Road Racing and Training Thread - Week Ending 10/27/19

Staying up until 1 a.m. on weeknights idly sipping beers because baseball and barely doing any running is like VaporFlys for my RHR.

Time to get back on that grind baby.

Well, I'm back to the thread. I've lurked for weeks, but honestly have failed to post mainly because I can't keep up with all the great performances.

I've been grinding out 65-70 mile weeks, and have a Half Marathon Sunday. It has been 6 years since I toed the line healthy and in shape, so I'm very nervous.

Key workouts in the past month:

3/2/1: 1615, 1025, 458 (1k jog rest)

Solo 5k TT: 15:54

8 mile "true" tempo, 544 pace

Rolling Ks, 2k medium, 1k HM effort, repeat. 3530 overall for 10k.

hard/medium 400s for 5k, averaging 75 for the hards, 88 for the mediums

I've only had 6 long runs over 14 miles, but they're all in the past 8 weeks. My HM PR is 113:19, and all signs point to crushing that...however, I'm nervous to go out any faster than 540 pace.

Sub 6:00's marathon makes me think I can pop a 70high-71low, but I'm nervous....thoughts?

BDubs, It's good to be nervous. Helps you run faster.

Based off your workouts and MPW but not knowing all the details I'd say "Go for it!"

Based off the 3/2/1, the 5kTT, rolling K's and the 400's I'd say 70-71 is a good target.

The only thing I'd worry about is the 8 mile tempo @ 5:44 pace. I struggle at the meaning of tempo though and think everyone views them a little differently so that is probably just a misunderstanding. If you felt you were not racing the tempo then once again "Go for it!"

Some comments before I get to my week, it's been a crazy one traveling all over the country, hence the terrible timing... what day is it... FRIDAY?!?!

jq - Nice easy week... PUMPED to see how you do this weekend. Crush it man. Good luck.

NiceGuy - Solid week, congrats on mileage PR.

slo - Indy is in so much trouble.

Coach J - awesome Sunday workout. Your workouts seem to have really progressed even from your last marathon cycle. Do you attribute that to increased fitness or change in training philosophy. I feel like it's probably both, but either way, think it sets you up for a great time at Taipei.

rrr - Heal Heal Heal. Sending positive vibes. Drugs will help (doctor prescribed... your doctor prescribed)

GT - good week, I get the travel fatigue. Sometimes, it's a day off that helps you advance the fitness.

aj - epic quote. All signs point to Indy.

Stone - Great workouts.

OR - nice week, and probably a good thing to take a day off. We all need them.

stat - your quality is simply awesome. those 1ks looked strong. I know that Saturday race has a nice little bump in there... nice race. And then to follow that up with a 17 miler the next day... geez man, run a marathon already.

RunnerSam - been missing the crew at the track, might try and make it out this week. Work has just gotten a bit nuts. I'm trying to work to incorporate hills and strides as well. Just think there are so many benefits for what seems like such little effort. However, when I try to incorporate them... seems like a lot of effort.

In comment to the beers = high HR comments... YUP. Who needs a low heart rate... I'd rather have a beer.

Two more posts coming... last week for me, and leaderboard.

**Updates** - Added to the list - drcrusher - 72.2% in a HM; THOUGHTSLEADER - 69.52% in a Marathon

92.88% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:03:41 Name: Bird502

92.88% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 61 Event: 8K Time: 00:28:19 Name: Coyote Montane

90.59% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 3K Time: 00:09:29 Name: Urban Diesel

89.32% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: MA Time: 02:30:44 Name: Smoove

87.46% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:16:53 Name: Runn3grl123

86.93% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:15:26 Name: Bdubs

86.91% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:14:31 Name: LongWayFromHome

86.49% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 45 Event: 1M Time: 00:05:25 Name: darkwave

85.46% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 38 Event: 5K Time: 00:15:49 Name: slo-twitch

85.27% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 3K Time: 00:08:38 Name: krishna

85.18% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:17:19 Name: outsiderunner

85.10% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 35 Event: MA Time: 02:25:12 Name: Sub 6:00

