Chris Solinsky leaving Portland - accepts coaching gig at William and Mary

Not heard Solinsky say his leg is really affecting his come back. Has he actually said his leg is still affecting his biomechanics? If it was still affecting him really badly that may explain the regression in performance but even that is a push. His drop off in performance has been massive. I think all those Nike guys, Jerrys included, were using dubious methods to boost performance.

marathon man21 wrote:

So a talented guy, who didn't listen to his coach and trained so hard that he wrecked his career will make a great coach?

Seems to have worked out for Salazar.

scratch n sniff wrote:

He can't sniff Ruppie's jock. Never could, even when he was beating him.

I wanted to address one other point separately.

SOLINSKY MOST DEFINITELY COULD SNIFF RUPP'S JOCK. If you want to use that analogy then Rupp would have been lucky to hold Solinsky's before the injury.

According to tilastapaja, guess what the head to head career results are between Rupp and Solinsky?

Go ahead and guess. I'm stunned by the results myself. They are so shocking I think I'll put this in the Week That Was next week.

The results are Solinsky 12. Rupp 3.

(I've pasted the races at the end of this message but am not sure if it will format correctly).

Tthe 2659 was a HUGE beatdown of Rupp in his main event. The race was set up for Rupp. Nike had printed up giveaways with Rupp AR to hand out to the fans and Solinsky left the track with the AR and sub-27 clocking.

When I talk to the people in the "Rupp has to be dirty" camp , I often challenge them and ask them, "Ok do you think he was on drugs in HS or college" as I hate people who just mouth off about doping without thinking about it" I've had people respond to that question by saying they believe the 2659 put them over the edge.

There is a reason why Jerry and Alberto don't get along and races like this are a big reason. Imagine going to work every day and having to say hi/play nice to your #1 rival each and every day. It would suck. If they weren't in the same league, I'm sure they'd all be best of buds.

Please deal in fact. Solinsky most certainly did sniff Rupp's jock. Outdoors in 2010, Solinsky owned Rupp. They raced 4 times, once at 10,000, twice at 5000 and once at 3000. Rupp never came within 10 seconds of Solinsky. Yes 10 seconds.

The next year, Solinsky beat rupp in the 5000 at USAs.

Solinsky owned him in college and pretty much owned him as a pro until the injury.

Here is the head to head record.

Chris Solinsky USA Galen Rupp USA

5000 m NCAA Fayetteville AR 2006-03-10 13:52.47 (3) 13:56.41 (5)

3000 m NCAA Fayetteville AR 2006-03-11 7:59.68 (1) 8:07.85 (6)

5000 m Husky Classic Seattle WA 2007-02-10 13:30.74 OT (1) 13:38.62 OT (2)

5000 m NCAA Fayetteville AR 2007-03-09 13:38.61 (1) 13:40.38 (3)

3000 m NCAA Fayetteville AR 2007-03-10 7:51.69 (2) 7:56.79 (4)

5000 m Or Inv Eugene OR 2007-04-20 13:30.54 (2) 13:30.49 (1)

One Mile Wash Inv Seattle WA 2010-01-30 3:55.75 OT (1) 3:56.22 OT (2)

3000 m NC Albuquerque NM 2010-02-27 8:13.85A (3) 8:13.49A (2)

10000 m Jordan Stanford CA 2010-05-01 26:59.60 (1) 27:10.74 (4)

5000 m DNG Stockholm 2010-08-06 12:55.53 (5) DNF (0)

5000 m WK Zürich 2010-08-19 12:56.45 (3) 13:07.35 (12)

3000 m Rieti 2010 Rieti 2010-08-29 7:34.32 (5) 7:50.46 (14)

5000 m NC Eugene OR 2011-06-24 13:23.65 (2) 13:25.52 (3)

5000 m Herc Monaco 2011-07-22 DNF (0) tie! DNF (0)

5000 m High Perf Eagle Rock CA 2013-05-17 13:27.03 (7) DNF (0)

5000 m NC Des Moines IA 2013-06-23 15:09.47 (8) 14:54.91 (2)

Wins: 12 3

Is it not possible that Teg or Solinsky realised they would never get back to the same heights again so stopped doping? What would be the point continuing to dope to run 1315 to 1320. The would be risking their reputation for no reason. All the younger guys are still improving so there is still incentive to dope. They may not have been doping but if Rupp is doping I would bet my house those guys were too. Rupp was more talented when younger and both Teg and Sol have run faster over 5k and they are clean yet Rupp is dirty? That does not make any sense.

I'm not opining on doping here, I'm opining on how many forumgoers seem to have not learned of the facts. Solinsky tore his hamstring off the bone. Career over. End of story. When human technological intervention to the tune of metal screws and such are needed, then the days of an efficient natural peak performance are over. What we can say is, it's a tragedy and I feel for him. Practically speaking, he was young at the time and could have afforded to take the foot off the gas for a little while and reap the benefits of time passing. As Renato Canova has said, there is a recovery/gainsmaking purpose to slow runs. "Supercompensation" as he calls it, comes from not 100% moderation, or 100% crazy hard work, but a strategic, scientific modulation of different efforts in conjunction.

