top Canadian coach calls out drug cheats beating his athletes

monie$ wrote:

moar monies wrote:

Have Coolsaet, Moulton, or STD ever publicly commented on this donation/fundraiser that Coolsaet is alleged to have carried out? Does anyone have a timeline of how this went down, like was it 8 weeks apart or 8 months apart?

The fundraising for the track at Guelph took place in January-February 2012.

http://www.uoguelph.ca/news/2012/02/community_runs.html

Relevant quote: "Among hundreds of donations, former Gryphon runner Reid Coolsaet pledged $10,000 of his winnings from the Scotiabank marathon in Toronto last year."

The Run Canada campaign took place in April 2012 to raise money for Canada's Olympic marathoners. Donations were matched by Athletics Canada. (link:

http://reidcoolsaet.com/2012/05/07/look-and-see-the-distance-in-my-eyes/

)

There were 2 different fundraising campaigns mentioned in that blog:

"Thanks to everyone who made donations to Run Canada Month (April), especially Millard,Rouse & Rosebrugh LLD and Longboat Runners club for their very generous donations. All donations, which were matched by Athletics Canada, are going to help training costs for Eric Gillis, Dylan Wykes and myself as well as programs to promote running.

The second fundraiser project that I have the good fortune of being a part of is a music video. The song is “All For the Run” by Shawn Brady and the video was produced, filmed and edited by Mike DelMonte. Shawn came up with the idea to help raise some money for my training while getting the running themed song out to listeners."

Is there a Run Canada program set up for 2016?

I’ve been trying to stay out participating in this thread since many of the issues being brought up don’t directly concern me, nor was I a member of the club when they happened. I haven’t heard all the details, and don’t think it’d be appropriate for me to comment on them without knowing the full story. However, some of my friends and teammates are being unfairly attacked, and I’d like to address it:

Reid: The fact of the matter is Reid had a good 2011. He was in a good spot financially when Guelph was raising money for their track, and he donated the money. Simultaneously, New Balance was running a campaign where for every shoe sold, a portion of the proceeds would go towards sponsoring Reid and Eric (ie. their salary). The two of them have worked hard to get to where they are today. What they chose to do with the (limited) money they make is up to them, and (imo) donating it back to the community seems like a pretty nice thing to do. Reid and Eric did help out promoting that Run Canada campaign, but most of the money went towards the running programs that Reid mentions.

Anthony: Bringing Anthony into this thread (what’s this thread even about anymore? Might as well have named it “Slinging mud at Speed River) is a severe low blow. After having a really good start to his season, Anthony began having a medical issue that forced him to drop out of several races leading into Pan Ams (he wasn’t able to race the national championships two weekends prior). It’s taken him nearly half a year to recover, and only now has he started consistently working out again. Anyone who knows Anthony will agree that he’s one of the nicest, hardest working, humble, and patriotic guys out there, and it’s a shame that there’s a few people out there who jumped on the back of one of their countries best middle distance runners who was going through a tough time.

Rob Watson: It’s a shame Rob has negative feelings towards the club, but let me also emphasize that he had many positive things to say including: “I wouldn’t be where I am in this sport without Speed River. Dave and Chris are fantastic. Amazing group of athletes. Those guys are great. I respect Guelph (x2). I love the guys.”

Dave: Again, I can’t speak to any of the events that occurred before September 2014. What I can say is that people in this thread are trying to judge Dave’s success on the amount of Reid Coolsaet’s he’s had (ie. people who continue to run with Speed River through their collegiate careers and into the professional ranks). I think this is an incredibly unfair way to judge a coaches success. Running post collegiately is a high risk, low reward endeavor (unless you’re lucky enough to punch through to the world class level), and for most people to give up chasing the dream after 1 or 2 years post-collegiately is completely natural. From what I see, most people that join this group get better and set PB’s while they are here (even if their time spent with the club is limited).

I wish I could address some of the other events more specifically, but I really don’t know enough about them. What I can say is that I’ve had an extremely positive experience with Speed River so far, and I’m constantly surrounded by some incredibly hard working, humble, and dedicated athletes. I believe that the negativity displayed towards my teammates in this thread comes from small group of individuals that does not reflect the Canadian running scene as a whole.

