no one actually listened. wrote:
News flash for folks. Sometimes someone can be a great couch and still be mostly a tool.
How exactly can I make a couch from a tool?
no one actually listened. wrote:
News flash for folks. Sometimes someone can be a great couch and still be mostly a tool.
How exactly can I make a couch from a tool?
duct tape of course! and shame on me for not catching that :)
Fabulous LetsRun post. "I will not join the Sal Bashing faction," but "There is Team Salazar. There is also Team Cain. It will be interesting to see if Team Cain decides to move on in late summer, 2014." Why the criticism? Because Salazar has Cain aiming more toward the 1500 rather than the 800. And why is he doing this? Obviously because he "does not know how to coach the 800." The pretentiousness is stunning, but hilarious! Might it not be the case that a coach who has actually coached world class athletes might actually have some sense of what event might be best for his athletes? Apparently not.
Futures exchange options wrote:
Although I do not look at Salazar as anyone's savior I will not join the Sal Bashing faction. My detached view is Salazar does not know how to coach the 800 and has limited ability to coach the 1500. If Cain cannot run a world class 800 after running a sub 2:04 as a freshman then the sun does not come up in the east and set in the west. Salazar appears to have convinced Cain to forget about the 800 -- which is self-serving for Salazar. Salazar has said Cain tends to fall asleep mid race. An antidote for that is to put Cain in 800s, which demand full time race management, wire to wire.
There is Team Salazar. There is also Team Cain. It will be interesting to see if Team Cain decides to move on in late summer, 2014.
newname wrote:
Flanagan wins - makes team
Goucher second and makes team
Begley third and makes team
(three women likely get bonuses for their respective performances - TWO of them run for Al Salazar and all three run for Nike)
(OR)
Flanagan still likely wins
Goucher still likely gets 2nd
Begley gets third and run 31:50 AND DOES NOT MAKE OLYMPIC TEAM
McGregor likely maintains her 4th place and makes TEAM.
(THREE women likely get bonuses for their respective performances AND MAKE THE OLYMPIC TEAM - ONE of them runs for Al Salazar and two run for Nike)
Which scenario would you want to see for yourself if you were running in the Olympis Trials?
Which scenario would you like to see if you are Alberto Salazar? It seems to be suggested that what Salazar wanted was:
Goucher 1st
Flanagan 2nd
Begley whatever - 3rd or 4th, 31:43 or 31:50, on the team or off it....
Yeah, that sounds likely.
How clever of you to leave out Salazar's point of Cain falling asleep mid race. As I pointed out -- and you chose to ignore -- Cain running 8s would sharpen her racing skills. What 1500 runners do not also run the 8?
Take whatever you want out of context, simpleton.
Oh--Salazar is so dumb. How could he not see that if Cain runs some 800 her mental attentiveness would improve? She hasn't turned seventeen yet!! Maybe that might explain something about losing focus. Maybe her coach, who not only has met her but trained her, might actually have a better sense of how she might become a world-class athlete. Maybe.
Futures exchange options wrote:
How clever of you to leave out Salazar's point of Cain falling asleep mid race. As I pointed out -- and you chose to ignore -- Cain running 8s would sharpen her racing skills. What 1500 runners do not also run the 8?
Take whatever you want out of context, simpleton.
Montesquieu wrote:
Oh--Salazar is so dumb. How could he not see that if Cain runs some 800 her mental attentiveness would improve? She hasn't turned seventeen yet!! Maybe that might explain something about losing focus. Maybe her coach, who not only has met her but trained her, might actually have a better sense of how she might become a world-class athlete. Maybe.
Oh! I believe Alberto Salazar knows how make somebody a world-class athlete. I'd imagine there aren't too many people out there that know better than he does.
I just realized that the answer to the question "Does this make my a$$ look fat?" Is "No."
Hey Salazar is a tough guy. He must have wrestled Div. I and was NCAA champ. Then he must have gone on to do UFC and train under Gracies for years. We must not know about it. Cause this guy thinks he is a tough guy. He has got a mouth that where I come from...anyone would would lay you out and ground and pound you into the hospital for the rest of your days. Tough guy has been getting away with this for years.Everyone has seen it. One of these days he will mouth off to the wrong guy. I want to see his kicks, back fists, wrestling, triangles, oumas, etc....he must be an amazing tough guy.
Another viewpoint would be that Begley (and boyfriend) didn't have enough confidence to stay with the plan that was set out and ejected during the race. Then after the race, took all the credit for running the qualifying time.
Even 5 years later, they still feel this way even though Salazar coached her to run another 30 seconds faster the following year.
It went down as Begley stated.
Salazar didn't care about her making the team.
At the time Kara and Galen were the protege's to prove he knew what he was doing.
He wanted Kara to beat Shalane who was then coached by a guy who Salazar brought in (Cook) and then left because of disagreements (just like every other coach/affiliated person). So of course he wanted Kara to win at all costs.
Tempest in a teapot.