84.86% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:15:38 Name: GNR1

84.62% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:34:21 Name: th3bt

84.43% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:32:13 Name: Jewbacca

83.56% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:10:54 Name: Andy Dufresne

83.40% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:35:23 Name: th3bt

83.10% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 4M Time: 00:22:41 Name: Napper

82.66% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:15:30 Name: HHH

82.62% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:34:37 Name: Bruin1996

82.55% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:16:43 Name: Stone Cutter

80.31% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 25 Event: 5K Time: 00:16:10 Name: Jot quill

80.09% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: MA Time: 02:40:11 Name: team1

80.07% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 1M Time: 00:04:38 Name: pewow

79.88% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:34:38 Name: 3283823

79.29% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 36 Event: 5K Time: 00:16:49 Name: LancRunner

79.26% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 39 Event: HM Time: 01:15:17 Name: angryjohnny

78.97% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 32 Event: 5K Time: 00:16:34 Name: Gordon Tremeshko

78.88% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 36 Event: 5K Time: 00:16:44 Name: runrincerepeat

78.75% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: MA Time: 02:57:06 Name: Still Improving

78.56% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:16:33 Name: hantph96

77.85% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:34:19 Name: DietBacon

77.60% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:16:49 Name: Guy Broman

76.49% - Date: 09/06/2019 Age: 25 Event: 5K Time: 00:16:58 Name: RunnerSam

75.65% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:17:15 Name: Jeremy

75.43% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:17:30 Name: Tall dark roast

75.02% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:18:17 Name: dirtroadSC

74.95% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:17:42 Name: MikeG83

73.87% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:21:50 Name: Working Harder

72.76% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:20:16 Name: NYCHalf

72.53% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10M Time: 00:60:40 Name: RunJaymes

72.20% - Date: 10/20/2019 Age: 42 Event: HM Time: 01:34:44 Name: drcrusher

71.53% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:18:09 Name: James Corden

71.02% - Date: 10/06/2019 Age: 51 Event: 10K Time: 00:42:40 Name: Coach Jeff

70.94% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:25:52 Name: BHViking

70.65% - Date: 02/03/2019 Age: 31 Event: 10K Time: 00:39:14 Name: Cocoon

69.79% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: 33 Event: MA Time: 02:56:22 Name: RunGuy Midwest

69.52% - Date: 10/20/2019 Age: 31 Event: MA Time: 02:56:52 Name: THOUGHTSLEADER

68.93% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:25:57 Name: Runningforfun

68.38% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: HM Time: 01:25:23 Name: KidB

67.10% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:39:49 Name: SOBO

67.02% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 10K Time: 00:39:52 Name: PutoMiudo

65.72% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: MA Time: 03:08:34 Name: LebanonHills

64.24% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: .5M Time: 00:02:37 Name: JamesTheAmateur

64.14% - Date: 10/08/2019 Age: ? Event: 5K Time: 00:21:59 Name: going faster miles an hour

As for my week last week (seems so long ago, but hey, will post)

M/36/145/6'

PRs - 16:49 5k

Goals - Turkey Day (gobble gobble MFers), followed by XC race, followed by club XC (maybe...)

Last week was a good one.

M - 8 miles at 7:20 - Easy Pace

Tu - AM - 4 miles at 7:19 - Easy

Tu - PM - 2 WU, 10 min T, 8x30sec Hills, 10 min T, 2 CD - T pace about 558 on first 10, 545 on second 10. Hills were a sprint, and hurt.

W - 8 miles at 7:23 - Easy

Th - 6.5 at 7:25 - Easy (feeling effects of flu shot day prior... ugh)

F - 2 up, 6x1k, 3 down - Ks at 3:19.4, 3:19.3, 3:19.2, 3:19.1, 3:19.2, 3:18.3 - probably the most even workout I've EVER done... hence showing off down to the tenth of a second...

Sa - 5 miles at 7:14

Su - 12 miles at 7:14

Really good week. I liked the Threshold - Hills - Threshold workout. Something different, and definitely left me feeling beat and like it was a good stimulus. Anyone know if that kind of workout is really good for something specific? I just liked the change of pace and the pushing through on the last 10 min T effort.