Jeremy Rae wrote:

Reid: The fact of the matter is Reid had a good 2011. He was in a good spot financially when Guelph was raising money for their track, and he donated the money. Simultaneously, New Balance was running a campaign where for every shoe sold, a portion of the proceeds would go towards sponsoring Reid and Eric (ie. their salary). The two of them have worked hard to get to where they are today. What they chose to do with the (limited) money they make is up to them, and (imo) donating it back to the community seems like a pretty nice thing to do. Reid and Eric did help out promoting that Run Canada campaign, but most of the money went towards the running programs that Reid mentions.

Thanks JRae and I agree, there's no reason to mention Anthony If people want to discuss concerns over corruption and nepotism so be it, but that has nothing to do with Anthony having a bad race.

Reid did well financially in 2011 and good for him. Speed River did a fundraiser with a strict time limit in early 2012 and Reid had $10,000 that he didn't need, having lots of savings to get him through the year, so he donated $10,000 to the Guelph track project. It's up to him what he does with his money; kudos to him for being in such a financially sound position in early 2012.

Now, what was the timeline for Run Canada? It looks like Run Canada was announced in late 2011, before the Guelph track project.

Who was in charge of Run Canada? Looks like Chris Moulton was the man to step up to the plate and get this project going.

This article mentions how Run Canada was going to help Canada's world-class athletes to not only make the trip to London, but also be competitive in London:

"Goals are great to have, but goals without a means to achieving them leaves athletes feeling as though they have failed."

Jeremy, does the Run Canada objective of helping athletes who are without the means to achieve their goals fit with your position that Reid Coolsaet "was in a good spot financially when Guelph was raising money for their track"?

Another quote from the above article: "To support the launch of this project Athletics Canada will also match all donations until January 30, 2011 up to a maximum of $10,000."

separate but...separate wrote:

(link:

http://reidcoolsaet.com/2012/05/07/look-and-see-the-distance-in-my-eyes/

)

There were 2 different fundraising campaigns mentioned in that blog:

"Thanks to everyone who made donations to Run Canada Month (April), especially Millard,Rouse & Rosebrugh LLD and Longboat Runners club for their very generous donations. All donations, which were matched by Athletics Canada, are going to help training costs for Eric Gillis, Dylan Wykes and myself as well as programs to promote running.

The second fundraiser project that I have the good fortune of being a part of is a music video. The song is “All For the Run” by Shawn Brady and the video was produced, filmed and edited by Mike DelMonte. Shawn came up with the idea to help raise some money for my training while getting the running themed song out to listeners."

Is there a Run Canada program set up for 2016?[/quote]

Shawn Brady came up with the idea to help raise money for Reid Coolsaet's training. What gave him the impression that Reid Coolsaet needed financial help?

I cannot imagine giving away $10,000 and then accepting donations in this manner. Although, at the same time, I cannot imagine taking a spot on a National Team to an event like the Chiba Ekiden relays if I didn't plan on racing the event all out:

Jeremy Rae wrote:

I wish I could address some of the other events more specifically, but I really don’t know enough about them.

Jeremy, that's a very reasonable post. As you've shown an interest in learning more about some of the other topics being discussed, I'll help you out.

Quest for Gold

1) Hendrikx. Ask him why he was nominated for government carding in the 5000m when he doesn't have standard. Actually, he won't necessarily know that, so ask him why he applied for government funding in an event he doesn't have the minimum standard for.

2) Proudfoot. Ask him why he ran the 1500m instead of 5000m at 2015 Ontario Championships and how that impeded his provincial carding application when he didn't have any AO Champs points he could honestly submit.

3) Allison. Ask Katrina why she applied for provincial carding in the 10000m when she has 0 Championship points in that event.

The results are all public information, as was the original nomination list that had Hendrikx marked for 5000m. You're in a great position to ask these and many other questions if you actually want to learn more about these kinds of issues.

Thanks for the questions. I'll answer as best as I can:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but running the provincial and national championships is not a requirement to apply for provincial carding. Does it help? Yes... but it's not mandatory.