Maybe a physical therapy team should have kept a tighter watch on Solinsky, too, to make sure his biomechanics were sound and nothing was at risk. Most likely, skilled Pt workers should have been able to identify warning signs long in advance.

Finally, you would think if he was doping, that he would be recovering faster and could do tremendously hard workouts without having to resort to overall over-training that would lead to catastrophic injury. The injury etiology seems to vindicate him. And this is a cold rationale, cynical opinion. Personally, I think his personality and background make doping extremely unlikely.

rojo wrote:

scratch n sniff wrote:

He can't sniff Ruppie's jock. Never could, even when he was beating him.

I wanted to address one other point separately.

SOLINSKY MOST DEFINITELY COULD SNIFF RUPP'S JOCK. If you want to use that analogy then Rupp would have been lucky to hold Solinsky's before the injury.

Yes, that was totally dumb statement by that forum-goer, who probably didn't follow these athletes at all during their college days, early post-collegiate days, and only jumped on the train around 2010 and later. It's Like, 'Bruh, did you even follow t&f distance running from 2005-2010?'

Granted, Rupp was significantly younger than Solinsky.

The doping comments are just ignorant. Solinsky was a great natural talent and very hard worker who had a long career beginning in high school, through college, and as a pro. From the beginning of his career he was one of the top runners at his level and always showed the promise that resulted in his 10k AR.

Go back and watch the 2002 Footlocker that he won by 20 seconds-

http://www.flotrack.org/coverage/240674-2011-Foot-Locker-Cross-Country-Championships/video/375918-Foot-Locker-Top-Moments-From-The-Past-Decade-6-The-Rocket-Dominates#.U-Zu2Pk7um4

Any number of running careers have been ended by an injury that the runner just can't get back from. That's probably more common than runners who just slow down with age and quit.

I'm sure it's a hard decision to give up trying to be competitive at a top level and move on, especially when he's probably dissatisfied with his career from a medal and Olympics standpoint.

All the best to him as he moves to another stage of his career.

Bleu wrote:

It is a bad place for running but it's not like he could be a volunteer assistant at WI. Burned that bridge a long time ago.

I guess he could have done a Ritz and volunteered at a a Jr college. What does his wife do? She must have a job in the area because they can't live off his salary.

GVSU is a long way from most jr colleges. They have an indoor track and football practice facility and national championships and all-americans everywhere you turn. It is a D2 powerhouse.

The doping comments I made were mainly to stimulate debate. I don't really think Solinsky doped. I just find it frustrating that people just assume Rupp is doping yet people who regularly beat him or ran faster than him were clean no questions asked. It does not make sense and is complete double standards. Just because Rupp is a bit feminine, is a bit geekey and does not look or talk how Americans want their hero's to, he is fair game to be slandered, ridiculed and abused. All Jerrys guys are assumed to be clean because they fit peoples image of how they want runners to be.

DOP wrote:

The doping comments I made were mainly to stimulate debate. I don't really think Solinsky doped. I just find it frustrating that people just assume Rupp is doping yet people who regularly beat him or ran faster than him were clean no questions asked. It does not make sense and is complete double standards. Just because Rupp is a bit feminine, is a bit geekey and does not look or talk how Americans want their hero's to, he is fair game to be slandered, ridiculed and abused. All Jerrys guys are assumed to be clean because they fit peoples image of how they want runners to be.

I completely agree, even though I don't have any suspicions about C.S. And, I, too, have followed Chris Solinsky's entire career and rooted for him during that time. Being an amazing, consistent prodigy does not exonerate you from suspicion or motive for using PEDs at the highest of elite levels. This discussion of cheating and performance enhancing is the same across every sport and even computer games!!! It's the best of the best who we are most concerned about using PEDs or cheating to gain the extra edge, and they would be the most competent in utilizing that extra edge to hedge for pinnacle performance. You can look at other sports and even computer games! In some computer game discussions of elite performance and cheat software, the consensus is the same--the concern and most damage is about "Xperts" who are amazing anyway and would be able to utilize the extra edge most effectively.

I'm curious if we would even be having this debate had Sol been an African or America had a plethora of sub 13 talent each year.

I think this is a fairly common theme when you get to the extreme elite aspects of our sport. Your window for barn burning times generally only comes around once, and you have to capitalize on it before the inevitability occurs, injury.

Very few runners, sans the greatest guys of all time, have been able to bounce back from near career ending injuries and regained the form they once held. Even Bekele hasn't been as spectacular since his injury spiral a few years ago.

I think what makes Sol's story so intriguing and criticized, is that he's kind of the poster child for the blue collar, white, distance runner with the Engine that Could attitude.

He wasn't given every advantage like Rupp (I'm a rupp fan by the way), he's not a naturalized American from Africa, and he doesn't have the look or stride of a naturally "gifted" runner. He was the guy Let's run has been waiting to jerk off thinking about since the realization that no matter how hard Brian Sell tried, he'd never be a world beater.

