LetsRun.com is Officially Against the Soda (ang Gatorade and Tea) Tax: Join With Us

It would be weirder if people didn't insult Wejo after a post like this. A lot of people here would insult a random poster for writing the same thing so why wouldn't we insult Wejo?

Couldn't disagree more with you Wejo.

This can best be compared to tabacco - the scientific evidence is there.

You could argue the scale of the tax but the rest of it, not really. Is this an actual LRC manifesto? Seriously? :(

agip wrote:

can I just say, as reasonable adult, that the insults against the brojos are out of line?

the insulters are like kids who think insulting their parents and teachers makes them appear tough to their friends.

it's one of the weirdest things that goes on here - those insults.

I like you, agip, but you are wrong. This is one of the dumbest posts I have seen on LRC.

Reg Field wrote:

Or, should we put a tax on soda? That would increase revenue to help fund the problems that soda drinking causes and the burden of the cost would be squarely on those that actually drink it.

You know this tax goes into the general fund and not a special tax that could be used for school nutrition right? So essentially, this tax is paying for city workers pensions.

Rich1 wrote:

Well I am apparently in the minority here, but I agree with you. No one needs to smoke or drink alcohol, so they are luxuries and are taxed as they are unhealthy luxuries.

Drinks containing sugar are very useful to endurance athletes.

I would be interested to know if fruit juices will also be taxed. They are the same or worse than soda.

You ask where will it stop... it will stop when everything that is said to be unhealthy is heavily taxed (meat, dairy, fat, sugar, flour, etc). Forget the fact that grains were said to be healthy and fats bad, and now that view is changing, they will just tax as they feel at the time!

WTF?! No one needs to drink sugar beverages either.

Soda is certainly an unhealthy luxury. If you're going to tax my alcohol, then damn right you should tax sugared beverages.

agip wrote:

can I just say, as reasonable adult, that the insults against the brojos are out of line?

the insulters are like kids who think insulting their parents and teachers makes them appear tough to their friends.

it's one of the weirdest things that goes on here - those insults.

Butt Kisser

wejo wrote:

Considering the founders of this site are not obese and drink a lot of Dr. Pepper (myself) and Coke & Dr. Pepper (Robert) we are really opposed to this tax.

I've spent a good portion of my day marveling over this statement. The pure self-centeredness! The selfishness! The narcissism! It's astounding.

All they care about is themselves. They have given zero thought to what is good for our great nation, and couldn't care less about people who might be different from them. If you think differently than them, if you are different from them, they don't want to hear from you. The only people who are important is themselves. It's so creepy.

adsfasfdsf wrote:

Please read research before you talk. Decreasing consumption of sugar-sweetened drinks is the single most effective way to reduce obesity. What "better ways" do you (someone who has zero expertise on public health policy) suggest?

http://jama.jamanetwork.com/article.aspx?articleid=199317http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/84/2/274.short

Oh, by the way, just because you aren't overweight doesn't mean your soda habit isn't unhealthy. Enjoy your insulin resistance.

http://jn.nutrition.org/content/137/9/2121.full

What this guy said!

Calm down people.Clearly the people against this don't drink soda. I am a perfectly healthy non-obese American. If I lived in a place where this passed I'd pay probably an extra $75-$150 a year all in the name of public health. I love my Dr. Pepper and don't want to pay 57.6% more (my math was out as the 2nd poster noted) to enjoy a 12 pack.Forget about singling out one beverage over another. The amount of this tax is astronomical compared to what we tax other products.Non-soda but beer drinkers, do you want to start paying 57.6% more for your beer? Almost anything in excess when consumed is not healthy for you. Yet this tax is 6 or 12 times the tax on beer in most states.1) Yes there is a huge obesity problem in America. 2) I didn't even discuss the constitutionally of the law. I just said I'm against it and hope people vote it down.3) A few people have said that sugar contributes to obesity in America. I agree. Yet this isn't a sugar tax, it's a sweetened beverage tax. It is singling out one form of sugar over another.Consuming too many calories contributes to obesity. This does nothing to go after that. You have an Honest Tea and you'll pay an extra tax for it. You have a bacon wrapped steak (i have no idea if that is unhealthy or not, I'm assuming so) with a pint of Ben and Jerry's after and you'll have no tax.5)

That study states the obvious: "Studies in children and adults have found that reducing sugary drink consumption can lead to better weight control among those who are initially overweight"

No sh**.

Overweight children who consume less calories will have better weight control is essentially what they are saying. Shocking news.

If the problem is marketing the drinks to children, then there are ways to stop that.

6.

You prove my point exactly. What country do you live in? The French are very thin compared to Americans. They do not have a soda tax. The Brits don't have a soda tax. Americans need to exercise more and consume less calories. Soda and Gatorade and Honest Tea is a small part of it.

7. One poster has said the artificial sweeteners in diet drinks is bad for you. Is that really the case? Yet they get no tax. I always have avoided diet drinks who knows maybe that is because I remember the days then they put Saccharin in diet drinks, and then everyone thought that caused cancer, I think now the science says it doesn't.

8. I'm against subsidies for HFCS. Yet even if pure cane sugar is in the drinks they get taxed.

9. Should the government ban Xbox and TV for children as well? Maybe the government can require children to play on sports teams. That would go a long way in reducing the amount of child hood obesity.

10.

The vitriol in some of the responses shows I think this really is not about obesity for many but about penalizing others who aren't as "virtuous" as yourself.

I want to enjoy my life. I want to have a beer or two at night and a Dr. Pepper or two during the day without paying 50%+ more to do it. If I die earlier because of it, so be it.

11.

