This is F***ing ridiculous, 25 of the top 30 finishers in the Men's XC NCAA Championship were international. Most from Kenya. We need to save the NCAA and limit internationals, limit the ages - and drug test them.
Top Americans:
2nd - Rocky Hansen
7th - Gary Martin
16th - Colin Sahlman
25th - Aiden Smith
28th - Ethan Coleman
I agree with the drug testing and age limits—equally applied to US and non-US citizens. But, I don’t really think the prominence of non-US athletes is why cross country/ distance running isn’t popular or marketable. Distance running in regards to TV viewership in the US has always been much, much less popular than many sports including boring a$ sports like golf FFS. It’s always been this way and has nothing to with foreign athletes dominating the NCAA. That’s a non-sensical correlation, not the cause of the lack of popularity of cross country in regards to viewership.
Someone pointed to the popularity of the NYC marathon citing the fact that there were over 200000 applications to run it. Who has dominated the NYC marathon (i.e. who has overwhelming won the men’s and women’s races—Americans?)? People like to run, they don’t necessarily like to watch running on TV.
As a former collegiate runner who had several Africans on his team and competed with foreign athletes on other teams in the 1990s—I have no issue with foreign participation in collegiate sports. If those foreign athletes happen to win fairly (are not significantly older or using PEDs) then good for them. It’s a competition FFS, stop whining and compete. If you fall short, train harder and/or smarter. Yes, there should be drug testing and rigorous age verification (no exceptions for BYU athletes) but many of the posts in here sound like sour grapes from whinny loosers.
I agree with all of this. But I also think that institutions dependent on u.s. taxpayers (in the form of tax breaks, grant indirects, and so many other sources) should not be allowed to divert their funds toward foreign nationals (in the form of scholarships , payments, etc.) This is an abuse of the collegiate system and does not ultimately benefit the U.S. taxpayer. Fine with foreign nationals coming, as long as there is absolutely no money behind it.
Just for comparison - we are not alone in the running community
"In the 2024-2025 season, there are an estimated 1,838 international athletes playing NCAA Division I basketball (888 men and 950 women). This is a significant increase from previous years, with Europe being the largest contributor, followed by Africa and the Americas. Canada, Spain, and Australia have the highest number of student-athletes in the men's and women's combined categories"
There's a lot that goes on in sport that makes it 'unfair' but i don't think you can blame the individual coaches/international athletes. What are they supposed to do? Not recruit the best talent out of principle just so they can say they have Americans but then risk getting fired because they aren't performing?
It clearly makes it worse to watch when the front of the field is 90% African, but in my mind it's no different to BYU being allowed to have 25 year olds racing because they decide to go travelling for a year to recruit to there cult. The NCAA need to impose age limits and foreigner roster limits so that they don't completely destroy the development of American talent and so that they can actually attract more fans who aren't interested in the sport currently because majority of the people at the front of the race can't speak English and are totally unrelatable.
However, if they don't change the rules, I don't blame coaches for having internationals, I don't blame internationals for coming here, and I don't blame BYU for allowing parents to run. Don't hate the player, hate the game.
As a former collegiate runner who had several Africans on his team and competed with foreign athletes on other teams in the 1990s—I have no issue with foreign participation in collegiate sports. If those foreign athletes happen to win fairly (are not significantly older or using PEDs) then good for them. It’s a competition FFS, stop whining and compete. If you fall short, train harder and/or smarter. Yes, there should be drug testing and rigorous age verification (no exceptions for BYU athletes) but many of the posts in here sound like sour grapes from whinny loosers.
This issue with BYU and age should disappear.
Any athlete at any college can choose to do a 2 year project with their church and return to school.
Since we assume that ncaa coaches and athletes look for every possibility to improve including drugs, it's surprising more athletes do not take advantage of the 2 year gap. Unlike the BYU runners, athletes from other religions could even train during their work.
The only thing that appears to make this unique to BYU, is that the Mormon church organizes a Mission Program, and LDS youths are eager to join.
This is F***ing ridiculous, 25 of the top 30 finishers in the Men's XC NCAA Championship were international. Most from Kenya. We need to save the NCAA and limit internationals, limit the ages - and drug test them.
Top Americans:
2nd - Rocky Hansen
7th - Gary Martin
16th - Colin Sahlman
25th - Aiden Smith
28th - Ethan Coleman
This must be a record. In the past the All-America cut-off went to the point of the 25th American runner. Usually around 40th place. I was All-America the first year that cut-off was put in place -- 39th in 1974. Before that it was 25th place regardless of nationality. 25th was usually around 40th for years after that.
Does anyone have a historical record of All-Americas?
