they don't care, they are no longer selling themselves to runners. they are competing for the same crowd as Dean K. and Goggins. at least Dean K finished WS.
No kidding. Go ask Claude or any AI if AG1 and nasal strips are scientifically proven to help running etc.
David is now shilling a new 12-week marathon plan on his socials. I think I will pass.
I've never fully understood how this guy became a coach. He didn't study exercise science..he's a lawyer. I know you can become a certified coach pretty easily..on paper.. but that doesn't make you a good coach..far from it. It feels like he tries to attach himself to up and coming talents in the sport and then claim their victory as the fruit of his coaching. Everything he does is fueled by his narcissism.
I love how the mods deleted the Seth DeMoor threads, and are now actively deleting any posts regarding Matt Fox, yet this thread that's going around in circles is allowed to remain.
David is now shilling a new 12-week marathon plan on his socials. I think I will pass.
I've never fully understood how this guy became a coach. He didn't study exercise science..he's a lawyer. I know you can become a certified coach pretty easily..on paper.. but that doesn't make you a good coach..far from it. It feels like he tries to attach himself to up and coming talents in the sport and then claim their victory as the fruit of his coaching. Everything he does is fueled by his narcissism.
Look how far his training theory got him at WS… all the way to forest hill! I mean I’m no coach but something tells me the best way to train for a trail race is to… run on trails?
Look how far his training theory got him at WS… all the way to forest hill! I mean I’m no coach but something tells me the best way to train for a trail race is to… run on trails?
And most predicted his whacko training would get him somewhere between Michigan bluff and forest hill.
David is now shilling a new 12-week marathon plan on his socials. I think I will pass.
what a tool.
and ridiculous megs even suggested that he'd be 'close to a 2:09'.
yeah maybe if he went out and ran a legit 62min half we could be talking about that. but he never does that!
how's the "sub 4-min mile fitness" coming along?
total joke of a couple...it's like they've fully deployed the "48 laws of power" and want to "win friends and influence people". the reality is SWAP is run like a cult so they can get more attention to feed their narcissism
Good post, I think Roche is probably around a 70-minute runner for 21.1k.
and ridiculous megs even suggested that he'd be 'close to a 2:09'.
yeah maybe if he went out and ran a legit 62min half we could be talking about that. but he never does that!
how's the "sub 4-min mile fitness" coming along?
total joke of a couple...it's like they've fully deployed the "48 laws of power" and want to "win friends and influence people". the reality is SWAP is run like a cult so they can get more attention to feed their narcissism
Good post, I think Roche is probably around a 70-minute runner for 21.1k.
i'd actually give him more like a 67-68min for a half at sea level. of course he'd have the best supershoes available on
the guy certainly has a lot of talent and probably a high vo2
but that is nowhere close to a 2:09 marathon performance. he'd be lucky to break 2:20
just like I think he could probably run a 4:20s something mile. and that is nowhere close to a "sub 4". it's an insult to all those that have run sub 4 in the mile to claim "that kind of fitness" because you did a couple 400m rep workouts in 65
which makes all his and megs claims even more ridiculous imo. he doesn't race certified road courses or track events really and has no experience and prs from racing those. he hides on his Wahoo treadmill and tries to take down weak strava segments to claim new "fkts". this is a guy that records strava runs on his iphone instead of the many $500 gps watches that he likely owns so he can boost his pace and mileage by an extra 10% and it's likely megs also "cheats on zwift"
how did he get into coaching? he read a few books, listened to a few podcasts, read some abstracts from a few research studies and then splits out what he reads (like a "good lawyer" would do) but then he also has seemed to take cues from a lot of cult leaders
no doubt the roches have high IQs and are quite book smart. they know how to manipulate and suck up to just enough of a critical mass of people to capitalize on their weak egos and how gullible they are to flattery
but i'm glad this thread exists because it finally shows that some of us are smart enough to see right through all their bs and finally call it out
the reality is SWAP is run like a cult so they can get more attention to feed their narcissism
"Let’s be clear: if your idea of a cult is a couple who celebrate vulnerability, publish their training philosophy openly, and answer coaching emails with more love than judgment … you may be confusing 'cult' with 'group chat you weren’t invited to.'
And yes—David Roche is a lawyer who became a running coach. That’s not sinister. That’s someone who changed careers and then helped hundreds of people run faster, healthier, and happier. If anything, it’s unusually wholesome.
But if you’ve grown up around brittle masculinity, weaponised cynicism, or coaching defined by fear and shame, then yeah—joy might look suspicious. Support might feel fake. Decency might seem like a trick.
It’s easier to call it brainwashing than to admit you’re uncomfortable with hope.
Because what if community isn’t a con? What if people actually care about each other? What if sincerity isn’t a front, but the whole point?"
the reality is SWAP is run like a cult so they can get more attention to feed their narcissism
"Let’s be clear: if your idea of a cult is a couple who celebrate vulnerability, publish their training philosophy openly, and answer coaching emails with more love than judgment … you may be confusing 'cult' with 'group chat you weren’t invited to.'
