Williams course is (lot of twist and 90 degree turns). NYU had 3 guys in 26:0x and that was without Maher, their top returner. If they cant close the gap between 4th and 5th, they should be a podium team.

I only ran at Williams once, and it was a pretty damn tough course. I ran like molasses and barely broke 29, one week after a mid-27 minute race at Beaver Island. A low 26 at Williams is pretty damn impressive to me, regardless of conditions.

First off in 2007 they were 3rd in the region. I really don't think that counts as "horrible". They peaked very well and deserved their spot at nationals. I think you have your years mixed up but that doesn't really matter to much. The point is in 2004 TCNJ lost molski, donovan, etc (like you said), but they had the talent to rebound. Guerriro who ended up being a 3x All-American, Zodda who was by all means an "800 guy" but also ran 25:30s, Randal who ran 25:17 at Paul Short that year, and don't forget Kopnicki who was an All-American the next year. The point you are trying to make is that TCNJ does not have the talent to rebound after losing a lot of their key runners over the last two years. This is why I said this year is a "rebuilding" year for them. That being said I would not be surprised if they slipped into the top 5 by the end of the year. By top 5 I mean 5th...

Yeah I did get my years mixed up ha. But in regards to your post about TCNJ. They took 3rd in the region in 2007, ok. But how did they do at nats? Only Guerriero ran well that year at nats. And you speak of the 2005 team, yes Guerriero was a 3 time AA, but not that year. He was only a frosh. What did Zodda and Randal prove in 2004? Sure, Randal pretty much was their #1 up to regionals based off of their results in 2005, but what did he do in 2004? What had Zodda done in XC up to 2005? Kopnicki, sure he was AA in 2006, but he, and Randal didn't fair so well at the end of 2005. What I'm saying is, the old TCNJ teams even with huge graduation classes, injuries or sub-par performances during the year, still held their own. Look in 2005. Randal and Kopnicki, argubly their 1-2 all year long, were 5-6 runners at nationals and they STILL placed 10th. Add them in ahead of Zodda and they finish 5th or 6th most likely. Still placing 10th at 2005 nats just shows how they had the depth and talent. It seems like every 2-3 years, they get a big recruiting classes. The past 2 years, their classes have been pretty big but no results. The past TCNJ teams would have those froshies and sophs ready to roll and by juniors, running the show. Yes Bocchino and Waite ran well in track last year (Bocchino ran well in XC last year too) but what have they done for me lately? What will the team do if they do not improve or get hurt? Face it, yes TCNJ is in a rebuilding year, but they are not that good of a team currently either.

sux wrote:

What I'm saying is, the old TCNJ teams even with huge graduation classes, injuries or sub-par performances during the year, still held their own.

You said it yourself.

For the most part I'm agreeing with you. They are obviously suffering from a year or two of down recruiting years, but then again sometimes you don't get what you recruit. I'm pretty sure they only have one senior in the top 7 right now, and when you throw in Yersak (second returner time wise) there could be no seniors. Add in what looks to be a pretty solid freshmen class this year in Hendrickson and Hernberg, and it looks like we very well might see a more competitive TCNJ in the next year or two. We will see though.

1.Cortland

2.Geneseo

3.NYU

4.SLU

5.TCNJ

6.Plattsburg

7.RIT

8.Rochester

Someone has to give some love to TCNJ on this board...

I hate to break it to you but they got hammered by ithaca.

rgagagrsggag wrote:

I hate to break it to you but they got hammered by ithaca.

Does anyone know if Ithaca & Rochester will run their "A" squads at Hamilton this weekend? This could be a good match up.

Who's going go cortland this weekend?

TCNJ has had decent recruiting classes. Usually they do not get NJ blue chippers, but turn them into really good college runners. They have had 2 pretty big back to back recruiting classes. You are going to tell me that the froshies and sophs now, none of them are good? The 2 froshies this year are running well. But only one good soph, who isn't even running as he is hurt? I am sure in those 2 classes, there are some talented runners; TCNJ always recruits talented runners top to bottom. The old TCNJ teams would not be affected this badly. This is why I am shocked that the past few seasons, they have not done well at all. They would have the talent as you stated, to back up any injury or inconsistent running. Something tells me the coach is not getting the best out of his current runners. Bocchino is their #1 and he isn't running that well right now either. If your #1 is struggling, then your whole team is going to struggle.