The 1ks were in a bit of wind and solo. Legs felt tired, but pushed through these and was rewarded with crazy even splits. Was looking to be around 3:20, so that was encouraging.

Excited for NYC marathon weekend. JQ is gonna kill it.

RRR - Hah. Yeah, going to try to use the end of DST to get back into my morning routine. Tendons and knee are healthy enough to start doing some moderate mileage. Glad to see you’re on track to grit through Indy.

Bdubs - With those workouts (the 5k and 3/2/1 are the clearest references for me) I’d agree with Pappy. Don’t let the nerves draw you out in 5:10, but don’t undersell yourself and hold back too much.

Bdubs- good to hear from you. I just ran a 1:10-high and I think you're in better shape than me. The 8 mile "tempo" is going to feel hard even if it's really more like marathon pace. 4 x 2 is more of a half marathon pace indicator for me. I don't know the course/conditions/competition that you'll be dealing with, but compared to other distances, I've found the half to be a relatively forgiving distance even if you blow up... Be that as it may, an even to negative split might be your best bet. I'd probably take it out at 5:30 and try to pick it up from there. Stay beastly

legendre wrote:

Bruin1996 wrote:

Long Beach Half Marathon 1:15:14 PR

Splits: 5:45, 5:44, 5:40, 5:48, 5:41, 5:39, 5:42, 5:45, 5:48, 5:42, 5:43, 5:35, 5:30, 5:01 (last 0.2

I felt I ran a fairly evenly paced race with a fast finish but probably did not run the tangents optimally as I ran 13.24 miles according to my GPS/Stryd footpod.

@Bruin: Congrats for the HM PR! Impressive how many quality work you manage to do on 90+ mpw.

I was wondering if you used Stryd to help with pacing?

I find that Stryd won't give you perfect distance but main benefit is huge consistency. Previous version I had overestimated distance by 1-2%, current one underestimates around 1%. But it's much more consistent than GPS.

I use Stryd for distance / pace but it takes some work to get it right. First off, there are only a few watches that actually report Stryd's distance / pace while leaving GPS on for the maps. I have a Forerunner 935 and this is one of the few that does it. Even then, you have to go into settings and set the footpod to "Distance - Always" and "Pace - Always". If your watch doesn't support that, then you have to turn off GPS, thus losing your pretty maps and flybys on Strava.

Then, you need to set the calibration factor to offset your 1 or 2% error. Once that is dialed in, you are GOLDEN. The consistency and accuracy is then second to none. To calibrate it, I came up with my own procedure. I basically ran directly on a line at a track. I did the math to calculate the length of each line because it's easier to follow a line than 20 cm off the inside line in Lane 1 (400 m). Plus there could be the dreaded Lane 1 walkers getting in the way. If you follow the line between Lane 1 and 2 it's 406.4 m, the line between Lane 2 and 3 is 414.1 m and so on. Basically, I ran on a line where no one was in the way for 60 minutes and hit the lap button each time around. I wanted each lap measured in case I lost focus and veered off the line (I would throw that lap out). I now had a measured distance versus an actual distance. There is your calibration factor.

LancRunner wrote:

70.65% - Date: 02/03/2019 Age: 31 Event: 10K Time: 00:39:14 Name: Cocoon

Minor update - I am 40 years old right now, going to be 41 in 2 months. Wish I was still 31 though, or maybe not - as I was a 242 pound sumo wrester at that age :). 242 pounds at 5'6" is not a pretty sight!

A few more comments for this week:

Really looking forward to running CIM.. anyone planning a meetup of any sort?

By the way, is anyone else going to 2020 London for the Abbott World Marathon Majors Age Group World Championships?

Drcrusher: Nice week of recovery from your half marathon race. Enjoy your taper before the Philly Marathon.

Cocoon: Nice week of training. I hope your left hip flexor recovers fully. I totally agree that optimizing your weight will be a significant help getting you to your sub-3 goals.

Coyote Montane: Enjoy your well deserved break from running and hope to see you back training when you are fully recovered from that SI joint injury.

RunnerSam: Nice week of training and solid 3 mile tempo run.

Napper: Congratulations on getting that sub-2:40. Nice week of training with a very solid 10K treadmill tempo and the long run.