And yes—David Roche is a lawyer who became a running coach. That’s not sinister. That’s someone who changed careers and then helped hundreds of people run faster, healthier, and happier. If anything, it’s unusually wholesome.
But if you’ve grown up around brittle masculinity, weaponised cynicism, or coaching defined by fear and shame, then yeah—joy might look suspicious. Support might feel fake. Decency might seem like a trick.
It’s easier to call it brainwashing than to admit you’re uncomfortable with hope.
Because what if community isn’t a con? What if people actually care about each other? What if sincerity isn’t a front, but the whole point?"
What if you stopped hiding behind a chatbot and addressed your critics like an adult?
Megan goes out today and runs 7:30 for 10 miles on the flats and makes the conscious decision to hide her heart rate data from Strava. "Flowing to podcasts on country roads" she says. No I think you were running lights out and don't want your followers to see how hard of an effort it was. These two are made for each other.
Megan goes out today and runs 7:30 for 10 miles on the flats and makes the conscious decision to hide her heart rate data from Strava. "Flowing to podcasts on country roads" she says. No I think you were running lights out and don't want your followers to see how hard of an effort it was. These two are made for each other.
She made sure to get her “pro” tag on Strava too, whatever that means…
Good post, I think Roche is probably around a 70-minute runner for 21.1k.
i'd actually give him more like a 67-68min for a half at sea level. of course he'd have the best supershoes available on
the guy certainly has a lot of talent and probably a high vo2
but that is nowhere close to a 2:09 marathon performance. he'd be lucky to break 2:20
just like I think he could probably run a 4:20s something mile. and that is nowhere close to a "sub 4". it's an insult to all those that have run sub 4 in the mile to claim "that kind of fitness" because you did a couple 400m rep workouts in 65
which makes all his and megs claims even more ridiculous imo. he doesn't race certified road courses or track events really and has no experience and prs from racing those. he hides on his Wahoo treadmill and tries to take down weak strava segments to claim new "fkts". this is a guy that records strava runs on his iphone instead of the many $500 gps watches that he likely owns so he can boost his pace and mileage by an extra 10% and it's likely megs also "cheats on zwift"
how did he get into coaching? he read a few books, listened to a few podcasts, read some abstracts from a few research studies and then splits out what he reads (like a "good lawyer" would do) but then he also has seemed to take cues from a lot of cult leaders
no doubt the roches have high IQs and are quite book smart. they know how to manipulate and suck up to just enough of a critical mass of people to capitalize on their weak egos and how gullible they are to flattery
but i'm glad this thread exists because it finally shows that some of us are smart enough to see right through all their bs and finally call it out
The guy won a Golden Ticket race in October. Think what you want, but you're not "ultra experienced" if you think he is a fraud as a runner who spends all his time on a treadmill and taking down weak strava segments.
the reality is SWAP is run like a cult so they can get more attention to feed their narcissism
"Let’s be clear: if your idea of a cult is a couple who celebrate vulnerability, publish their training philosophy openly, and answer coaching emails with more love than judgment … you may be confusing 'cult' with 'group chat you weren’t invited to.'
And yes—David Roche is a lawyer who became a running coach. That’s not sinister. That’s someone who changed careers and then helped hundreds of people run faster, healthier, and happier. If anything, it’s unusually wholesome.
But if you’ve grown up around brittle masculinity, weaponised cynicism, or coaching defined by fear and shame, then yeah—joy might look suspicious. Support might feel fake. Decency might seem like a trick.
It’s easier to call it brainwashing than to admit you’re uncomfortable with hope.
Because what if community isn’t a con? What if people actually care about each other? What if sincerity isn’t a front, but the whole point?"
Now provide the science behind AG1, nasal strips, etc. for running? is it community or snake oil. never mind, we can all just ask Claude or chatgpt to avoid the cherry picking you are apt to use with claude and detailed prompts.
The guy won a Golden Ticket race in October. Think what you want, but you're not "ultra experienced" if you think he is a fraud as a runner who spends all his time on a treadmill and taking down weak strava segments.
Stop saying “Golden Ticket” like it means anything
“David Roche did not finish the 2025 Western States 100 - he had a DNF (Did Not Finish). The search results confirm "Roche DNF" and indicate he "GOES HOME DEVASTATED from Western States"”
“David Roche did not finish the 2025 Western States 100 - he had a DNF (Did Not Finish). The search results confirm "Roche DNF" and indicate he "GOES HOME DEVASTATED from Western States"”
lol
Hey ChatGPT, how fast could David run a mile? “Mile Time Estimate: If David Roche were to specifically train for a fast mile, and assuming no major health limitations: 🏃 Estimated all-out mile time: 4:20 to 4:30 That’s consistent with high-level collegiate runners and sub-elite road racers. If he’s not in peak track shape or isn’t prioritizing speed, he might be more in the 4:35–4:45 range.”
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