Arcadia Boys 3200

beezy wrote:

Anybody know what the standard to get into the invitational section of the 3200 was?

2004 was a 2-mile as well.

Men 2 Mile Run Invit'l

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Name Year School Finals

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1 Bumbalough, Andrew 11 Brentwood Acad 8:49.87

2 Kiptoo, Shadrack La Cueva High, N 8:52.56

3 Ghebray, Yosef 11 Logan HS 8:55.52

4 Garber, Evan 12 Spokane Mead (Wa 8:58.03

5 Kinsella, David Inglemoor (Wa) 8:58.74

6 Wissel, Colby 12 Kearney High,Neb 8:58.95

7 Mix, Hari 12 Albemarle HS 9:00.32

8 Hampton, Charles 12 Brophy College P,Sc 9:02.90

9 Cardenas, Jonathon 12 Reno HS (Nv) 9:02.96

10 Hutchins, Nick 12 Millbrook High S 9:03.20

11 Scheid, Justin 12 Pope John Xxiii 9:03.73

12 DeVries, Hakon 12 John Jay (Ny) 9:04.84

13 McLeod, Timothy 11 Episcopal FL 9:06.77

14 Wyatt, Tom 12 Charles Wright 9:08.72

15 Wagnew, Babey 12 Helix HS 9:11.39

16 Shackleton, Kyle 12 Carlmont HS 9:12.92

17 Winter, Chris 12 Handsworth Highs 9:14.25

18 Schmitt, Jake 11 Redwood High Sch 9:16.06

19 Bethke, Brandon 11 El Toro HS 9:17.75

20 Dunn, Alex 12 San Lorenzo Vall 9:18.86

21 Biladeau, Andy 11 Tampa Jesuit 9:24.36

22 Tschirhart, Kevin 11 Northport High S 9:27.01

Iknowthisisannoyingbut wrote:

115 went under 9:30! Dang!

That is an incredible stat.

I wonder how many of those kids will be running 2 years out of high school.

I would guess less than 40.

Lots of talent does not get fully brought to its potential.

115 is a huge total and means that there is a very, very large talent reservoir from which the best who can hack the college training and competition will emerge eventually at the highest levels. It doesn't work all that well if you only have a handful under 9:10 as in past years. That's a fun result from a few years back with a 1:02 half guy in Puskedra at 9 flat, Jared Ward in 7th, Walmsley back at 9:39 in 11th grade, and a few other guys who emerged later on. What are the 25 guys who broke 9 going to do. 8:41 3200m is all-timer quality, Ritz territory (but of course he also ran 13:44, which is far better).

depth in high wrote:

Iknowthisisannoyingbut wrote:

115 went under 9:30! Dang!

That is an incredible stat.

I wonder how many of those kids will be running 2 years out of high school.

I would guess less than 40.

Lots of talent does not get fully brought to its potential.

Teare wrote:

With their many boys under 9:15 or even under 9:30 how hard would it be to run at a d1 college

That's an interesting question

gimick wrote:

Seriously, they do this intentionally to get as many boys under 9:00 as possible. Maybe Gonzalez should change it to a 3150 next year so he can say "50 boys under 9!!!"

They race the mile instead of the 1600m, they really should make it the 2-mile if they have any integrity.

gimick, you are now a hero of mine. meaningless started and you finished what really needs to be said. I went through the whole thread but came back to this since you may be on to something. There seems to be a contingent out there which considers 3200 to be 2 miles and don't want to acknowledge that it's 18m or more than 60 feet shorter. Look at a track with a 2 mile starting line and it is way back there. McMillan or somebody can tell you what that difference could be expected to be run in, but that still doesn't do much for your resume since you didn't actually post the equivalent 2 mile time. You may be able to, but is that the reason you're training and racing?

If there is a contender for a 1/2 marathon record who is in peak shape and facing a pool-table flat course and perfect weather I would say the same if he ran 13 miles instead of the half. Especially if he comes through 20k under Tadese's time. That would realistically suggest he could get the half record too, but unfortunately it doesn't count as having done so. My comment to my fictional guy or the Arcadia crowd could be:

"You may look back later in life and regret this. You may not be in this shape again or not have the perfect conditions again. You know you could have done it today and you may do it some other time. However, if you do not, your one chance will be gone."

Although I'm not biggest fan, Mo Farah got the only record Komen missed. Indoor and outdoor 3k and outdoor 2 mile were put out of reach but he never got to the indoor 2 mile in his sadly short career. So, Mo took the only record he could, the El G and Berkeley records being inaccessible as well. Without the wisdom to do an actual 2 mile race, Mo retires without a WR. Tell him that 3200m is equally meaningful.

However ~ backfired wrote:

There were ZERO under 9 minutes for 2 miles.

Wrong. Watch the video and you'll he several coasted more than 18 meters in 18 seconds after finishing. That is, if you can run 3200 at under 4:25 pace, you can take 7 steps at 24:00 pace to satisfy the internet trolls.

WTF would it take for you to recognize the best HS 2 mile/3200 ever run? God needs to part the clouds and say "Hey, those guys are fast!"?

Amazing 3200s for both guys and girls. Props to them all.

3200 / 2 mile are practically the same thing. Only a loser would get hung up over it, and the kids out there running sub 9 in highschool aren't losers and sure as hell could care less.

allcadia wrote:

ArcadiaMania wrote:

1 Cooper Teare 12 St. Joseph-Nd 8:41.46

Cooper ran a great race, congratz and all broke a Thom Hunt record....