That being said, it's not really disappointment people feel towards Solinski, it's more of a let down that we only got to see it for a summer. But in reality, most of the time, those guys can only shine for one or two years before they degrade into also rans.

Great job so far Chris. Hopefully, you'll find success in your next running quest or in coaching. Either way, I hope you're satisfied with your career, you should be.

I would set aside the doping discussion. The rivalry discussion is a bit off the mark. They specialize in different events. Yes, Solinsky beat Rupp in a great 10000. It was a wonderful moment for Solinsky and a race that will be remembered. It pales in comparison to what Rupp has done - (1) taking the record back and lowering it again while beating top flight African competitors, (2) getting second and fourth in the Olympics and WC.

Solinksy should be better at 3000 and 5000. Rupp makes teams in those events and does pretty well even though it is not his primary event. He even has the indoor records. That is impressive.

I always cheer for Solinsky and still hope he tries the marathon. It's too bad he and others can't / haven't reached the levels Rupp has - other guys have similar talent. Lets hope the younger guys get there.

And what happened to the other long distance Americans this year?

Anyone know what flats he is wearing in the picture above the article?

Does Teg still compete or is he essentially retired at this point and just riding out the Nike contract until it expires?

I wonder if he has loss of coordination in his leg that had the surgery?

Just because YOU ran fast dosey mean you can coach. I honestly believe to be a great coach is a rare gift. Be it at the youth level, HS, college or beyond you just can't assume you can coach because you can run. But I guess it gets you in the door.

So you know him personally? He's this great salt of the earth guy who would never ever cheat, huh? Because he's from the midwest and smiles nice for the camera?

This conception of Solinsky being the everyman nice guy hard worker and Rupp as the spoiled brat doper I have never bought, not even a little. I like Rupp in interviews better than Solinsky. I find people who are overly comfortable ("aw, schucks, i shoulda tried harder...my hammy hurts") to be phony. Rupp is awkward, and I respect that.

I just don't buy the way people classify Rupp vs. SOlinsky on here. I'd say 95% of posters think Solinsky is/was clean and maybe 20% think Rupp is. I personally would reverse that. The masses are usually wrong; ask Mark Twain.

Rupp/Salazar's strategy was the slow build-up, always has been. Solinsky ran an AR in a meet that was irrelevant, Rupp has an OLYMPIC SILVER MEDAL and will most likely medal again in 2016; possibly GOLD this time. Epic career.

SO you're right, Rojo, Solinsky can definitely hold his jock. NOT! (he just beat in a bunch of NCAA meets and non-important pro races. from 2012 on is what matters for these guys -- this time was what it was always about for guys at their level)

Dude, did you even read what I wrote?

I based my reasoning off of "cold rationale cynicism." I only offered my personal opinion as an addendum at the end. The bulk of my treatment of the doping issue in this thread has been to 1. agree that there is a double standard, concerning NOP athletes like Rupp versus Schumacher's group or any other blue-collar runners, 2. elites at the very top are not, by definition, beyond suspicion, regardless of their progression, and 3. based my skepticism of the probability of Solinsky having doped from "cold, cynical and rationale" reasoning stemming from his injury catastrophe, in which I took the viewpoint of someone who was never a fan or partial to Solinsky. I mean, do you just not understand words? And what part of the official facts do you not understand? Or do you believe that Solinsky and everyone "made up" the fact that he tore his hamstring off the bone and had to have drastic invasive surgery just to repair things to normal function? I guess that's a "conspiracy" for you, isn't it. Your viewpoint, in theory, isn't wrong, but you have no specifics, evidence, particular points or anything. You're just talking smack, and not earning points for the Rupp fan-camp, of which I am also a part of. Also, by the time of Rupp's American records and medal, Solinsky had long been injured. Granted, Rupp is such an amazing runner that I personally believe he would outshine Solinsky even if Solinsky had the greatest of possible careers. But you're not speaking to any of these nuanced thoughts, you're just babbling and making this thread look stupid.

rojo wrote:

Physiologists please respond.

How can a 26:59 guy struggle to break 30 when they are only 29?

Yes, I know Webb lost it quickly but it's all pretty interesting.

Solinsky was always top dog in training. His high school career he was never playing chase in practice. In college he was never playing chase in practice. He was never subjected to an attritional training system.

Then, when he injured his hamstring, he experienced quite a few set backs. Tearing your hamstring is very serious and many things can go wrong in the recovery process. Though, I don't believe recovery of his hamstring is an issue. He was one of Nike's top runners at the time, so I doubt he had anything less than the best treatment.

I think the problem lies with his training. Watching interviews of Solinksy talk about training, he doesn't understand what is happening, or not happening, inside his body. From his complete belief in his training and his failure to return to form, and even Teg's failure to return to the top, I would guess Schumacher doesn't know what is happening inside their bodies either. Solinsky said in a Flotrack bit that he was trying to latch on and survive in training. He lost fitness and he and his coach didn't know the appropriate level to train at for certain workouts. He was not controlling the pace of workouts and was now training above the necessary effort to see certain physiological adaptations. So now he is training in an attritional system, which leads to failure.