Do any of you actually work in a real office with other people? Other people will be petty and do jerky things. You will be petty and do jerky things. There is always a certain amount of friction in human relations. It is just inevitable given human nature. You deal with it and try to move on and do your job.
dont know any of them wrote:
Another viewpoint would be that Begley (and boyfriend) didn't have enough confidence to stay with the plan that was set out and ejected during the race. Then after the race, took all the credit for running the qualifying time.
Even 5 years later, they still feel this way even though Salazar coached her to run another 30 seconds faster the following year.
I have no dog in this fight, but I am curious how you figure she could have done this? She made the team by 1.4 seconds. Not third place, but under the "A"-standard by 1.4 seconds.
How does anyone figure that "Salazar's plan" to keep waiting would have yielded a 31:43 or 31:44? Making a move to the front and running the remaining distance as fast as she could, and not worrying about place, she was able to run 31:43.
How would leaving it until later or running a little slower to try to outkick one of the two have served her when she was trying to make the Olympic team?
Ritz was in the same situation this past Summer in the 10k. He had tried to beat the standard (which I think was 27:45) and failed with a 27:50. He went to the trials and he HAD TO run under 27:45.
Late in the race it was Rupp, Teg, Ritz in the front. Derrick also up there, and he had the A-standard (with a 27:33 or something from Stanford). The eventual top-3 separated from the rest and Rupp takes off to win going away.
Salazar coaches BOTH Rupp and Ritz. what if Salazar asked Ritz to sandbag it in the last four laps instead of gunning for the ~27:35 to qualify safely.
Why would anyone accept this? It makes no sense.
in basketball it goes like this: NO NO NO, ahh good shot. If its a game winner there's no negativism. Unless someone is a real bonehead
Yeah, that's just Salazar being a whiny baby. He says Amy's move cost Kara the win? Uuhhhhh, if one little thing like that cost Kara the win, she wouldn't stand a chance at the world level anyway.
I'm surprised we haven't heard from A Duck or pac12fan
washingtonian wrote:
I'm surprised we haven't heard from A Duck or pac12fan
This is the kind of thing that I usually don't want to comment on unless I have had the chance to speak with both parties. I'd be basing an opinion either on partial information, or just speculating.
There is a reason journalists try to interview both parties/sides in these kinds of things.
On the other hand if Alberto was an azz, he should apologize.
But then, I think that about most of the people on this board and their behavior.
J.R. wrote:
whatswhat wrote:The story is Alberto was supposed to tell Amy when to "go" so that she could get the standard.
He didn't really care so he just kept telling Amy and Kara to stay put.
Amy's husband kept asking Alberto if she should go, and lap after lap Alberto said no. Then finally, Amy's husband just yelled at Amy to take off because it was coming down to the wire to go to be able to hit the standard.
There's more to the story too, from what I was told, the treatment Begley talked about continued into the Olympics as there was a kind of deliberate segregation/rivalry created to try and make Kara run faster.
The point of the story is that it shows a glimpse into the culture. Don't make a mistake, this is the culture.
I can't believe Amy let that out.
Thank you for sharing these details.
That is very sad on Salazar's part if that's true.
Salazar tells her to go.
Anyone have a video of the race? Amy gives various accounts of the actual "go" moment, but it seems she took her cue from her husband, not Alberto.
From the press conference right after the race:
"I went by Alberto and my husband, it was hard for me to hear, I could barely hear what they are saying, but the look, especially on my husband’s face, was if you don’t go now and you’re in deep trouble."
From the Flotrack interview two days after the race:
“[Alberto] didn’t let me go until about 9 laps to go, and then he was like, okay go, I guess he had it down to like – I told him it was a little close for me."
From the Cloud259 interview:
“[Alberto] came over and told Andrew (my husband) to tell me not to go. He wanted to control the race. My husband finally got angry and screamed if you don’t go now you aren’t going to make it. That’s when I took the lead.”
--------------
As for this bit...
“Alberto, my coach, told me that because I took the lead and because I made the Olympic team, that I cost Kara the win in that race....And he told me the next day that I shouldn’t have any contact with Kara because I was too much of a distraction and he didn’t want me getting in the way of her losing the 5K.”
Amy didn't just make that up. She credits Alberto with giving her "all the resources she needed to be great" and with a workout that helped her on that final kick. So her relationship with him was complicated. At the end of the Cloud259 interview (transcript at
http://cloud259.com/interview-transcripts/
), she says "it hurt my feelings for a really long time."
The letsrun story on the race at the time said pre-race strategy was every woman for herself (http://www.letsrun.com/2008/10k0628.php).
And for her sake, Kara didn't seem that bothered about not winning the race, as making the Olympics was clearly more important (see 7:45 onwards): “I’m second I got my butt handed to me in the last lap, but who cares!?”
truther wrote:
It went down as Begley stated.
Salazar didn't care about her making the team.
At the time Kara and Galen were the protege's to prove he knew what he was doing.
He wanted Kara to beat Shalane who was then coached by a guy who Salazar brought in (Cook) and then left because of disagreements (just like every other coach/affiliated person). So of course he wanted Kara to win at all costs.
Who's Salazar going to bring in to be Cain's mule so he can prove he knows what he's doing with Mary?