Fruit juices are excluded. Guess they are considered healthy for you.

12. Anyone know how they will do the tax on fountain sodas? A ton of those are ice anyway. And if I get a 99 cent big gulp I can get a Diet Dr. Pepper or Dr. Pepper for the same price. Will the cashier ask me which drink I got and charge me more?

You Are What You Is wrote:

wejo wrote:

Considering the founders of this site are not obese and drink a lot of Dr. Pepper (myself) and Coke & Dr. Pepper (Robert) we are really opposed to this tax.

I've spent a good portion of my day marveling over this statement. The pure self-centeredness! The selfishness! The narcissism! It's astounding.

All they care about is themselves. They have given zero thought to what is good for our great nation, and couldn't care less about people who might be different from them. If you think differently than them, if you are different from them, they don't want to hear from you. The only people who are important is themselves. It's so creepy.

I never said I don't want to hear from any other people or that I only care about myself.

My Dr. Pepper may be your cheddar cheese or your Ben and Jerry's ice cream or your glass of pinot.

***

Unrelated, I'd like to know the amount of really obese people who drink diet sodas. I always laugh when I see people order a ton of food and top it off with a Diet Coke.

I'm assuming they've done studies on this. Someone help me out:

What percent of Americans are obese? What percent of obese Americans drink sugary sodas? What percent of Americans who drink sugary sodas are obese? What percent of Americans who don't drink sugary sodas are obese?

You ain't healthy. Any day now expect to go down hard. Real hard

I do get your point of being taxed specifically for doing something unhealthy when on the whole you are more healthy than many who may not be subjected to this tax.

Now there are some people who smoke who are healthier than the average person and they pay high cigarette taxes.

I still don't like the tax and think there are better way to approach this.

It's just that your argument isn't broad enough when you say "look at me."

I do think your argument of look at all of the obese people that drink only diet soda is pretty solid.

In the end I think that if people in general drank less sugary drinks, the country would be better off.

I don't think this tax approach will accomplish this.

I recommend checking out Daniel Lieberman's book "The Story of the Human Body". He does a great job of making the research palatable. He also provides a great argument for not taxing unhealthy food, but requiring that you be 18 to buy soda or candy.

Most people who are involved in and study nutrition and sports nutrition will tell you that health is not simply calories in v. calories out and that sweetened beverages are simply the worst way to consume any sugar (and calories in general). Before continuing with this argument I would highly recommend you do more research (Matt Fitzgerald, Daniel Lieberman, Rob Wolff, Loren Cordain). If you're near Houston call up Steve Magness, I'm certain he can explain it to you.

Thanks for the info, wejo!

I will be voting YES on Measure D this afternoon.

X-Runner wrote:

I do get your point of being taxed specifically for doing something unhealthy when on the whole you are more healthy than many who may not be subjected to this tax.

Now there are some people who smoke who are healthier than the average person and they pay high cigarette taxes.

I still don't like the tax and think there are better way to approach this.

It's just that your argument isn't broad enough when you say "look at me."

I do think your argument of look at all of the obese people that drink only diet soda is pretty solid.

In the end I think that if people in general drank less sugary drinks, the country would be better off.

I don't think this tax approach will accomplish this.

Using myself as an example clearly put a lot of people in the wrong frame of mind.

If sugary drinks cost 50% more people will drink less of them. Econ 101. How much it will do for obesity is a completely different question.

I still can't believe that booze was banned in this country. I can see people making the argument that medical care costs would be down if people didn't drink, that society would be better off. At the same time, I'm glad I can drink a beer legally and without it being taxed too much.

wejo wrote:

Using myself as an example clearly put a lot of people in the wrong frame of mind.

Because it is anecdotal and, honestly, all that is wrong with politics today.

I am against specific taxing, as are you, but you cannot fight something with anecdotes. That is Political Science 101.

The best way to limit obesity in this nation is to stop corporate welfare on the same crap they are trying to tax. I am a conservative and even i can admit to that crap!

You pay the companies to create HFCS and then you tax the consumers for buying it. It makes NO sense, whatsoever.

Smokers gonna smoke. Runners gonna run. Diet Mtn Dew drinkers gonna drink Diet Mtn Dew.

Does anyone really think that someone saw the taxes go up on cigarettes and decided to stop smoking? No way.

Pliney the Younger wrote:

Does anyone really think that someone saw the taxes go up on cigarettes and decided to stop smoking? No way.

Somewhat. Those countries with the highest tobacco taxes have seen the biggest drops.

Banning smoking indoors, parks and recreation areas will have also contributed.

Wejo, once again, I suggest you do not speak of subjects you do not know of. France HAS a soda tax.

And yes, french are slimmer than americans. However, if you compare the average poor frenchman to the average american they are probably equally overweight. Soda tax makes sense in France and it would 10000000% make more sense in the US.

Now a Coach wrote:

Somewhat. Those countries with the highest tobacco taxes have seen the biggest drops.

Banning smoking indoors, parks and recreation areas will have also contributed.

You and I both know that the drop in consumption is due to buying elsewhere. People aren't dumb. They will go buy 3 cartons in the next county if it saves them a buck per pack.

The thing is, there is always going to be a neighboring county that is willing to take the buyers. If not, there is a thriving black market, which wounds crazy, but it is as easy as having your buddy bring you a few cartons or a log of dip every time you get together to hang out.

I think outright bans work, but I am not sure it is constitutional to ban for the sake of trying to limit use. The bans are about not exposing non-smokers to the crap. I have smoking friends who have told me that banning inside smoking has led to them enjoying the habit even more, so who knows...

I am not pro tobacco. I am just a realist. Bans and taxes aren't usually the answer.