Hunt was better... especially in cross country.

Hunt's 8:42 (8:45 2-mile) at Arcadia Invite 1976 was on dirt!

same difference wrote:

3200 / 2 mile are practically the same thing. Only a loser would get hung up over it, and the kids out there running sub 9 in highschool aren't losers and sure as hell could care less.

The 1500/mile are pretty much the same thing. It's why I'm a sub-4 miler.

I'm a sub 9 2miler

sc42 wrote:

Wrong. Watch the video and you'll he several coasted more than 18 meters in 18 seconds after finishing. That is, if you can run 3200 at under 4:25 pace, you can take 7 steps at 24:00 pace to satisfy the internet trolls.

WTF would it take for you to recognize the best HS 2 mile/3200 ever run? God needs to part the clouds and say "Hey, those guys are fast!"?

Amazing 3200s for both guys and girls. Props to them all.

Nobody is saying the athletes weren't great. My criticism is aimed at Gonzalez. He is sticking with the 3200m purely for more sub-9s. At this level of competition there's no excuse for racing non-standard distances.

Surely you noticed the announcer go "25 sub-9s!!! How are you going to top that next year, Gonzalez?"

Maybe he'll go to the 3100m.

gimick wrote:

sc42 wrote:

Wrong. Watch the video and you'll he several coasted more than 18 meters in 18 seconds after finishing. That is, if you can run 3200 at under 4:25 pace, you can take 7 steps at 24:00 pace to satisfy the internet trolls.

WTF would it take for you to recognize the best HS 2 mile/3200 ever run? God needs to part the clouds and say "Hey, those guys are fast!"?

Amazing 3200s for both guys and girls. Props to them all.

Nobody is saying the athletes weren't great. My criticism is aimed at Gonzalez. He is sticking with the 3200m purely for more sub-9s. At this level of competition there's no excuse for racing non-standard distances.

Surely you noticed the announcer go "25 sub-9s!!! How are you going to top that next year, Gonzalez?"

Maybe he'll go to the 3100m.

Well said, gimick! Standard distances exist. Ask any record holder whether or not they believe exact distances matter. This includes Mo Farah who took the only one he had access to by running an exact, measured, standard distance for which records are kept. The distance was pretty close to 3200m, by coincidence!

Genzebe Dibaba is just the latest superstar (juiced or not - that's another topic) who's talents overlap very closely with 1500m/1mile/3000m/2miles and therefore with the non-events 1600 and 3200 meters (or yards, if you need it to be even shorter for statistical or 'record' purposes). She does not hold any records in those last-mentioned distances. No one does. They are not events and therefore records are not kept for them.

This is where gimick and I don't really disagree with the other side of this debate. No one is saying "these guys suck" but rather that the event organizer does by not providing a forum in which some impressive performances could result in actual, meaningful stats that IAAF, USATF, T&FN, or LRC would be able to cite.

By the way, the 1976 dirt track race referred to above was not 3200y or m but 2 miles, needs no conversion, and is more impressive than suggested. Now if you'll excuse me, I've got to go and train for my 9km record attempt!

beezy wrote:

Anybody know what the standard to get into the invitational section of the 3200 was?

gimick wrote:

sc42 wrote:

Wrong. Watch the video and you'll he several coasted more than 18 meters in 18 seconds after finishing. That is, if you can run 3200 at under 4:25 pace, you can take 7 steps at 24:00 pace to satisfy the internet trolls.

WTF would it take for you to recognize the best HS 2 mile/3200 ever run? God needs to part the clouds and say "Hey, those guys are fast!"?

Amazing 3200s for both guys and girls. Props to them all.

Nobody is saying the athletes weren't great. My criticism is aimed at Gonzalez. He is sticking with the 3200m purely for more sub-9s. At this level of competition there's no excuse for racing non-standard distances.

Surely you noticed the announcer go "25 sub-9s!!! How are you going to top that next year, Gonzalez?"

Maybe he'll go to the 3100m.

It's a high school meet so they used standard high school distances. High school athletes and those following high school track are more familiar with 3200 times. They ran the 300m hurdles too, even though that distance is only run in American high school competition.

The mile is an exception because it has historical significance in the sport. The 2 mile is an obscure event and has no special relevance.

People are making way too big of a deal about this. I was there and it was an incredible meet. The men's 3200 is now more competitive than FL. Props for putting on a great event.

If someone didn't fully taper to race the most competitive race in American, then their coach(es) is an idiot.

18 State Champions in perfect conditions.

Overlooking being fresh and ready to race is amateurish.

Looks like about 9:10 for the 3200 or a better result at some other race distance (Footlocker all-american; sub-4:10 mile, etc.). You can stop asking now.

>>Standard distances exist

Yes, and that standard now is 3200m. I don't know of any race in SoCal that runs 2 miles. Mt Sac Relays runs 3200m. The Azusa MOC runs the 3200m. Both of those have a mile invitational as well. They all do the same thing.

It's not an Arcadia thing. And I think you are living in the past. Kids aren't thinking about breaking 9 or 10 or 11 in the 2 mile. They never run that race. They think about breaking times in races they actually run, like 3200m.

fdsfsdfsdfaf wrote:

He would've run 8:44. You really think racing a 1600 24 hrs earlier affected the outcome? I believe his coaching/training is better than that.

Of course it affected the outcome, you lunatic! Do you even DO running?