Legendre: Thanks.. I sometimes wonder if I am on the verge of overtraining doing Orange Theory plus the Hanson’s workouts but so far things seem to be OK. I use Stryd mainly to get more accuracy with my treadmill run distance. I do try to run with all of my races following a certain pacing strategy (so perhaps the Stryd does help with that?) until the very end (I am constantly looking at my watch to see my pace as I don’t have the skill to run by feel).

Bdubs: Welcome back to the thread. You crushed it on your 5K time trial and good luck on your half marathon.

LancRunner: Nice super consistent 6x1000 workout. That is how you are supposed to run a workout.

Please update my top AG result in your leaderboard. I ran a 33:59 as a 44 year old which gets me a 84.16% using the 2015 grading factors. Thanks!

BHViking: Thanks for the advice about using Stryd for always distance and pace tracking. I will try that out now as I have a Garmin 935 as well. I am going to try to calibrate my Stryd by running on a track to improve the accuracy as you suggested.

LancRunner: That was a 33:59 10K race by the way. Thanks!

Late-week pop in. Looks like we have a lot of folks at Indy next week. Slo, I'm looking forward to your sub-2:30 report.

Last week I did alright with lifting and getting on the elliptical (~20 Smoove Aerobic Units), but I haven't done a thing this week. A stomach bug went through me and my kids over the weekend, and after recovering the rest of this week has been busy with closing on our new house. Today was the first day I had time for a workout, and I'll be honest. I chose the lazy road and skipped it. We move next week, so I expect my schedule to smooth out quite a bit. The commute will drop from 45 minutes to 15.

The posterior tib is still giving me mixed signals. I didn't feel it for maybe 2 weeks, but then this week it seems to be there. I was going to start up 5-min daily jogs today, but I'm thinking I'll hold off a little longer. I'm already fat and out of shape. Might as well make sure it's healthy before jumping back in.

As far as the Crohn's... doc has me tapering off the roids and it all feels okay. He wants to snip out a bit of small intestine he doesn't like. Have some big decisions to make there in the near future. I'm kind of fond of my bowels... On the plus side, if we go that route the recovery isn't terrible. It might fit in nicely after the next marathon.

Oof Jewbacca - that is a hard call. I've heard about that surgery (fortunately, I'm nowhere near being a candidate) - my concern with it for a marathoner would be whether the loss of that bit of intestine would reduce one's ability to absorb nutrition when running hard.

Bruin - congrats on the WMM age group thing. I'll confess that I half forgot/half decided not to nominate myself for it. I'd love to do London (and this seems the best way to get in, IF I got in), but taking enough time off work to travel overseas was going to be tricky.

Jot Quill - good luck this weekend!!!!

Quick R3 update. Ran today ..after running wed and doing elliptical on Thurs .. I was 100% better than on wed during and post run. So I’m thinking I could be 85-90% by Indy. So a lot more optimistic than the first of the week.

The issue now is mainly everything in the glutes and lower back area is extremely sore and tight. So stretching it back out on runs gradually. And lots of foam rolling etc. living on the roller. Judging from last summer when I had to take the same stuff for it I am on trend to be doing pretty well by the middle of next week. Fingers crossed. Would love to be able to get a couple miles in at race pace on Mon or Tues. we shall see. Been staying sane by lifting to much.

Thank you everyone one the well wishes for NYC!

Haven't been too active in the thread this week due to work travels, but have been reading to keep up!

I don't feel fantastic but I don't feel too terrible -- all that matters is how I feel at the start line anyway I suppose :p.

jot quill wrote:

Thank you everyone one the well wishes for NYC!

Haven't been too active in the thread this week due to work travels, but have been reading to keep up!

I don't feel fantastic but I don't feel too terrible -- all that matters is how I feel at the start line anyway I suppose :p.

Nothing wrong with being a bit of a mess in the days leading up to a big race. When you get to the corral, just remember all you did to get there and smile.

Post a bib # for the folks at home to follow along?

Thanks! Good reminders... just got to show up.

1206 for any folks that want to follow, thanks a million in advance for all the support!

Jitters are coming in hot!