I don't know why Aaron was initially carded as a 5000 athlete. His best event was the 10000 and that's what he went to FISU and Pan Ams for. Not that this is what happened, but sometimes errors are made. Last year, the announcement for NextGen funding came out and I was carded in the 800- which was most likely a simple clerical error.

Ross ran the 1500 at AO's because we were both still trying to run ourselves onto the Pan Am team. Taylor offered to help rabbit, and so that was the better event on the day. When we're drawing up our seasons, we're not thinking about what races will best improve our chances at getting provincial funding. We're just trying to get in the best races possible, and hope we've run fast enough by seasons end to earn it.

Nowhere in that article does it say Run Canada money went directly to Reid and Eric. The money was being raised for our club leading into the Olympic year, which (probably, I wasn't here yet so I'm only speculating based on how the club spends money now) went towards sending our crew (like Taylor, Alex, Boorsma, Hillary, Cliff, and others) to Flagstaff, pay for hotels at meets, etc.

The club actually spends much less on Reid than what he's worth to us in terms of media exposure and the way he represents us. While I've personally benefited from the support of the group with trips to Austin and Flagstaff the past two years, Reid has been paying for his trips to Kenya out of his own pocket.

You can choose to skip your event at the championships and miss out on the placing points. If, for example, you skipped both Ontario and Canadian Champs in your event, you are roughly cutting your potential points in half and have essentially a snowballs chance in hell of getting carded.

Well, did you ask Aaron if he applied for government funding in the 5000m? Go ahead and ask, he's an honest guy and will likely tell you the truth.

Speed River athletes are welcome to participate in whatever they feel is the "better event on the day," just so long as they face the same consequences as everyone else.

Most athletes and coaches draw up their seasons based around the criteria they need to meet to qualify for National Teams and satisfy carding requirements. If they fail to meet the National Team criteria, then they don't get put on that team. If they fail to meet carding criteria, or score enough legitimate points, THEN THEY DON'T GET NOMINATED FOR CARDING.

Jeremy, the Quest for Gold criteria are readily available online:

It is clear that three Speed River athletes did not fulfill the criteria, yet were named to the list anyway.

Some relevant criteria from the document:

Athletes need to compete in the event for which they applying for carding at provincials and nationals. If they don't they are ineligible or at the very least at a significant disadvantage as 50% of their points are based on placing at Ontario and Canadian Championships.

Hendrikx:

- did not achieve the minimum performance standard in the 5000m, and did not improve upon his time from last year (both are required)

- his event was initially listed as the 5000m. Once coaches started pressing AO for answers, this was changed to the 10,000m (possible cover-up?)

- his nomination in the 10,000m doesn't make sense either, as Hendrikx did not race the Ontario/Canadian 10,000m Championships (one race acted as championships for both) in May. Thus he was given placing points that he did not earn.

Allison:

- Also skipped the Ontario and Canadian 10,000m Championships. Again, shouldn't have received any championship placing points and thus cannot apply.

Proudfoot:

- Did not race the event for which he was applying for carding at Ontario Championships. His placing in the 1500m was slotted in for no reason.

- Should be noted that this was a 2-day meet and he could have done a 1500m/5000m double if he wanted to race the 1500m but still apply for carding in the 5000m

So while you're at it, please ask these athletes if they simply filled in their applications with fraudulent data, or if they asked for a special exemption that was not available to other athletes in Ontario applying for Quest for Gold. Ask them if their coaches advised them to lie on their applications in order to receive government funding over other athletes who bothered to follow the criteria. And perhaps ask Chris Moulton what role he had in Speed River athletes getting nominated for Quest for Gold, since he is on the committee.

Jeremy Rae wrote:

Nowhere in that article does it say Run Canada money went directly to Reid and Eric. The money was being raised for our club leading into the Olympic year, which (probably, I wasn't here yet so I'm only speculating based on how the club spends money now) went towards sending our crew (like Taylor, Alex, Boorsma, Hillary, Cliff, and others) to Flagstaff, pay for hotels at meets, etc.

Hold up, did you just say that Run Canada money went to your club, Speed River?

Run Canada, the Athletics Canada initiative that AC matched funds for up to $10,000, was a fundraiser for Speed River???