The problem with this thread and similar threads and the coaches is that no one agrees on what the argument is. Some say it is less popular. That is a different argument than drug cheats which is a different argument than age limits which is different than forwign domination.
the starting point should be around the purpose of college and how college sports fits into this. The purpose of any sport that associates with a college is the first contribute to development which college is supposed to do.
the development process is hard and competitive. We should not water down college and college sports to become professional sports. That is a different thing.
so given this while one of the goals in competitive college sports is to win this needs still to fit in the big picture of a college development model. Willing alone is not the purpose of college sports. It is import but not the first thing.
further, the american higher ed system has a priority to develop americans more than foreigners. Foreigners can help develop americans but shouldnt take over the us higher ed system. The priority is americans.
the model should be to have sone foreigners help bring out the best in americans but yet the americans and their development should be priority.
the current system and environment doesnt to this. Colleges should drop xc and all sports where the priorities and actions dont heavily support large scale us develpment.
The NCAA (or the government) is not going to implement a cap on foreigners in collegiate sports. It's not just about cross country - they would need to do it for all sports. No university wants this - it will keep them from finding the best talent for their revenue generating sports.
Age limits has the same issue as above.
Increasing drug testing is the only argument that might get some traction.
This is F***ing ridiculous, 25 of the top 30 finishers in the Men's XC NCAA Championship were international. Most from Kenya. We need to save the NCAA and limit internationals, limit the ages - and drug test them.
Top Americans:
2nd - Rocky Hansen
7th - Gary Martin
16th - Colin Sahlman
25th - Aiden Smith
28th - Ethan Coleman
how is this not ok again??
THIS IS THE REALITY OF TEAM USA IN THE LONG DISTANCE EVENTS. WE ARE NO MATCH TO THE AFRICAN NATIONS IN THIS DISCIPLINE, PERIOD!!
rather than whining, accept the reality that US is living in a fantasy each and every XC season -the winners of these races are literally irrelevant at the world stage- and either 1) we produce our own native population of long distance winners or 2) we keep bringing the best talent in the world to allegedly the "best track&field developmental system in the world". cant have your cake and eat it too.
The NCAA (or the government) is not going to implement a cap on foreigners in collegiate sports. It's not just about cross country - they would need to do it for all sports. No university wants this - it will keep them from finding the best talent for their revenue generating sports.
Age limits has the same issue as above.
Increasing drug testing is the only argument that might get some traction.
This is just reality.
And I think the NCAA should be lobbied to use some media revenue to fund more drug testing. Lots more. In all sports. We should have a huge push to normalize clean athletes.
I agree with Ed Eyestone, this has gotten out of hand. We need to develop our own. Let the other nations develop theirs! Too many American kids dont get the next level of coaching. Why are we so hell bent in bringing in talent from3rd world countries. We have it here!
Honestly, this is a better showing by Americans than I thought! Especially with 2nd and 7th. I think the age stuff is ridiculous and taking away opportunities from US high schoolers is tough, but the silver lining is that this competition has no doubt made the top end of American distance runners better. I'm still unsure where I stand though on changes that should be made beyond at least age limits
This is an obscenely idiotic statement. How is Habtom sitting and kicking on Rocky helping him get better?
Here are the lap leaders from the NCAA 5k outdoors in 2025:
SplitIntermediate LeaderTimeFastest SplitTime200m Drew BOSLEY 30.62 Drew BOSLEY 30.62 600m Valentin SOCA 1:38.38 Valentin SOCA 1:06.85 1000m Luke GRUNDVIG 2:48.96 Luke GRUNDVIG 1:08.86 1400m Rocky HANSEN 3:59.33 JoJo JOURDON 1:09.87 1800m Rocky HANSEN 5:03.28 Ernest CHERUIYOT 1:03.17 2200m Rocky HANSEN 6:07.29 Valentin SOCA 1:03.38 2600m Rocky HANSEN 7:12.06 Habtom SAMUEL 1:03.94 3000m Rocky HANSEN 8:15.82 Robin KWEMOI 1:03.09 3400m Rocky HANSEN 9:18.63 Valentin SOCA 1:02.57 3800m Rocky HANSEN 10:21.45 Robin KWEMOI 1:02.21 4200m Matt STRANGIO 11:24.44 Valentin SOCA 1:02.74 4600m Brian MUSAU 12:24.82 Brian MUSAU 59.96 5000m Brian MUSAU 13:20.59 Brian MUSAU 55.77
So you expected people to watch American distance running when it was at an all time low?
I don’t expect a notable amount of people to ever watch ncaa xc.
Until we allow the rightful heirs to the throne in.....the trans. I will boycott XC until boys can rightfully show the girls they have no business running