Oops, Dave's gonna give me shite

Yes I've read the criteria, and I'll repeat that nowhere does it say you NEED to run nationals or provincials to APPLY for carding, but YES it greatly improves your chances.

You can ask them yourself why they decided to apply to anyway. Probably because nothing was stopping them from doing so. Their nomination to the list isn't really the fault of the athlete.

And to the poster who mentions that athletes DO plan their seasons in order to meet carding criteria- I think that's an incredibly difficult thing to plan for given the way that carding criteria changes from year to year. Most athletes I know (myself included) focus on simply competing as best they can, and hope they've checked enough boxes at the end of the year. But you know what, I wasn't selected for national carding this year, so maybe next year I'll have you plan my season instead ;)

I also said I'm speculating. I was still in University at the time so my knowledge of the Run Canada program is limited to the same article that you're reading.

Actually, you know what. You're probably not really looking for an answer from me. You're probably just prodding the fire, and to that I say job well done.

It is if they submitted fraudulent data on their application for government funding. And the Quest for Gold criteria clearly states that the athlete is accountable for accuracy of the info.

Ontario carding is basically

-run fast twice

-compete well at Ontario and Canadian Championships

Most Ontario clubs find that incredibly easy to understand and plan around

Jeremy Rae wrote:

I also said I'm speculating. I was still in University at the time so my knowledge of the Run Canada program is limited to the same article that you're reading.

Actually, you know what. You're probably not really looking for an answer from me. You're probably just prodding the fire, and to that I say job well done.

If Gollish was carded for a 4:07, do you think that you should have been carded for 3:36?

I feel like I'm hitting my head against a wall.

There's been NO evidence showing any athlete from Speed River submitted "fraudulent" data. Scoring points was NOT a requirement for applying. They ran fast, hit the minimum D standards in the 10k, and applied for carding.

In an unrelated situation, a hurdler this year was nominated for national carding. However, it was later discovered that her best time was achieved at altitude, and she was given an incorrect amount of points. The appeal process is designed specifically to correct these types of mistakes. The hurdler didn't submit her application with malicious intent or with knowledge that she had fraudulent data. She simply applied because she thought she had run fast enough to earn it.

The way I see it, there's an appeal process for a reason. The deserving athletes will, in the end, get funding.

Jeremy Rae wrote:

I feel like I'm hitting my head against a wall.

There's been NO evidence showing any athlete from Speed River submitted "fraudulent" data. Scoring points was NOT a requirement for applying. They ran fast, hit the minimum D standards in the 10k, and applied for carding.

Hypothetically speaking, let's say someone were to post information showing fraudulent data for Speed River nominations, then what would you say? Would you claim it wasn't the athletes or coaches fault, and someone at AO must have changed it?

defend our style wrote:

Jeremy Rae wrote:

I feel like I'm hitting my head against a wall.

There's been NO evidence showing any athlete from Speed River submitted "fraudulent" data. Scoring points was NOT a requirement for applying. They ran fast, hit the minimum D standards in the 10k, and applied for carding.

Hypothetically speaking, let's say someone were to post information showing fraudulent data for Speed River nominations, then what would you say? Would you claim it wasn't the athletes or coaches fault, and someone at AO must have changed it?

Of course not. If that's the case, and evidence does exist, then I will be proven wrong. I am simply defending my teammates based on the belief that they are good people. I guess we'll just have to wait for the hypothetical evidence to be presented.

Jeremy Rae wrote:

There's been NO evidence showing any athlete from Speed River submitted "fraudulent" data. Scoring points was NOT a requirement for applying. They ran fast, hit the minimum D standards in the 10k, and applied for carding.

Do you honestly believe the Speed river athletes in question are listed on the AO carding nomination page despite having only ~50 total points in the case of Allison and Hendrikx or ~70 points in the case of Proudfoot?

18 Jeremy Rae M 1500

19 Ross Proudfoot M 5000

...

32 Sacha Smart M 800

...

35 Alex Wilkie M 1500

36 Connor Darlington M 1500

Do you honestly believe that Ross Proudfoot legit scored enough points to be ranked directly below you and well ahead of Smart, Wilkie, and Darlington, despite earning 0 points at the Ontario Champs for his 5000m nomination?